Ferrari confirms departure from FOTA

2011 F1 season

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Felipe Massa, Fernando Alonso, Ferrari, Shanghai, 2011

Ferrari has confirmed it has left the Formula 1 Teams’ Association.

With Red Bull also rumoured to be leaving and HRT having departed in January, it potentially leaves the teams’ organisation representing just nine of the 12 outfits in F1.

Ferrari said “FOTA’s drive has run its course”. It claimed it would continue to try to make the Resource Restriction Agreement “more effective and efficient” but added: “We must return to a situation where Formula 1 is really a test bed for advanced technological research, the results of which can be transferred to Granturismo cars.”

Ferrari issued the following statement: “Ferrari has informed FOTA President Martin Whitmarsh that it is leaving the organisation made up of the teams competing in the Formula 1 World Championship.

“It was a difficult decision and a great deal of thought went into it. It was taken reluctantly after analysing the current situation and the stalemate when it came to debate on some issues that were at the core of why the association was formed, indeed with Ferrari and Luca di Montezemolo as the main instigator and promoter of ideas. It’s not by chance that the President of the Maranello company held that same position and job title within FOTA up to the end of 2009.

“Some of the major achievements of the association during these years, also worked out in conjunction with the FIA, centred around cost reduction, which was of significant benefit to everyone, the big teams and the small ones.

“Ferrari was on the front line in this area, even before the birth of FOTA and it intends to continue down this route to ensure the sustainability of the sport in the long term. Now however, it is necessary to find some new impetus to move it along because FOTA’s drive has run its course, despite the excellent work of current President, Martin Whitmarsh in trying to reach agreement between the various positions for the common good.

“Ferrari will continue to work with the other teams to make the current RRA, Resource Restriction Agreement, aimed at controlling costs, more effective and efficient, modifying it to make it more stringent in key areas such as aerodynamics, to rebalance some aspects such as testing and to expand it to areas currently not covered such as engines.

“Formula 1, like the rest of the world in fact, is currently going through a delicate period. Ferrari wants to work with all parties for the future of a sport that expresses the highest level of motor sport technology.

“We must return to a situation where Formula 1 is really a test bed for advanced technological research, the results of which can be transferred to Granturismo cars. In addition, we must not forget that this sport must become more user friendly and more accessible to the general public and furthermore, it cannot be the only professional sport where it is practically impossible to do any training: the number of days of testing must be increased so that the drivers, especially the young ones who lack experience and the teams, can be adequately prepared, as well as providing more opportunities for them to come into contact with spectators and sponsors.”

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Keith Collantine
Lifelong motor sport fan Keith set up RaceFans in 2005 - when it was originally called F1 Fanatic. Having previously worked as a motoring...

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147 comments on “Ferrari confirms departure from FOTA”

  1. What the hell is going on? and is really Red Bull either?

    1. Yay!!!!! Oh the drama… F1 is like a never ending novel…

    2. Ferrari are not against the RRA, as they said they are still committed to it.

      They just want more testing so they can be innovative and their drivers can practice & improve.

      1. Oddly enough, other teams seem to be able to manage innovation and practice with the exact same opportunities.

        1. Then why have Red Bull resigned from FOTA just now too?

  2. ooooooooooh, here we go again!.

    It’ll make an interesting winter…

    1. Haha, I’m worried about the dispute but yeah, surely winter would be interesting!

      1. @Ferno.65 @Eggry Yeah I thought that 108 days between the Australian GP will be boring well now it’s won’t.

        1. at least we will have controversy in december :P.

          1. Early Christmas Present! :D

          2. @eggry the Xmas present was Kimi’s return, this is more like “how the Grinch stole Xmas” really!

          3. Haha, Yeah, Grinch…:)

  3. I had to laugh at this in Ferrari’s statement:

    this sport must become more user friendly and more accessible to the general public

    This from the only team that is too scared to allow its drivers on Twitter.

    1. There are lot of general public people outside twitter..(also i am not sure whether ferrari is really stopping their drivers from twitter) probably ferrari meant cheaper tickets at race circuits & trying to get fans more close to cars & f1 people.

      1. I’d certainly take cheaper tickets over some drivel about what they had for breakfast :P

        1. Well said @george ! :D

      2. i am not sure whether ferrari is really stopping their drivers from twitter

        They’ve said they are.

