Hamilton: “The dude didn’t even say sorry”

F1 Fanatic round-up

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In the round-up: Lewis Hamilton criticises Nico Hulkenberg after his last race for McLaren was ended by the Force India driver.


Top F1 links from the past 24 hours:

Lewis Hamilton denied McLaren farewell win by Nico Hulkenburg crash (The Guardian)

“The dude didn’t even come and say sorry and that says a lot. That’s what happens when you race with a less experienced driver.”

Defeated Alonso hails best season yet (Autosport)

“The championship was not lost here. The championship was lost when [Romain] Grosjean flew over my head [at Spa] or when Vettel surprisingly only got a reprimand after qualifying in Japan.”

Brazilian GP – Conference 4 (FIA)

“It was one of the toughest races I’ve had. It was very tricky. It was on that point many times when you think Inters is the right tyre. I kept asking the team ‘what’s going to happen with the weather: it’s supposed to be light showers?’ Well OK, we’ll see how we go but it was so, so difficult. You’re locking up tyres here and there but you’ve just got to push to the limit. You have to wait for the team to give you the information about all the other people on [intermediates] so it’s not just about driving the car at that point.”

Sebastian Vettel Transcript (FIA)

“Since the start of the season, we were fighting with the car, the car wasn’t similar to last year’s, I couldn’t… it’s difficult for you to understand, but I couldn’t use my tricks or my style to make it work and manipulate the car the way I liked. I didn’t have enough rear stability mostly to work with the brakes and get the car into the corners, to the apex, the way I like. We tried everything and I think at some stage, we just did a step that was big enough and in the right direction that allowed me to do more of what I like, so naturally it came in our direction.”

‘Vettel’s move was legal’ (Sky)

Martin Brundle: “I’ve spoken to Gary Connolly, one of the race stewards, and he has absolutely confirmed that they were red-and-yellow boards – didn’t look much like that from the somewhat grainy and rainy yellow on-board footage, did it?”

All sevens for Schumacher on F1 farewell (Reuters)

“I enjoyed most of it. It wasn’t as successful as we wanted it to be but still I learned a lot for life and I’m quite glad for the good emotions again. Now is a good time to go…”

2013 Starts now (Toro Rosso)

“We know we have made significant progress in the second part of the year and along with changes in terms of our infrastructure and how the team is run, we can be optimistic about 2013.”


Comment of the day

I think @RyanWilliams captured the spirit of F1 Fanatic brilliantly with this one:

Best race of the year, hands down.

Suspense from start to finish, battles up and down the field and a worthy champion at the end.

PS: I’m a Ferrari fan!

From the forum

Happy birthday!

Happy birthday to Carlos Santos and Nick!

If you want a birthday shout-out tell us when yours is by emailling me, using Twitter or adding to the list here.

On this day in F1

Bernie Ecclestone was mugged in London on this day two years ago.

Ecclestone, who was 80 at the time, quickly bounced back from the ordeal and later appeared in an advert for his chosen brand of watches displaying the injuries he had received.

Images © Sahara Force India F1 Team, Daimler/Hoch Zwei

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176 comments on “Hamilton: “The dude didn’t even say sorry””

  1. Why should Hamilton expect Hulk to apologize when the incident wasn’t the German’s fault? At most it was a racing incident, made worse by the conditions.

    1. Yeah but if Hulk was a bit patient and didn’t duck down into those 3 cars he could have caught him in the next few turns

      1. He’d have made it, had the car not snapped from him. Given the conditions, I think it’s hard to blame him…

        1. We’ve seen Hulk losing the car couple of times before the incident. He’s a racing driver, he knows the conditions, he knows how his car behaves, and he knows the risks. It was obviously his fault. I think it’s hard to defend him, actually.

          1. +1 . He could have so easily avoided aggression there considering how good and fast he was in the rain .

          2. @maroonjack how many times we’ve seen champions losing the car in the rain?

            Kimi yesterday for instance. It’s hard to know what’s gonna happen, specially if you’re out of the line. There was no way of knowing how wet that part of the track was.

        2. @fer-no65 This exactly. You can’t predict those conditions.

        3. Given the conditions that’s exactly why he’s to blame, as the Stewards well understood. Crazy move onto the wet part of the track, 100% to blame

      2. Conditions are the same for everyone. He misjudged it, lost the car, and hit someone else, and ended that person’s race. The passing guy is responsible for a clean pass. Hamilton gave him so much room that Hulkenberg was almost perpendicular to Hamilton’s car when he hit him.

        1. I don’t think you can even say he misjudged it. Look at all the other drivers who one second were completely fine, and then suddenly the back slips and they are going backwards into the grass.

          1. It’s not as though there were red and yellow flags being waved. oh wait…

          2. What of Di Resta then? Or any other driver who went wide?

          3. Didn’t Alonso miss the corner even more than Nico did, twice?

          4. Di Resta crashed under very different circumstances, when it was even more treacherous. And neither him nor Alonso went wide when they dived up inside of another driver.

          5. But when other drivers slipped they were alone and that’s a big difference while you just escape by a little trip of the track or hitting another car with the unknown of what could be next.
            In wet condition you have to be a bit more carefull and not too optimistic, was a matter of time before he got Hamilton, DRS was a few corners away and FI were pretty quick there. Classified as a dumb move of a driver not use being in the lead and it probably hit him even more than Lewis given their respective apparences on a podium.

