Massa slams stewards for “unacceptable” penalty

2013 Brazilian Grand Prix

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Felipe Massa, Ferrari, Interlagos, 2013A furious Felipe Massa condemned the Brazilian Grand Prix stewards for giving him a drive-through penalty during the Brazilian Grand Pix.

Massa was penalised for crossing the white line at the entrance to pit lane during the race, something drivers had been warned about several times over the race weekend.

“I think it’s pretty unacceptable to be honest,” Massa told reporters after the race. “Why I mean a drive-through for this?”

“I’m sure I was not the only car which crossed that line. And I was the only one who got a drive-through for that.

“I didn’t do anything wrong, I didn’t overtake any cars outside of the track.

“But it’s like that, they believe they have all the power, they believe they know everything and normally they doing a lot of things which his not right you know, which is not correct. And it’s a shame.”

Massa said he could have taken fourth place had it not been for the penalty and said team mate Fernando Alonso, who finished third, would have let him by to score a podium finish in his final race for Ferrari.

“The race today would have been in the fourth place and maybe even third, you know, Fernando was maybe going to back off at the end, you know, let me by. The race would have been much better than what it was for the result.”

2003 Brazilian Grand Prix FIA race day pit line rules guidePrior to the race the stewards issued several warnings to drivers about not cutting the white lines at the pit lane entrance on safety grounds. Max Chilton and Esteban Gutierrez were both given reprimands for not obeying the guidance during practice.

Ahead of the race the stewards issued document number 44 including an image (right) showing drivers which line they must not cross during the race. This was referred to in their explanation for Massa’s penalty:

“The driver crossed the white line at pit entry with all four wheels, this line was defined in the race director’s note to teams document 44 as being the track edge.”

Massa ended his final race for Ferrari in seventh place and gave thanks to his team after the race: “[I] also just need to say thank you to everybody who worked together, everybody who gave me the opportunity to race for Ferrari”.

“But also everybody who works in the team you know the engineers, the mechanics, I mean everybody. thank you to everybody I will be around definitely, I’m not going anywhere, I will be around.”

2013 Brazilian Grand Prix

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    Image ?? Ferrari/Ercole Colombo

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    Keith Collantine
    Lifelong motor sport fan Keith set up RaceFans in 2005 - when it was originally called F1 Fanatic. Having previously worked as a motoring...

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    125 comments on “Massa slams stewards for “unacceptable” penalty”

    1. Seemed fair to me, but I have to say that the stewards have been so random with how they deal with the race-track limits and how they are breached you can see why he might be a little frustrated by being caught out…

      1. Indeed, seems a bit late in the season to suddenly decide to make a point. If they’re going to have clearly labelled publicly released images like this one, and enforce it in this way in the future then fair enough. If on the other hand this turns out to be a one off enforcement then Massa can consider himself seriously unlucky.

        While not truly magnificent, he’s had a much improved year this year, and for this to be his last memories of Ferrari (not that I’m implying stewards should take that into account) does kinda suck for him

      2. It seemed ok for me too…Until I started staring closely at that line and apart from Alonso I saw no one constantly avoiding to cross that line with anything less than 2 wheels.

        1. Two wheels was fine, as stated on that FIA image.

      3. I agree about the stewards. They did nothing about cars at Abu Dhabi going off on the last corner with their 4 wheels. no consistency

      4. Indeed. I hope it’s the new standard. Drivers cannot abuse limits, specially after being told not to do so.

    2. So did Vettel on his final lap, why didn’t he get a drive-through?

      1. Did he cross the line between points C and D? No – that’s why he didn’t get a penalty.

      2. No he did not cross the line illegally:

        Check it yourself here on BBC iPlayer at 2:31:41:

        1. Yeah, I hadn’t read the document and had misinterpreted what Massa had did wrong. My bad.

    3. Great start from him btw, he could have ended his career at Ferrari on a high note without that penalty.

      It’s a bit weird something that has been considered as the racing line for years here is now considered as leaving the track … but the drivers were warned so yeah …

      1. leaving the track is not against the rules…. charlie said so on TV last week…. its only penalised if they “gain an advantage”

      2. The reasons is surely to make sure that there is no problems involving the pit entry. I’m not sure whether I agree, given that the cars are still at racing speeds as they enter the pit entry. So I’m not sure it’s right.