    2. Maybe Prost made Ferrari fears their driver’s opinion I guess :D

    3. Keith what is the worst case scenario? if fota breaks down no concord agreement reached by march. What happens then? they race 2012 under the old agreement or?

      1. Last time something like this happened they reverted to the 1998 concord agreement I think.

        However, this sounds more serious.

        1. Reportedly, Red Bull have indeed left as well.

          1. Much more serious by the sounds of it. I reckon a large part of this is mercedes having 5 technical cheifs. The moment that was announced both redbull and ferrari got pretty snotty about it. I don’t see anything wrong with that, ferrari probably spends close to half a billion per year. Redbull at least 200 million so i don’t see anything wrong with having more tech staff at merc. Considering they are probably the “cheapest” run big team if that is the case then some other teams really need to grow up.

    4. Great point Keith, I asked InsideFerrari a week or two ago about Twitter and they said no, so this very much contradicts the “public accessibility” of F1.

      1. If Ferrari don’t already have a motto they should adopt this one: “Do as we say, not as we do”

        1. @ajokay, better: “do as we say, so we can take advantage of it”

    5. Keith you have it the wrong way around. The other teams FORCE their drivers to use Twitter. Ferrari dont.

      1. @infy

        The other teams FORCE their drivers to use Twitter.

        Oh I am looking forward to seeing the proof for this one…

      2. You obviously don’t follow @aussiegrit who never talks about his team and focuses on his personal life with insights into his career. Good luck proving your statement

    6. I think it’s safe to say, Ferrari is looking after Ferrari.

    7. What if the drivers just dont want to be on twitter. I remember alonso saying in an interview this year that he doesnt want twitter because if he wants to contact anybody or his friends he can jus give them a call. Im sure others have read this and if so maybe they know the source. Not sure about massa but i know for sure that alonso prefers the quite more private life.

      1. Well, I’m sure he wouldn’t say “I don’t use Twitter because my bosses don’t allow me to”. So I wouldn’t take his statement as necessarily true.

        1. So, you’d take his statement as probably a lie then? Great attitude.

          1. @dvc

            Why? It’s not as if the two are mutually exclusive.

          2. @Keith Collantine: I just think it is poor form to assume that someone is lying without hard evidence to the contrary. @lopes indicates that that we shouldn’t take Alonso’s statement at face value. This is against my philosophy unless there is a contradiction between statements, form on behalf of the individual, or evidence that we shouldn’t.

          3. @dvc You don’t seem to have understood my point.

            Ferrari don’t let Alonso use Twitter. Alonso has said he wouldn’t use Twitter.

            These two facts are not mutually exclusive. Both can be true. Alonso isn’t necessarily lying.

          4. @Keith Collantine: I understood your point, but you’ve missed mine. I realise that Alonso may not want to use Twitter AND that Ferrari may not want him to use it. My objection was to doles “So I wouldn’t take his statement as necessarily true.” doles is making the case that if Ferrari don’t want its drivers using twitter Alonso is probably making something up to cover for them. I see that as needlessly distrustful.

    8. Who said they are scared?Maybe they don’t want to

      And since when does accessible only mean twitter?

    9. Vitantonio Liuzzi doesn’t have Twitter either, but I don’t think HRT are forcing him not to. In Italy Twitter is much less popular than in Britain, for example the Rapax and Coloni teams from GP2 aren’t on there either. Ferrari have their Twitter account, and whether Massa and Alonso want to have one can’t be known. Perhaps they are the ones who don’t want one. Anyway I think Ferrari are too obsessed by the fear their drivers might say things against them, when Alonso clearly wouldn’t and neither would Massa as he always obeys.

    10. i don’t think it’s so important to have a twitter account, after all. as fixy says, twitter has just a 1000th of facebook’s popularity in Italy (and maybe also in Alonso’s homeland). and traditional media usually pay attention to every rant of Alonso or Massa to get the ‘scoop’.

    11. sid_prasher (@)
      2nd December 2011, 18:53

      Keith twitter account is not that important…they both have their websites and maybe facebook pages.

      Anyways these are controlled by PR teams anyways…

      1. @sid_prasher Indeed, not having a Twitter account is not the end of the world. However, it’s what it implies that’s important. Social media is huge, really huge. The sport is already miles behind the internet revolution.