        2. I was just thinking on that. Incidentally if Hamilton didn’t give as much room for Hulk the cars would have collided side on and probably both of them would have gotten away with it. Hulk should have known better but it was a racing incident in my opinion and the drive through was extremely harsh however he still should have gone to Hamilton and said something. On another point entirely every driver was a rookie once and Hamilton made more than a his fair share of stupid mistakes, and it really annoys me when drivers start complaining about that. That’s racing, deal with it

          1. But no-one is complaining here, just stating the facts.

      3. @wackyracer because when you lose control of your car is enterily your’re fault. Hamilton was on exterior, he didn’t force Hulk to do a super maneuver to avoid him. @mnmracer Alonso didn’t lost control of the car, like Hulk did, he was very carefull, althought he was on limit for several times.

        1. Alonso lost control of his car 2 times into turn one mate. In fact if there was still grass there as there should be the WDC would have been decided by lap 10.

    2. @pamphlet agree it was a racing incident, and Hamilton was probably dissapointed with how it ended.

      The guy DID apologise after LH made that comment, I’ve seen it on twitter.

      1. On the Sky Sports website Hamilton acknowledges that.

    3. It was completely his fault.

    4. How was it not his fault? He misjudged the corner and slid wide into another driver.

      1. I wouldn’t say “misjudged” as in those particular conditions it’s quite hard to keep a F1 car from sliding all over the place and calculate exactly how much the back will throw itself on you. In normal conditions Hulkenberg would have made the pass stick cleanly and it wouldn’t have come to any of these discussions.

        But it’s understandable for both Lewis – being frustrated with the outcome and Hulkenberg – not feeling the need to apologize at first.

        It’s just post-race tension. They’ll put it behind them quite quickly, I reckon. :)

        1. He misjudged it, given the conditions (which he was fully aware of).

      2. slid wide? or lost grip?

        It was an unforeseeable loss of grip, in those conditions, it happens.

        1. His fault, how can it not be??

          1. Terrible conditions and Kovalainen got in the way pretty badly.

          2. If he had of turned into Hamilton on purpose, instead of trying to turn the corner, then I’d agree.

            But it was a wet track, he’s not exactly the only one to have gone wide during the race and it was not an unreasonable overtaking attempt.

          3. @mike Then why did Hulkenberg get a drive through penalty, if it wasn’t his fault?

          4. The stewards in over at least the last year, have generally taken the decision, that if you ruin another drivers race, then you get a penalty.

            I’m not arguing against Hulkenburg’s penalty, I fully understand that, as it cause another driver to retire. However, the stewards seem to have avoided penalizing Vettel, for an incident with a similar amount of blame (very little) and similar consequences in order to avoid affecting the championship.

            But by letting the championship contenders get away with things that others can’t I think they are skewing the rule book unfairly. I don’t think being in the hunt should have influenced their decision, and we have seen in the past that, “I didn’t see him” isn’t a good enough excuse to avoid penalty. Except this time.

        2. @mike

          If he had of turned into Hamilton on purpose, instead of trying to turn the corner, then I’d agree.

          In general crashes do not happen “on purpose”. Usually it’s one driver doing something stupid, or lacking the skill to control his car. That’s what happened here. Hulkenberg initiated the pass in risky conditions, knowing he doesn’t have much grip. He crashed into another driver and took him out. Most people, including the marshals, saw it was Hulk’s fault. The track was wet for everybody, and some drivers were showing that safe overtaking was still possible.

        3. @mike alright, he didn’t misjudge it and it was a racing incident. he still ended another driver’s race and for that he should apologize. confirmed by the fact that he did go and apologize to lewis.

        4. Those are both one and the same- he went wide when trying to overtake. I’m not saying that it wasn’t easy for drivers to misjudge that corner, but when overtaking for the lead you need to make sure you don’t hit the other driver- if you do so while they are giving room, it is categorically your fault. I really don’t understand how this is even being debated. Was he unlucky that such a minor mistake had such a big impact? Yes. Does that mean he wasn’t to blame? No.

          1. @matt90
            Ok, So what about the Vettel/Senna incident?

            By the same line, shouldn’t Vettel be responsible for turning into another driver?

          2. @mike I never got to see the thorough replays of that, so it is hard to give an opinion. But if it was Vettel who was fully to blame, then perhaps he too deserved a penalty (I guess it would be similar to Massa vs Hamilton in India last year).

          3. @matt90

            To be honest, I don’t think you can really blame Vettel, but the two situations appear to me, to have been looked at differently, even though, really, it is the same thing going on.

            Sorry if I’ve come across grumpy btw, had a few stressful nights at work. -.-

          4. @mike
            No problem, you haven’t come across grumpy anyway.

            I guess of the issue is that events at the start of the race are, whether rightly or wrongly, typically treated more leniently.

      3. @matt90
        (1)He braked at the right time/distance for a wetlap, a few meters ahead of the normal dry braking point.
        (2)he was not attempting to outbrake, either by racing line grip or locking wheels, hamilton, as he was clearly faster and had already passed hamilton a few metres before the brake point.
        (3)hamilton kind of precipitated the crash by being a little too defensive – look at him lock up his wheels at the last moment. If he hadnt, he wouldnt have been at the spot where the FI car’s tail was lashing.
        (4)the timing of the backmarker to be at that place when despite having braked at a safe point under wet conditions, hulkenberg was losing grip, only prompted hulknberg to take some sort of evasive action, the unlucky recepient of which was hamilton.
        It was a racing incident, and IMO hulkenberg should not have been handed a penalty.