      3. Leaving the track is not forbidden per se, but consistently exceeding track limits is, especially if it is deemed to be gaining an advantage. It may not have been shown on the world feed, but Massa probably cut that line between C and D not once, but several times.

        I’ve dabbled in a bit of track marshalling in the past, and from what I learned doing so, the chief marshal at each marshals’ post reports all instances of drivers exceeding track limits directly to the stewards. If a driver is reported to have done so enough times, the stewards may then elect to either warn the driver (where possible), and/or issue a penalty.

        How does this apply to Massa and Webber? Easy: Webber exceeded track limits once or twice, and was warned. Massa exceeded track limits, was warned, yet continued exceeding track limits, so was penalised.

        Of course, what I say can only be taken at face value. The only people who know for sure are the Interlagos stewards.

    4. As shown on the BBC coverage, the drivers where given specific instructions in the pre-race briefing about what defines the limits. Massa was clearly all 4 wheels outside atleast once, if it was just once, then its a bit harsh, but we heard Smedley give him a warning, then later the penalty came, so if Massa ignored the warning, then its a slam dunk penalty.

      1. Yes, agreed.

        Massa’s words here in this interview illustrate well his character and intelligence.

      2. Rob Smedley gave him a warning but that doesn’t mean that the penalty was not coming anyway.

      3. Sky showed three instances.
        I thought it was harsh for 1, but three, sorry Felipe, there are limits.

        1. +1
          Unfortunate, yes… Harsh, no. Felipe on the podium would have been nice to see, esp in final Ferrari race and Alonso payback, however he did cross the line with all 4 wheels while trying to stay ahead of Hamilton, so it was gaining an advantage. Tough but fair, IMO

        2. YEah, I actually think its good that the stewards have gotten more firm on going off track, we have seen so many instances in the past years where drivers went off track and weren’t punished. And then others where they suddenly were. In the last 6 months we have seen more and more that the FIA is starting to take a more transparent, but uncompromising stance on the issue.
          And given that drivers were warned in driver briefings, were apparently reprimanded on Friday and then got warned before repeating it again (see Smedley’s message and we heard Hamilton? Or was it Vettel? being told to be carefull as well), its good that they hand a penalty for it.
          Lets hope that in future years we will have the drivers keep to the track when driving by themselves, and keep on track as reasonably possible during passing (going off only to avoid accidents)

      4. But it is ok to leave the track – it only breaks the rule if he gained an advantage… in the penalty announcement they didn’t refer to the advantage that he gained, only that he crossed the line (the edge of the track).

        1. The rule is that you need to stay within the track limits (with at least some part of the car) at all times. If you can’t do that – for instance if you miss your braking point – you have to re-enter the track safely and without gaining an advantage from your off-track excursion.

          In this case the race stewards specifically mentioned this particular bit of the track in the drivers’ briefing, taking time to clearly describe where the track limits were. I suppose that was done because there was time to be gained by straightlining that left-hander. But they don’t have to refer to the “leaving the track and gaining an advantage” rule, since they could just as well say “we told you not to, and you did it anyway” :-)

          1. That’s not how Charlie Whiting defined it last weekend…

            1. I know he worded it differently last week, but that’s what the 2013 sporting regulations say. The race director has discretion to issue other orders at a specific race – as he did a couple of races ago, when he said the drivers could go off-track at specific corners. Personally, I think that was a bad idea, since it inevitably leads to confusion. But then I’m not the race director… :-)

              In this case, though, it was simply a clarification where the track limit was in regards to the pit entry, and a reminder to the drivers that they must keep within those limits (as per the sporting regulations). One can choose to see it as a reminder of the rules that are already in effect, or a special order by the race director. Either way, the drivers must always obey the race director. So I don’t see that Felipe has a leg to stand on here.