        1. sid_prasher (@)
          2nd December 2011, 20:43

          @AndrewTanner: I feel presence on the social media is all a branding exercise.
          The kind of media scrutiny these guys are subjected to, I doubt if they have any chance of being spontaneous on these forums – definitely tough to do on a regular basis.
          Besides maybe they do have facebook pages which is bigger than twitter.
          Of course if these guys had a twitter handle I will subscribe :) but I will read everything they put up there with a lot of skepticism.

          1. @sid_prasher Oh yea, obviously it’s all about PR. But just because something might have an alternative agenda doesn’t mean that they shouldn’t join it. It’s all about perception. I’d rather Ferrari have some terrible PR from their drivers than nothing at all.

      2. @sid_prasher Having followed all the drivers that are on Twitter for pretty much as long as they’ve been on there it seems to me a minority use third parties to post either some or all of their messages.

        Let’s be clear – I’m not saying Twitter is at the moment a pre-requisite for teams, despite the majority of drivers and all the teams having accounts.

        But when we have one team who have admitted publicly they won’t let their drivers use Twitter and then presume to lecture everyone else on making the sport more accessible, that is a blatant hypocrisy.

        1. I have a feeling the statement and particularly the term ‘general public’ has been taken slightly out of context, not completely the fault of the reader, but also the writer. Looking at the bigger picture, in terms of promoting F1 through increased testing (let’s face it, that’s what they’re trying to pull off here), it’s more so potential sponsors that are hurt. I remember watching the Ferrari Shell fuel test with Alonso, and thinking, the testing ban significantly hurts these companies aswell, as they’ve got limited time and resources to work with these big teams and premium technology. So think of it in terms of tyre manufacturing, oil and fuel companies, software development and technology innovation. Meaningless debates about social media aside (Seriously, who gives a flip about Lewis Hamilton’s ‘gangsta’ tweets and reaching out to his homies?), the general public won’t react to F1 if it’s no longer the pinnacle of motoring technology.

        2. Why? Ferrari is probably the team that produces the most merchandise and organise/sponsor the most events for the public to attend (ferrari days, ferrari world, ferrari stores and even children summer camps in maranello) of course there is a commercial benefit, it is not charity, but he idea is to make an exclusive brand more accessible. So no twitter is really a detail. They probably want to avoid useless rumors and stories as their team generates a lot of talk and fantasy. Look what happen several times with hamilton and sutil on several occasions when the team PR had to release apologies.

          1. @Pi Totally agree with your point. Twitter is definitely just one of those things..but its one of those things that can also cause a lot of unwanted rubbish and rumours etc..look at lewis and all the nonsense that some of his tweets have caused and only for him to retract his statement a short while after probaly due to maccas PR department. (I have sympathy for lewis in this instance because he is an individual and should be able to express himself how ever he feels he should. But due to the fact that every move n thing said by the drivers are monitored by the public at large, these little harmless tweets could potentially cause a lot of negativity) my point is that although twitter might be a lovely way for a fan to get closer to a driver it could also equally as much cause a lot of nonsense, so if the best way of avoiding this nonsense is to stay of twitter so be it.

            With regards to ferrari making f1 more accessible to the public, I think along with red bull they are doing a fantastic job. Here in south africa we have one of ferraris f1 simulators open to the public everyday of the week in umhlanga rocks, aswell as super car days n runs by ferrari and international bank vaults on gp weekends so kids can get more involved in ferrari and f1. 3 years ago I met felipe massa at kylami at a shell ferrari event open to the public. I don’t know about other countries but in south africa more than any other f1 team ferrari goes to the greatest lengths to promote f1.

        3. sid_prasher (@)
          3rd December 2011, 12:23

          Ah, I didn’t realize they have explicitly asked their drivers to stay away from it…weird decision!

  4. One great news we had in 2012 ( Kimi) now followed by this disappointing news.They are two of the big teams,if the team among them have trouble then F1 won’t go any far in this world.

  5. Oh no this isn’t great news.. I wonder who will follow in suit if 2 of the major teams are pulling out!! All the news so far was so positive

    1. Wanna bet on Mercedes or Lotus… Lotus is gonna need xtra money to desing a new car for Kimi, and Mercedes wants to win so they have to spend money.