        1. He left the dry track and made a hail mary into the wet, totally correct to penalize

        2. The idea that Hamilton was responsible just by being there isn’t something I’m even going to allow time to consider. That’s the same attitude some people had when excusing Maldonado in Valencia because Hamilton supposedly didn’t need to be there. I guess every driver about to be overtaken should jump out of the way rather than trust their competitor not to hit them. Hamilton was defensive only so much as he didn’t decide to give up the place- he allowed miles of room.

    5. Wasn’t Lewis locking his wheels way before the braking zone to avoid a Caterham? I think it was a clear indication that a move there as too optimistic.

    6. Regardless of who was to blame, I think a “sorry we took you out of your last race” is enough of a reason to apologize.

      1. I completely agree. Besides, I do think it was Hulkenberg’s fault not to weigh track conditions properly. I mean the guy actually drifted onto Hamilton, I understand he wanted to turn, but at that speed he lost his rear. That is a fault which has – had – less serious consequences for Alonso twice. But Hulkenberg knew he had other cars around him, he should have been more cautious.

        I guess the pressure of being at the front in those intense circumstances finally got to him. It is typically an inexperienced error, Hamilton is right. I also think Hulkenberg is a great driver for the future, he displayed great progress in the second half of the season, and I fear for him – I think it does not help him, if he does not acknowledge his errors.

        It could also be that he actually acknowledged it to himself (which is what really counts), but refused to do so to Hamilton, because (1) he would have been seen weaker, and (2) Hamilton is more upset this way.

        1. @atticus-2

          But Hulkenberg..should have been more cautious.

          When grosjean drove into de la rosa, caution should have been excercised. When Raikkonen decided to lock his wheels and take the runoff area to avoid hitting vettel on lap 1, that was a best example of caution.
          But if you were to keep excercizing caution for an overtaking attempt, in today’s F1 scenario where cars finding thesmselves in overtaking conditions are extremely rare, that is no less than asking for killing racing itself.

      2. For heaven’s sake, Hamilton isn’t retiring, he’s just moving to another team, why is everyone carrying on as if he’s leaving the sport!!!,

        1. I agree. Even the BBC were going on as if Lewis was retiring

      3. @mouse_nightshirt There’s no need for Hulk to get so precious about it, or Hamilton for that matter. Why would Hulk care it’s his last race for McLaren when he has the chance to win the race?

  2. As for Hulk, maybe he was afraid to go apologize because he heard the legend of the H.A.M. I’ll keep an eye on Twitter for the mea culpa. I think that’s how the young people do it now.

    As for Vet’s comments. Curious that he now needs to talk about how he overcame the loss of EBD (rear stability under braking) and how as a result he could not use his “tricks.” Webber doesn’t have tricks and Webber was quicker than Vettel before this apparent “step” came in that made the car more to Vettel’s liking and relativly less so for Webber. It’s interesting to see how much Vettel’s recent success ties to RBRs mastery of EBD. Now, don’t people go saying that I’m bashing Vettel. The flip-side of this adapatability issue is that he was much better than Webber to exploit the technology available.

    1. @dmw Obviously it’s hard to make a car that suits the two drivers… but considering their knowledge with this technology, it’s quite easy to see why they ended up going Vettel’s way.

      I’ve read that the way the EBD worked was counter-intuitive. So if the car was oversteering, instead of lifting off, they had to floor it. Reminded me of that story about Lauda in the fan-Brabham, accelerating over oil spilled on the track.

    2. @dmw Newey adjusted the car to suit their best driver, apparently it paid off. #justsayin’

      We all know that motorsports is a combination of man and machine, and seems that Vettel matches perfectly with Newey ideas, I wonder how would he survive without him.

    3. You do know that Webber was actually only faster than Vettel in 3 races his entire year? Even when ‘Webber was quicker’, Webber only beat Vettel on-track in China, Monaco and Silverstone.

  3. How was it not Hulks fault? Hamilton went as wide as he could to avoid him, but Hulk had out braked himself. The stewards also thought it was his fault as he got a drive through!!

  4. I had to laugh at these comments from Kimi Raikkonen, claiming that he knew where he was going when he took to the support paddock pit lane. Given that the gate to the lane was closed, he clearly had no idea at all.

    1. He said it was open last year. But, he says, “Next year I’ll make sure it’s open again…”
      This guy is a stitch.

      This is almost as amusing as his Tron-style dandruff shampoo commercial airing on Speed.

    2. He knew exactly where he was going. Up the support pitlane.
      The only thing he didnt know was that the gate at the end was closed.

    3. @prisoner-monkeys
      If you had taken the time to read the article, instead of running here to bash Räikkönen as you usually do, you would’ve noticed that what Räikkönen actually says is:

      “Where I went off you can get back on the track by going through the support race pitlane, but you have to go through a gate.

      “I know this as I did the same thing in 2001 and the gate was open that year. Somebody closed it this time.

      “Next year I’ll make sure it’s open again…”

      The headline was probably just reporters interpretation in order to make a funny reference to Kimi’s Abu Dhabi radio messages.

      1. @hotbottoms – Oh, I read the article. But as Martin Brundle pointed out during the commentary, he should have checked the lane beforehand. Raikkonen simply assumed it was open because it was open eleven years ago, so more fool him.

        1. @prisoner-monkeys
          Classic. Bashing a driver for something they never did say or do, and changing the subject after that is pointed out as if you were never wrong.

          Räikkönen isn’t saying it was a smart thing to do or that the gate should’ve been open. He’s simply telling the reporter (most likely because the reporter asked) why he chose that route – because he had used it in 2001.

          But I guess there is no point in arguing, since we’ll soon be talking about Kimi’s bad additude, his shameful first half of the 2009 season, his alcohol use or something like that…

          1. don’t forget to his possible smoking habit here @hotbottoms! ;-)

          2. As Marc Gené said yesterday on Spanish TV, drivers walk or use bike/scooters before practice seassons to check these things out. Kimi wasn’t probably in the mood for that

    4. That was hillarious. One of the best drivers of the season lost at Autodromo Jose Carlos Pace.

      It really was the race of the year, with great passes, drama and… bloopers.

      Brazil for season finale forever, please!

    5. This would be fun

      Engineer : Ok kimi , take a u turn .

      Kimi : I know what I am doing .

      ……….end of transmission

  5. Haha what a little girl. “Waa he didn’t say sorry, waa!” How do you feel now that he did? All better?

    1. His two diamond earnings don’t really help his cause either.. :D

      1. Hating doesn’t help your cause mate.

        don’t hate the playa, hate the game :)

    2. Didnt Lewis mention that Hulk came over and apologized during the Sky Interviews?

    3. haha! Spot on!

  6. I find it amusing Hamilton talking about “inexperienced” drivers.

    1. @mike Umm…how so?

      1. Maybe all of 2011 comes to mind?

        1. What comes to my mind is Japan 2008 (?) when Webber was taken out by inexperienced Vettel who he (Webber) called “a kid” and few years later that kid is triple WDC and Webber is his “employee” :)

          But HAM has a point. This year we’ve seen tons of wheel-to-wheel action with top cats and nobody got hurt.

          1. +1 … we had jenson vs hamilton …and kimi ….they always do it like a boss …fair play and leaving space …but I think lewis said that in the spur of the moment

        2. @neiana Uhh…OK that has no relevance here but whatever…

        3. Nope. I’m pretty sure in terms of shear stupidity Canada 2008 takes the cake any day of the week.

      2. I just found it amusing, given that Hamilton has often been criticized with exactly the same thing.

        1. Are you talking about this season or the last?

  7. Wow, That footage regarding Vettel’s overtake is very clear. There is very obviously yellows out on the track. O.o

    There’s a few things I didn’t like in this race, Hulkenburg makes and honest mistake, getting our of shape on a damp/wet track, and he gets a penalty. Vettel turns in on Senna. Penalty? Nope. Nothing.

    Vettel has gotten away with a lot this race.

    1. Actually, hold on that yellow one. I’m not sure anymore. Just because, it looks yellow, but it isn’t flashing.

    2. Senna came from a long way behind, he lunged past two cars in the braking zone, there was no way Vettel could have seen him

      1. I agree, it was an honest mistake by Vettel, just as it was by Hulkenburg, both times they took someone out of the race.

        1. Incidents on the first lap have always been treated with more leniency than the rest of the race.

          1. +1 good point .

          2. Except, this year they have been changing that. And on top of that, this was significantly into the lap.

    3. On Italian tv it looked like it was 100 percent senna’s fault. Then I see sky with this touch screen business to show it was all vettel’s fault. If you look at the incident without all the tv tricks it appears as a simple racing incident. Good job by stewards there IMO. By the way has anyone pulled out the infamous A Senna gap quote yet for hulkenberg? Because normally there’s boat loads of people yelling at drivers for not being racers. I’m happy hulk went for it personally-nice drama.

    4. To me it was clear that there was a yellow flag there…
      But it is history now.

      1. I can’t believe anyone thought for a second it was a yellow flag situation. Brundle and Croft surely must have known that yellows actually flash. The fact all of the lights weren’t flashing is enough to tell most people they weren’t yellows at all.

  8. Hhahaha and by some comments Hamilton hating continues around here. Ludicrous.
    Brilliant race. Vettel deserved the title, great driver. Hamilton, Vettel and Alonso , plus Raikonnen, Button, Rosberg, Massa, etc. shows that F1 is in excelent shape regarding drivers. People will look at this time and feel jealeous, as we feel about the 80’s (well, at least i do).

    1. Even though the conditions were tough, Hulkenberg misjudged the manoeuvre. Hamilton’s race was ruined through no fault of his own, and he may have wanted a quick apology from Nico. I don’t really see why people should be so upset at what Hamilton said.

      1. I don’t get it either, but i guess people love to hate him.

      2. People are upset because The Hülk did apologise, and before that article was put up (I’m pretty sure). So it’s kind of silly. Then again, maybe the article took the quote out of context or something.

        1. @brazil2007 No. People are upset because it was Hamilton, amigo. Period.

        2. “People are upset”???

          Geez people need to get a life..

    2. @edmarques

      Hamilton, Vettel and Alonso , plus Raikonnen, Button, Rosberg, Massa, etc. shows that F1 is in excelent shape regarding drivers.

      Couldn’t agree more. It’s often been hard to pick the DotW this year because there were so many impeccable performances.