      Maybe Toro Rosso, following RBR, and with the new sponsor I bet the want to be free to spend more money…

      Bernie most be eating popcorn with Cahmpagne watching all this…

      1. unlikely merc will pull out the rra would give them a massive advantage if the other top teams actually followed it.

  6. It’s a pity F1 is such a closed world that even informed fans such as ourselves have no clue what’s going on in these matters (of course, excepting anyone able to shed some light on this). I have listened to Dominicali and Horner in Korea, but it never became clear to me what exactly they wanted that others didn’t.

  7. Bernie must be happy with this early Christmas present from Ferrari and Red Bull.

    1. My thoughts exactly. Divide and conquer, Mr E. Divide and conquer.

  8. Bernie must be rubbing his hands together with glee. When is the Concorde Agreement up for renewal again? :)

    1. A cynic would suggest that Bernie has managed to “entice” them to leave prior to a new agreement, like he did when Ferrari got their “bonus payments” and technical veto before. Hands up who hopes McLaren and Mercedes have a two horse race next year with Ferrari miles behind?

      1. Well thats just silly. Who doesnt want Alonso fighting for wins?

        1. Why does it have to be Alonso? I don’t care who is fighting for wins as long as it’s more than one driver. Who those two drivers are, it doesn’t matter

      2. +1, yes I would love to see McLaren and Mercedes in two horse race, with Lotus of Raikkonen getting in the mix at times :D
        would be bad to not seeing Alonso really capable of challenging for wins, but it will good to teach Ferrari and Red Bull a lesson or two for being arrogant

      3. We don’t even know a fraction of the full story here, and yet you and @natkid seem to be of the opinion that Ferrari and possibly Red Bull are “arrogant” and should be punished?
        It’s possible that FOTA has actually become a spent force and is incapable of effecting change or progress. This would indeed be sad if it were true, but the EU is currently facing a crisis over its future and that is an organisation far more complex and extensive than FOTA. If it can happen to them, why not FOTA?

        Either way I don’t see your desire to have Ferrari be “miles behind” as anyway logical.

      4. This is really funny. You are hoping they will be miles behind, but will be 2 seconds ahead of everyone next year because they will ignore the RRA.

  9. Why is Bernie always right? He has predicted that FOTA will not stand that test of time and he seems to be right. Anyway, I agree with what Ferrari said in the last paragraph. Cost cutting measures have made the sport somewhat sterile when it comes to ground breaking technology. However, it has also permitted teams like Sauber, Williams and HRT to remain in the sport.

    That point brings this thought to my mind. Could Ferrari have decided to withdraw from FOTA with the intention intention to increase costs again, forcing teams like Sauber, Lotus, Marussia etc.. to leave from F1? The decreased number of cars would then sweep the way for what they have been pushing for for quite some time: having three cars of the same team. (ie 3 Ferraris, 3 McLarens) I know what I am saying is a form of conspiracy theory, but reading between the lines and putting together what they have been saying these last two years, I am sensing this is what they really want.

    1. for sure Ferrari want to make regulations more friendly to them such as more strict aerodynamics(to reduce its importance) and allowing engine development. I don’t know this would increase total cost because I think aerodynamics is one of the most greedy parts of engineering. Engine is also highly depend on money though…

      1. Engined cost a lot. They make aero look like small fry.

        1. Engine cost can be restricted easily than aerodynamics because it has far less factors.

          1. Which is the opposite of what Ferrari wants?

            We are going in circles.

          2. I mean aerodynamics is still very expensive even if there are much heavier restriction than now while engine expense is easily controlled.

            One of main problems of today’s F1 budget is there’s virtually no alternative to aerodynamics because engine development which is only rival to aerodynamics is forbidden.

            of course I think Ferrari want unlimited development of engine but Ferrari would prefer restricted engine(not frozen like now) rather than restricted aerodynamics. That’s what I’m talking about.

    2. Well, you are absolutely right. They signed Fernando Alonso till 2016 and perhaps, this is a culmination of pressure coming in from various directions. They have to deliver a strong racing car. This will seriously negate the reasons why Fernando decided to join Ferrari. Since Schumi burned the bridges with Luca Di Montezemolo, they are all pretty pumped to topple his record wins. Under the current agreement, they won’t be in a position to consistently deliver championship winning car 4 or 5 years in a row.