  9. Hulkenberg sure is inexperienced in PR stunts – an apology is real only when it is said in front of a hundred cameras XD

  10. Lol! I’m a total Lewis fanboy myself & also a Hulk fan from his A1GP & GP2 days. Its just an unfortunate incident. Lewis isn’t a good loser & quite immature (off the track) to be honest. But he’s driven really, really well this year, better than the past 5 years I’d say. I don’t think he’d have reacted that way if it wasn’t his last race for McLaren. This comment came out of bitter disappointment, nothing more.

    1. P.S. Just saw his post race comments/quotes from F1.com – “As for today, I don’t remember too much about the accident with Nico (Hulkenberg), but he came to see me after the race, which was nice.”

    2. Lewis isn’t a good loser

      Really? If anything, he’s been anything but a bad loser this year. But being Lewis, I’m sure there are many people like you who simply won’t acknowledge that.

      1. Bad loser, Good loser…. the common word there is loser.
        lol, I am sorry, I couldn’t resist making a joke, please don’t take this serious.

        1. respect to Hamilton this year, i say
          he didnt go on tv and flame hulkenberg like he could have, he said something like “i dont quite remember” (AS IF!) and changed the subject
          i think he has learned from his monaco 2011? outburst when he clashed with massa and maldonado that you dont go spouting off about other drivers on tv and do it in private (perhaps vettel and alonso should take note!?)

        2. @Moodsehead: Hee hee! No need for apologies.

          @sebsronnie: When I said Lewis is a bad loser, I didn’t mean he’s a sore loser. There’s a difference mate. Losing makes you stronger & more determined. I praise & sometimes criticise Lewis as a fan, not a hater.

  11. I have question to all…

    Y wasn’t Vettel’s incident in the 1st lap not investigated? Nico Hulk was penalised even though lost control of his car, whereas Vettel cut in and ruined other’s race as well??? Really confused???

    And has any driver in the past with a car slower than 1 second (average) was able to fight for the championship till the end???

    1. First lap incidents are usually less looked into because it’s always such a mess and regular “racing line” arguments don’t hold.

      Unless Hamilton is (was) involved of course. Then they dish out drive-through penalties for braking too late (even when everybody did).

      Besides it’s pretty much a racing incident. Vettel loses the car, recovers, is still ahead and cuts back to his racing line while Senna is already there. Vettel probably couldn’t even see Senna there.

      1. Ah yes, Fuji 08. It’s amazing how many times I think about certain rules and think “oh yes, that’s what normally happens… Oh, apart from when Hamilton did it”

  12. Hulk’s pace in a car which was half a second slower than the best car out there was impressive. I always thought McLaren should have gone for Hulk to replace Ham.

    1. Well that would’ve been awkward! making your future team loose 2nd in the constructors is not the best way to finish the season, anyway in F1 results have to come at the right time and Sauber started really well in the first half of the season, the opposite of Force India which was strong only in the final races. That’s why I don’t blame them for choosing Pérez, speaking of, did anyone see the last TOONED episode? that has to be best of the series :)

      1. If Hulkenberg had a Mclaren contract in his back pocket he might have been more inclined to accept a podium finish in the knowledge that he would probably have plenty more chances at the front of the field next year.

    2. I don’t get at all why McLaren just didn’t wait. I mean they’re a big team so they can afford to wait. Or am I wrong and they need Perez’s sponsorship money? Anyway SP is good but I think Hulk could be better. We’ll see but I think both drivers have potential and both beat their teammates.

      1. i remember Button making a comment about who he wanted his next teammate he replied the incredible Hulk… this was before Ham got confirmed by Merc officially.

        1. Have you got a source for that? I don’t remember reading anything along those lines.

          This is when you come back and point out it was in a round-up and I’ve forgotten about it!

          1. “When asked yesterday who he would fancy as a possible replacement for Hamilton, the 32-year-old was in light-hearted mood. ‘I would like the Incredible Hulk as my team-mate, he’s amazing,’ said Button, before clarifying he meant the green giant and not Force India’s Nico Hulkenberg — another promising youngster.”


  13. Hamilton had to say it, didn’t he? Who’s the immature one here? It was clearly a loss of grip on a wet track and the Caterham up ahead made it worse. Anyway, he spoke too soon, as Nico clearly apologised later.

  14. For Alonso to believe that Grosejan had lost him the title,
    1) How did the botched passing attempt against Maldonado go in China? – Easy 4 points lost for nothing
    2) How did the inability to pass Pic in Spain work? – Easiest 7 points gone

    But the biggest failure on your part which you will never accept was squeezing Kimi when you had the inside line and heaps of space on your right in Suzuka. You lost 25 points in the championship lead that day. And the best you could remember about Suzuka was Vettel not getting penalised? You will never win another championship as long as you don’t own up to your mistakes. The one thing history has reminded from 2007 Fuji, 2010 Hockenheim and 2012 Austin is that you never win a chmpionship by manipulation. Stop politiking and just drive. You have better chances that way.

    1. Six years drought is making him nervous.

      1. That’s what I thought. It is unworthy of a double-world-champion to go on and on about who’s fault it was that he lost the championchip.

    2. Alonso has a point (but as you don’t like him, you clearly miss it). Suzuka was barely even his fault – if that had been Grosjean or Maldonado who clipped Alonso, they’d have been penalised immediately, but as it’s Kimi people choose to see something different.

      Alonso deserved something more from this season (as did the whole Ferrari team – bar the car designers!!). They worked tremendously well together to give Fernando the best chance possible and he almost did it. If you don’t consider the quality he has shown this year to be Championship worthy, then I am not sure what quality you do think deserves it!