      Also, Luca Di Montezemolo is known for issuing threats and making bold statements. I guess they timed this announcement well. If FOTA agrees to initiate a new discussion over the winter, Ferrari will request increased spending every year, so that they can achieve greater efficiency in terms of R&D and funnel innovations to their road cars. Good examples of this innovation are Ferrari ENZO and FXX. Back in the 2000’s, they spent close to $150M every year for their F1 project and they got back everything in the form of prize money & sponsorship.

      1. personally out of ferraris pocket 150 mill maybe but in total a HECK of alot more.

    3. Why is Bernie always right?

      There is a say in my country that goes: “Más sabe el diablo por viejo que por diablo” that means that Bernie has been around enough to know how things are gonna develop

      1. My guess was going to be “beware the grey devil”

        1. Something like that :D

    4. Berny isnt right.. I wouldn’t call his words as prediction, but rather HIM SAYING WHAT HE WANTS TO SEE HAPPEN and then (I believe) he use his underhand tactics to make it happen

  10. I don’t think I understand what this actually means.

    2 teams have left a collaboration of teams that isn’t mandatory to be a part of to compete, so any rules or agreements that the collaboration of teams come up with have no weight behind them.

    Kinda amounts to not very much.

    1. It amounts to a lot. FOTA was created to force Bernie to talk to teams as a single cohesive unit. He would’ve needed to make a deal that would make ALL teams happy. Without it, Bernie can make deals with individual teams and force the rest to live with what he gives them or pack up and leave.

      1. Indeed @journeyer, if FOTA falls apart (it might still be hard balls negotiation by both Ferrari and Red Bull to put weight behind their points in the RRA negotiations), Bernie will have an easy job of giving Ferrari the big stash again, Red Bull a nice amount and have the others scrambling for the rest of the spill.

        I guess we should keep a close tab on what Williams do, as they would probably be the next to bail out after these two (cash strapped historical name who is has done things “differently” in the past as well, see discussions on KERS in 2010).

        1. Well, there’s a nice rosey future for F1. I hope the Ferrari and Red Bull fans enjoy watching a field of 6 cars (3 of each) racing around Asian oil fields.

          I’ll go watch a cheaper, more transparent and more interesting form of Motorsport.

          1. and the real racing might even be shown on a FTA channel, or stream on the internet to get to the audience!

    2. “… any rules …..have no weight behind them.”

      Exactly, they are not bound by FOTA agreements. Kinda amounts to a lot.

    3. I wouldn’t underestimate the role that FOTA played when they proposed a split from the FIA to form their own series in 2009.

      Ok it didn’t happen but it certainly helped to have one voice from which to conduct in debate, even if there were nothing binding any agreement. Pressure of the group can sometimes be quite powerful.

      This most certainly means that situations where one team act to the detriment of all others (eg. the Monaco HRT off-throttle blown diffuser appeal) are more likely to occur.

  11. Fota Finish

    1. Maybe not? Williams and Force India was kicked out late 2009 or early 2010 due to FIA’s 2-tier cap controversy and then recovered their positions.

    2. I think the same. Without HRT who cares, but without the current champions and the most succesfull team ever, it looses significant power.

      1. sid_prasher (@)
        2nd December 2011, 18:40

        I feel all this will make rule changes more difficult – kinda status quo!

  12. Bernie must be rubbing his hands, two of the top teams leaving FOTA means he doesn’t have to deal with all those pesky teams at the same time.

  13. So does this mean that Ferrari are allowed to spend how much they like or is there another contract that says they cannot? I find it shocking that Ferrari have to always push to get there way, granted they have reasons but many teams might want what they want but still carry on with the group? The sport has become mundane because of cutting costs and therefore making sacrifices about costs but in this economic climate, you cannot have two teams that have a bottomless pit of money whilst teams will have to sell there drivers as male prostitutes just to get some fuel for the race.

    1. Well, yes, if they were to be rather unpolite.

      This could mean the end of the RRA.

      1. Ferrari are not against the RRA (they said they are still committed to it, if you read).

        They want more testing.

        1. More testing is against the RRA though…

          1. sid_prasher (@)
            2nd December 2011, 18:45

            Need not be – a year long KM limit will allow in season testing without increasing costs!

    2. The sport has become mundane because of cutting costs

      How so?

    3. Redbull has done the same thing.Stop pointing out just one team

      1. Read the headline. I’m sure we’ll get another article on Red Bull soon don’t worry.

    4. It seems that the RRA is a contract between the teams that runs until 2017! That would mean its still binding to both of them.
      But who knows how that might pan out.

  14. Red Bull Racing also confirms FOTA exit

    Red Bull’s confirmation comes moments after Ferrari had also said it was leaving the teams’ organisation.

    “Red Bull Racing can confirm it has served notice to withdraw from FOTA (Formula One Teams’ Association),” said Red Bull in a statement.

    “The team will remain committed to finding a solution regarding cost saving in Formula 1.”

    1. Kill confirmed

      1. At this point FOTA has become the equivalent of the League of Nations. It has not use as the teams or countries that matter don’t participate. It never really did have enforcement powers but that’s another matter.

        1. “not” should be “no.”

    2. This must be some Ferrari-Red Bull alliance against FOTA!

      1. @Fixy entry conspiracy theories on cue… this is awesome!!!!!!!!

      2. Now I see!

        They are finally trying to destroy Mclaren(or even Mercedes?) once and for all! and then one of two who survive from 1:1(12:12?) deathmatch will rule the sport! All red cars or blue cars on the grid! Finally F1 can be fair!

        Well, That’s my guess :P

        1. mclaren have an unfair advantage with lewis behind the wheel. :P

          1. Celebrity Deathmatch!!!!!!!! Go!!!!!!

      3. Rather Ferrari and Red Bull going for their own interests independently.

        But lets wait and see how it all pans out.

  15. I guess Ferrari have run out of ideas on how to beat Red Bull and McLaren – so it’s back to the “throw more money at it” scenario – not that I’m saying RB and McLaren won’t do the same, but it seems playing fair is no longer what Ferrari believes in – but then, what am I thinking to believe that Ferrari wanted to play fair in the first place!?

    1. exactly, just like the last time when the new Concorde was due.. Ferrari was seen as the leading force behind the teams’ threat to form WMCGP and suddenly Ferrari became the first team to sign the new Concorde.. I seriously hope they end up in midfield next season

    2. As sad as it is but that’s Ferrari…

  16. Guys and gals here is the answer:


    Obviously Ferrari and Red Bull want to overspend the current RRA and other teams dont agree with this, so they have pulled a Cartman from Southpark “Screw you guys, I’m going home.”

    1. But they say they’re committed to the RRA. The press release specifically states this is about testing. I think the rules on in season testing do need to be relaxed a bit, i mean when do the test and reserve drivers actually get a chance to test the cars? Why not give over the summer ‘break’ to another young drivers test at least?

      1. Preaching to the choir here. I want testing back 100%, I want live streams and timing data from testing from teams as a quasi-publicized thing. OR testing events tacked onto a GP weekend. Sure Ferrari was dominant during the unlimited testing days, but there were alot of other factors which contributed to their success.

      2. Right, they don’t want to spend more money—just use their own private tracks to test at all times. What, no one else has private test tracks? And no one else can build one because of the RRA or fund expensive winter trips to sunny test locales? What a terrible misfortune for eveyone who is not Ferrari. It’s a typically cynical ploy. It looks like they will get away with it. It’s bad enough they get a lion’s share of the sport’s earnings just for being their awesome selves, now they want to pick off of other peoples plates as well.

    2. @d3v0 Thank you for giving me a chance to post this video:

      …so they have pulled a Cartman from Southpark “Screw you guys, I’m going home.”

      But jokes apart, RBR is still saying that they want to reach and agreement on the RRA subject… but looking back on the year I think the first signs that RBR wasn´t happy with the FOTA was from this interview:

      Q: Bernie, we’ve seen a lot of changes going on in the teams’ association. What do you think about that ‘club’ of which Red Bull is a member?
      BE: I try not to think of them.
      CH: I also don’t spend too much time thinking in that direction.

      Q: But then why does it exist?
      BE: It is an unnecessary association of people who should put their sole emphasis on getting competitive cars on the grid. It’s just more of what they don’t have to think of. I look after that so there are enough financial resources.