      1. Suzuka was Alonso’s fault

    3. The saddest part of Alonso’s post season commentary of blaming others for him not winning the WDC is that he is using up all the good will he built up for himself this season. He seemed to act more mature, drove the hell out of a car that was not the fastest and most of the time let his driving do the talking for him. Now he is trying to throw all that away instead of just being gracious and then fighting the battles next season on the track. Everybody already knows how close the WDC points were and that either driver’s season could have turned on any number of incidents throughout the campaign.

      Just when I was almost starting to respect Alonso a little bit as a person while already immensely respecting his superior driving skills all along. A wise person told me many times, actions speak louder than words. Alonso’s actions while driving have spoken volumes. He should let it go at that because in this day and age the words get repeated so loud and so often that they may obscure his actions.

  15. I see a lot of people are apologizing for Hulkenberg’s move because the track was wet. I think the track was a lot wetter off the racing line, and a driver attempting a pass should take that into account. He didn’t, and went into the corner too fast, taking out the guy he was trying to overtake. A penalty was justified in my opinion.

    1. I am inclined to see it the same way, even if I felt gutted when it happened, because it spoiled a bit of tension. Seeing it top on in, it was clear that Hulk was on the wet part there, and given how good he had been at treading the damp track, he must have felt that braking late would be a big risk.

      Still, I think it might have been enough to have given him just a reprimand, or treat it as an unfortunate acicident in slippery conditions.

      1. Hulk would have had DRS after the traffic, as he was so close.
        His lack of patience was not ‘unfortunate’ but rather immature.
        He’s been driving extremely well! That penalty will help curb his enthusiasm in future, and those are the growing pains.

  16. Funny what people make of an elephant out of Hamilton saying its a bit of a shame Hulk did not say sorry. I think he is right, and its good that Hulk did come to say sorry. After all, if we want these guys to race professionally, accepting your mistakes is a big part of that.

    On that same note, while Vettel is a great guy and fabulous driver, maybe he should have held back a bit on Senna, because

    I got the hit in turn four for no reason. I don’t know what happened. I think someone probably… I think it was Bruno, I was told it was Bruno… he was probably fighting someone into turn four. It was drizzling since the start of the formation lap and it was quite slippery in turn four, we knew that. Maybe he forgot.

    is not what happened. It was Vettel failing to give Senna room there.

    Then again, this was straight after the race, so there was not much time to go through that before the press conference, what with celebrating the 3r straight championship win and all.

    1. yes . vettel always tends to tuck in after overtaking without bothering . Turkey 2010 , with narain also i think , and now this . He assumes people should just move out of the way . It was funny to see webber actually going for glory trying to pressurize vettel . A bit illogical however , I don’t think they are best teammates :P

    2. I don’t know why Vettel was supposed to give Senna room, who despite braking a bit optimistically into the corner still only managed to hit Vettel just infront of the rear tyre.
      Senna was in no situation to go there and attempt an overtaking. He had cars next to him and crashed into Vettel who was on his normal racing line.

      I wouldn’t go as far as saying it was a dumb move by Senna, but claiming it was Vettel’s fault is daft.

      1. Perhaps he was assuming that due to the chaotic start with cars darting everywhere, Vettel wouldn’t take the corner as he normally would (going from outside to apex), and would keep a constant distance between himself and the apex.

  17. I find it surprising that McLaren who are famous (or infamous) for controlling their drivers’ statements to the press have never managed to get a handle on Hamilton’s outbursts. It’s the same old thing as with all the drivers, ‘it wasn’t me, it was the other bloke. ‘ Maybe he’ll finally grow up under Brawn’s guidance and concentrate on his talent instead of behaving like a twit.

    1. Maybe he’ll finally grow up under Brawn’s guidance and concentrate on his talent instead of behaving like a twit.

      Behaving like a twit? Because he’s unhappy after being shunted out of a potential race winning position in his last race for the team through no fault of his own? That’s what you call an outburst? Ridiculous!

    2. Wonder what you would have to say about the SWEARING Vettels resorts to, after such incidents??

    3. And oh, If he’s not concentrating in his driving at the moment, then the other guys must really untalented :D

  18. Interesting in “auto motor sport” it says Hülkenberg went to Hamilton after the race to apologize.
    Was that a wrong statement? Was Hamilton too trigger-happy on his twitter-account again?

    1. The whole Guardian article is a non-story. Lots of words typed about how Hamilton thinks Hulkenburg was wrong not to apologise, then a little one-line addition that invalidates the whole story, but ‘Hamilton said something, lets make a story of it’.

      1. Looks like an “Aaargh, here comes my deadline…this’ll do” story to me.

        Maybe Lewis needs a big banner saying “Bernie says: Think Before You Speak”, as he’d better get used to having run-ins with Hulkenberg, and all the other “less experienced” guys in the midfield next year.

        Nico said sorry on the track with his drive-through, and also managed to leave his current team without needing to tell the world how “emotional” it would be for him.

        1. @tomsk C’mon Lewis leaving McLaren after so many years is bound to be more emotional than the Hulk leaving Force India – it’s completely different.

    2. @dennis He said that in a BBC interview after the race so maybe Hulkenberg hadn’t had the time to see him as of that interview.