  17. I predicted this when FOTA was 1st formed.

    Its like CART, All the teams want different things & they usually struggle to agree on these things which ultimately makes it almost impossible for them to actually co-exist as one cohesive unit.

    Its also why the teams actually running the series would be such a bad idea, CART showed us that doesn’t work & this is just another example.

  18. I was going to write something about this move from Ferrari and Red Bull, but I won’t. The only thing that I have to say is that this is not going to end up well… and F1 will suffer from this.

  19. Sounds to me like Red Bull/Ferrari have both positioned themselves nicely for bigger share of the pot. Disgraceful.

  20. At leasst, Withmarsh can now focus on getting Mclaren to perform if FOTA dies.

  21. Ah the two teams I dislike the most leaving. Good riddance.

  22. So that is the death of FOTA then, not having HRT as a member is one thing but not having Ferrari or Red Bull is quite another.

    This will be good news for Ecclestone, he always said it wouldn’t last and he was right.

    The teams may be able to come together and work as one for a short period of time but inevitably when that threat passes disagreements become too much and they go their separate ways again.

  23. Maybe they play à game: breakawaygame. In this case to gét what they want from FOTA and also to lure Bernie into thinking he’s won.

  24. I had forgotten that HRT withdrew from FOTA earlier this year.

    What was their reasoning?

    1. They couldn´t pay a couta…

  25. Idiots. It’s sensible to have a union or collaboration of some sort in any field, especially one as commercial as F1 where money drives decisions rather than common sense or practicality. A unity of teams helped prevent ridiculous regulations coming into F1 during 2009, and I’m sure there will be a time when the teams need to be together again. Not having the common ground of FOTA will also make the teams more bitter towards one another- see the Ferrari, McLaren spat of previous years, which seems to have cooled considerably in recent years.

  26. both teams know that to win they will need to spend more……FOTA must be causing headaches for RB and Ferrari to spend (putting more restrictions by rules/checks), Ferrari visibly disappointed since 2-3 years and RB in news for flouting existing RRA limits.

    hence they want out of this. statements from both teams on commitment to RRA is all BS.

  27. We must return to a situation where Formula 1 is really a test bed for advanced technological research, the results of which can be transferred to Granturismo cars.

    Then enter/start a series for Granturismo cars and use that for a test bed then.

    F1 should only ever be about one thing: F1. What that is will always be debated (purity v entertainment), but it certainly shouldn’t be for gizmos for Ferrari to stick in the cars they sell for profit. If there’s compatibility, great, if not, oh well.

    1. @icthyes Touring cars is exactly what all the teams want to push at the moment. Clearly now is a great time to invest into the unknown.

      Clearly, they’re a bit deluded and yet again have reason to believe they ARE Formula 1.

    2. They want F1 to be a test bed so they can transfer technology to a Playstation game?

    3. We must return to a situation where Formula 1 is really a test bed for advanced technological research

      F1 was never meant to be this anyway. If technology trickles down to general use, great. If not, it doesn’t matter. I understand that manufacturers want ‘road-relevance,’ but the reasons for them being involved in the good old days was the glory of winning and brand awareness. Yes it makes sense that inevitably there will be technologies they can develop and then put into road cars, but the rules shouldn’t really have to accommodate this, and certainly shouldn’t have to forcibly cater for it.

  28. Pretty shocked by this. I get Ferrari’s angle but not RBR’s. I really doubt it’s just down to money for RBR. They clearly have the brains.

  29. This is simply about teams not sticking to the Resource restriction Agreement and using creative ways to spend more money. It’s posturing on their and Red Bulls part, expect to see harmony restored by March.

  30. modifying it to make it more stringent in key areas such as aerodynamics, to rebalance some aspects such as testing and to expand it to areas currently not covered such as engines

    You mean, make the RRA much stricter in the area where Ferrari have been poor the last few seasons, increase the ability to spend in the area where Ferrari has had major success in the past, and do some limiting in an area where Mercedes has them covered, and Renault is catching.

    Yeah, I’m sure they’re thinking about the good of F1. But I forget, as far as Ferrari are concerned, they are F1, so they probably think they are thinking about the good of F1.

  31. “Ferrari wants to work with all parties for the future of a sport that expresses the highest level of motor sport technology.”

    This reads suspiciously like “we have money and we want to spend it, but the other teams won’t let us”.