  19. If looks could kill, Romain Grosjean would be a dead man.

    1. Is that from the moment we saw Kimi going on the old track?

      1. @prisoner-monkeys – I have no idea. It’s from the BBC’s feed, which isn’t the same as the world feed; I never saw it during the telecast. Given that Grosjean crashed out before lap 10, it really could have been broadcast at any time during the next 61 laps, so I’m afraid I don’t know.

        I know I’ve taken it out of context slightly, but the sources that I got it from have taken it out of context even further – it was shown during discussions of Romain Grosjean’s future, the obvious implication being that Eric Boullier is unimpressed with his latest mistake. Which is rather, given that publicly Boullier has been piling praise and reassurance on Grosjean, but privately it appears he is unhappy – and in the meantime, Grosjean doesn’t have a contract with Lotus for 2013 (that we know of).

        1. Hehe, Boullier’s not amused, is he?

          I’d be amazed if he dropped Grosjean this soon, after all the effort Eric’s put into managing his comeback (from his races for Renault) all the way up through GTs, Auto GP and GP2. Sure he could put Valsecchi in the car, or someone with more money like Senna, but Lotus would be more of a two-car attack with Grosjean, and surely there’s enough inexperience on the 2013 grid already…

        2. Hmmm, that was supposed to be at @bascb, not me. Brainfade.

        3. @Prisoner-Monkeys @BasCB That gif is actually from Silverstone. I think one of the practice sessions (or maybe during the red flag in qualifying).

    2. Hahaha! That’s amazing!

  20. It seems everyone who watched on Sky has come away with a head full of conspiracy theories. I guess Brundle’s commentary style was shaped in the Schumacher era, when coming up with theories about yellow flags etc. was literally the only way to keep people’s attention. There was no mention of the (red-and-)yellow flags ‘incident’ at any stage in the BBC coverage.

  21. Great race, F1 should be like that always. Alonso: some kind of miracle to him to win (it did almost happen). Vettel: deserved it, he proved that can start from anywhere and win a race. Hamilton: no doubt he flies like nobody else, but some luck is needed sometimes (ask Alonso about it), and to the other drivers (with respect): try to combine the skills of these three drivers and for sure we´ll have a new champions in 2013… and nooo, Grosjan skills is not included.

  22. It’s pretty clear that Vettel overtook under the yellow flag. The yellow lights are on. What does a yellow and red flag several corners earlier have to do with anything?

    I don’t get McNish’s argument that Vettel couldn’t give the spot back because Kobayashi pitted. How is that relevant? Ask Alonso what happens when the guy who you illegally overtook pits (Kubica) or Button (on Massa)

    It’s like the commenters are desperately trying to make the steward’ mistake to go away. Of course it’s not in their interest that their is controversy about F1 (maybe even contractually so), but still. Just like the colossal blunder when they penalised Schumacher for overtaking Alonso under green after the restart in Monaco. Not just the fact that they did penalise Schumacher, but also that they commented that a 25 second penalty was the only option they had. BTW notice that now in Brazil the yellow lights and SC sign where upheld after the SC peeled off.

    1. @patrickl

      Of course it’s not in their interest that their is controversy about F1

      On the contrary, of course it is. This is exactly the sort of story Sky want to push as they attempt to attract subscribers from the BBC by trying to present themselves as being more informed. They want people to watch their programmes and read their headlines and above all pay for their exorbitantly expensive coverage.

      I’m sure there are people at Sky who genuinely believe they had it right and they were correct to pursue it if that’s what they believed. But when even Ferrari are saying they don’t think Vettel did anything wrong it’s hard to go along with them on this one.

      I gave my explanation of how I saw it in the race report:

      Button wins intense race as Vettel recovers to seal third championship

      1. @keithcollantine

        On the contrary, of course it is. This is exactly the sort of story Sky want to push as they attempt to attract subscribers from the BBC by trying to present themselves as being more informed. They want people to watch their programmes and read their headlines and above all pay for their exorbitantly expensive coverage.

        Or maybe the BBC just missed it. I imagine they get the world feed as we do, and while Brundle and Croft discussed it on air with a replay accompanying it, it was never shown on the world feed. It’s a bit hard for the BBC to discuss something that isn’t shown.

        Or, for all we know, one of the BBC production crew spotted that it was a red and yellow flag, so the BBC saw no reason to discuss it on air, and Sky were the ones who missed an important detail (for whatever reason).

      2. To me it does show a lack of professionalism that they were not able to stop speculation about something sinister earlier on Sky. Isn’t that what they have Lee, Nataly and Ted for?

        The same question arose on twitter and on Speed. Will Buxton came up with both the news that Ferrari had asked the Stewards to look at it AND the information that it was a flag for a slippery track and not a yellow there before the middle of the race. Still Sky did not pick up and went on with the conspiracy theory.
        The BBC wisely chose not to get into this non-story, as their team on the ground would have probably been asking insiders about it too.

        1. I doubt the BBC ‘wisely chose’ to do anything. It think it’s more likely that they missed it, given how often they miss even more glaring issues. Fortunately because I also had F1F live I was aware of it during the race – I was amazed that it didn’t even get a passing mention from the BBC.

          To suggest that the BBC shouldn’t mention it or show the replay because it wasn’t clear that it was a yellow flag is like saying that they shouldn’t bother mentioning or replaying Button overtaking Hamilton and then being immediately overtaken again on the basis that they ended up back in the same positions.

      3. I think it’s Sky editorial policy. In their coverage, they’ve always tried to generate or invent controversy and oppose the officials in charge of the sport. They’re at the forefront of the campaign to bring TV replays into football – and so any match analysis on British TV has become mostly replays and freeze frames questioning a decision already made by the officials. (This includes BBC and ITV who have copied or assimilated much of the Sky style).

        Personally I’ve never liked this kind of self-important coverage, trying to impose its own set of rules – and I’m not sorry I missed out on it yesterday. Martin Brundle’s statements sounded pretty embarrassed.

      4. @Keith Collantine

        It’s not allowed to overtake when there is a yellow flag. Not half way not at all. Especially when your explanation doesn’t math with the explanation that the stewards gave (“yellow/red flag so no yellow flag at all”) means that that’s not how it went at all.

        And then of course there is the second incident of where he overtook under yellow.

        With Ferrari I really think they don’t want the controversy on their sport. Complaining now about a yellow flag achieves them nothing, but it does damage the sport when it’s shown that the stewards are so incapable that they miss Vettel overtaking under yellow not once, but twice.

        1. @patrickl

          It’s not allowed to overtake when there is a yellow flag.

          Obviously. Which is why the rules on where the yellow flag areas are defined are important, yet you seem to have overlooked or ignored them (more here).

          With Ferrari I really think they don’t want the controversy on their sport.

          I genuinely laughed out loud when I read that. We’re barely a week on from Ferrari purposefully sabotaging the chances of one of their drivers and suddenly they are the guardians of sporting integrity?

          If Indianapolis ’02, A1-Ring ’02, Hockenheim ’10, Austin ’12 and a litany of other examples have taught us anything, it’s that there is no limit to the damage Ferrari will do to F1 to win.

          The idea that Ferrari, who crave a drivers’ championship victory for Alonso like nothing else, would let one slip out of a desire not to drag the sport into controversy is beyond naive. As is the idea they would overlook any infraction on Vettel’s part. Which is precisely why Pat Fry was so quick to respond in the negative when asked if Vettel’s move on Kobayashi was illegal.

  23. So that’s it. Game over, season over.
    I wonder when the next time we be when we have six former World Champions on the grid at the same time . . . unless Schumacher does another ‘Farewell Tour’ season.l

    1. Not for a while, I think the next two titles at least are Vettel’s or Alonso’s…but you never know.
      I liked the drivers’ group photo, with all the champions on the front row. Much better than the usual noah’s-ark team-by-team arrangement.

    2. Unless Perez pulls something out of the bag in the next couple of years, or Webber/Vettel is replaced by somebody in 2014 who becomes a lead driver. It’s hard to look past any of the existing champions taking the next several titles otherwise.

  24. After frequenting this website multiple times a day for the last year or so I’m convinced people dislike Lewis Hamilton for reasons other than his racing and behavior.

    I do not see what is wrong if he wears earrings, dates a celebrity, or is into hip hop culture. If the man does his job, which he does very well, he can wear or say what he wants. I also really do not understand what is wrong with wanting an apology.

    As an American I cannot help but see similarities between Lewis and the way President Obama is treated by some. Some people seem to hate them for no good reason at all. I have my beliefs as to why this is but I also believe there is no point trying to change such people’s minds.

    Luckily for Lewis, he is probably significantly richer than those that hate him, and he actually drives F1 cars as opposed to hating online against those that do. I hope he is on a beach somewhere laughing at us all.

    1. Amen…

    2. I doubt that the majority of people who dislike him do so for the reason you’re implying.

      1. I hope you are right.

    3. +1 Great post, but if you look at it, the majority of this forum dislike the top drivers for different reasons. I mean Vettel gets constantly ridiculed for his skills for example, so you can’t really help it. F1 is a beautiful sport, I just don’t understand why there are so many people that love to dislike a part of the sport.

  25. Just found new footage on Vettel overtaking HRT under blinking yellow flag:


  26. Hulkenberg should never have got the drive through. Its ridiculous drivers are being penalised for doing the one thing they are supposed to do – racing. Accidents happen.

    1. I kind of agree, but I’ve always felt that drivers who ruin other driver’s races or cause them retire should not be allowed to get away with it.

      1. It seems to be the way the stewards operate although I’ve always thought it weird that a driver gets punished for the outcome of an incident rather then the actual act the driver commits.

    2. Crashing into another driver =/= racing.

      If he hadn’t been given a drive through, he would have stayed behind Button. It doesn’t seem fair to me that a driver would be in 2nd, accidentally eliminate the leader during a botched overtake, then resume 2nd.

  27. Hulkenberg did actually say sorry to Lewis, as reported by this tweet of McLaren: http://twitter.com/TheFifthDriver/status/272797452216721409

  28. Was I the only one who had a “Big Lebowsky” memory at reading Hamilton’s comment?

    Anyway, I see Hulk now apologised via twitter so I suppose that goes to show that drives do need their phones close by when they get out of the car (or in the car?) so they can do that as soon as possible :)

    1. oh, wow, he even went by in person – see, all well.

    2. Me too, but I thought dude was american slang.

  29. But this is what HAM said after the race: “As for today, I don’t remember too much about the accident with Nico (Hulkenberg), but he came to see me after the race, which was nice.” (as stated at Formula1.com)

  30. It was the German’s fault, he could’ve apologized to Lewis. Maybe he doesn’t like the fact that Hailton is driving for Mercedes next year while he….;)

  31. Alonso’s championship was lost when Vettel delivered the race of his life yesterday afternoon. Blaming it on DNF’s is futile.

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