    I can’t see FOTA lasting much longer. Red Bull and Ferrari will not be bound by the RRA anymore, and the only way the other teams will be able to compete with that is to discontinue the RRA altogether. FOTA will have little reason to exist after that.

    Maybe Hispania were right when they said that they felt FOTA only served the interests of the top teams.

    1. James Allen seems to believe that the current RRA is legally binding through 2017 so Non-FOTA teams still coudn’t suddenly start spending more:

      There is a lack of trust within FOTA which has spurred this decision, but it’s important to remember that the RRA is a legally binding agreement which runs to 2017, so it is not as if Ferrari and Red Bull will be able to spend £100 million a year more. Meanwhile the testing agreement also involves the FIA, so this won’t change overnight.

      1. On the last sentance, Jean Todt has said he’d like limited testing to return so its likely this will happen even without FOTA.

      2. We all know the teams will find ways of spending money without appearing to do so.

  32. Meh i dont care. I want all F1 races to be on free tv.

  33. What has bernie offered them under the tabel?

  34. perhaps ferrari aren’t happy with the re-introduction of team orders which knocked alonso from 3rd to 4th in the driver championship in Brazil

    how fitting that the team who’s cheeting in 2010 that led to this rediculous re-introduction in the first place is the only team to suffer from it.

    personally I think this is no more than the typical posturing we have come to expect from ferrari, I pitty because I really thought they had grown up this year, especially after their bizar decision post silverstone to allow EBD’s

    what I don’t understand is how exacty do ferrari want to limit aero in F1? perhaps run homogonised bodywork built by just 1 supplier (Mclaren applied technologies)

    still it really comes as no surprise I guess…after all, what should you expect from people from a country that changes its president like others change their socks

    what suprises me is RBR, what a strange statement, what on earth is their stance all about?

    1. re-introduction of team orders which knocked alonso from 3rd to 4th in the driver championship in Brazil

      Prove it.

      On a related note:

      Red Bull: Gearbox glitch hands win to Webber
      Was Vettel’s ‘gearbox problem’ team orders in disguise?

  35. F1 is accessible to the masses…masses of very rich people with net worth measured in hundred of millions of dollars. To get an autograph in this sport the kid must have an inheritance lined up. The drivers, by now, believe they are the prima donnas.
    Ferrari is right to say F1 should be test bed for granturismo cars.
    Where does the technology from a Red Bull goes.Nowhere.They sell sugary drinks.

    1. kenneth Ntulume
      4th December 2011, 11:01

      You must be a Ferrari owner!

  36. I feel that two reasons are at play for this Ferrari decision:

    1) Ferrari feel they can get competitive advantage in engine dev, testing with their own track, and generally with bigger spending. Equally they want to reduce aero as they don’t feel that’s a strength

    2) Ferrari have seen their road car business come under increasing pressure from McLaren and expect that to get worse, and have probably been surprised by how storng the 12C is compared to the 458. As a result they want F1 to become a more effective conveyor belt of technology for that side of the business

    As for Red Bull, I guess they were overspending and didn’t want closer scrutiny.

    1. Ferrari have seen their road car business come under increasing pressure from McLaren

      McLaren have barely even begun selling the MP4-12C yet, I think it’s much too early to talk of Ferrari coming under pressure from them in this respect.

      1. totally agree with you Keith but i think the main reason why should people think that ferrari have seen their road car come under pressure from mclaren is that Top Gear Episode that suggest that the Mclaren MP4-12C (which was developed in top gear test track)is a better car than the ferrari 458
        i have watched the opposite of that in Fifth Gear

    2. @Badger74
      on what pressure are you are talking about when 2010 was the most profitable year of ferrari’s history

      do not compare the incomparable

  37. kenneth Ntulume
    4th December 2011, 10:58

    Decisions like these, more often have to made by businesses in protection of there advantage or edge, Ferrari haven’t taken lightly how they have been out competed these past seasons, to be superior, dominating and winning races fairly or not in f1 is key to the ferrari brand equity. Ferrari parting ways with FOTA is one of the many moves they are making to get the ability to gain an advantage again to dominate f1, if Ferrari get out raced in F1 in the coming seasons, i can assure u they will leave f1. If F1 is not showcasing the Ferrari brand superiority, they will duck from it.

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