            2. “Prior to the race the stewards issued several warnings to drivers about not cutting the white lines at the pit lane entrance on safety grounds.”

              In other words, safety concerns.
              Crossing that line with 4 wheels attempts on safety, like speeding on the pit lane does, so, it´s penalised as well…

    5. Unfortunately for Massa, he has no one to blame but himself for that penalty as Charlie had warned all drivers. What was completely “unacceptable” was Hamilton’s drive-through penalty.

      1. How was it unacceptable? If Maldonado or Perez had crowded another driver off the circuit everyone would be screaming for a penalty. Hamilton simply didn’t look in his mirrors for Bottas and ended up nearly costing his team 2nd in the WCC.

        1. Bottas was a backmarker – Bottas had enough space to move away from Hamilton and Hamilton was on that line before Bottas inched up on him. First, there was no point in passing Hamilton, 2nd he couldn’t pass him, 3rd he forced Hamilton to change his line when he knew that they would collide and had enough space to prevent the collision.

          Instead he took a Massa-esque stand and said I ain’t moving – let’s both collide and end our races here and now. As a backmarker, what would be an appropriate penalty if it had cost Mercedes 2nd place? 1-year license suspension? What’s reasonable for such an idiotic move.

          I understand that Bottas thinks he’s the next Vettel and should be duking it out with Lewis but he can do that in F1 2013 and he can even drive the RB9 there…

        2. Maldonado did actually crowed another car into turn 1 in this race but they said it would be investigated after the race. Hamiltons incident was far more debatable than that one, yet he got a penalty immediately. There was room for Bottas, so it wasn’t so much crowding, but even so, Hamilton had his race ruined by having to drive around the entire circuit with 3 wheels, that’s punishment enough for what I would have considered a racing incident.

        3. He didn’t “crowded” anyone. Bottas had plenty of room. Certainly more than a car width from the edge of the track. In my opinion it was a racing incident with both drivers equally responsible.

          1. @maroonjack
            Yes Hamilton did leave a car width of space, but Bottas held his line dead straight, and then Hamilton, quite suddenly, moved into him.
            Bottas didn’t have time to move out of the way. Which means, how much track he had left is completely irrelevant. Hamilton simply drove into him.

            1. But the main point is why is a backmarker attempting a pass that will fail?

            2. It didn’t look like that in the replays. Lewis defended within the rules. The move wasn’t sudden and both of them could have avoided the collision. That’s why I think it was a racing incident.

            3. @freelittlebirds There is nothing wrong with a driver attempting to unlap himself. Lewis did that in last year in Germany. The point is, that if you attempt it, you also bear some responsibility for the maneuver.

            4. @freelittlebirds

              Does it matter?

              The fact is. Lewis moved into Bottas.

              For sure, you have to feel sorry for Lewis because he clearly thought it was done and dusted. But in the end, lewis moved over and hit Bottas. Ending Bottas’ race. It’s unlucky for Lewis, but completely correct.

            5. @mike

              The fact is. Lewis moved into Bottas.

              Hamilton was ahead and was defending position. He was entitled to move as long as there was a car’s width left for the opponent. And there was.

            6. @maroonjack

              Yeah that’s true for defending. He must leave one car width when defending. And as you say, he did.

              However, Bottas was already along side when he started moving over. That one car rule doesn’t mean that Hamilton is allowed to drive into Bottas.

          2. Michael (@freelittlebirds)
            25th November 2013, 3:19

            He didn’t move into him – he slowly went into his line and Bottas had ample time and space to avoid the collision – heck I could have avoided it!

            Sure if Bottas wants to just stay there well, yeah, that’s a different story. They are going to hit each other… If every driver stayed put then no one would finish any races and the cars would pile at the start of the race as they all stayed put.

            Coupled with the fact that Bottas thinking that his car has superior pace and would unlap himself, it was a ridiculously aggressive and pointless move. Yes, Hamilton has done in the past that but his car was as fast at the time and he had just found himself in the back for other reasons. Bottas was NOT driving for Red Bull, Renault, or Ferrari for Lewis to expect a genuine pass on pace.

            This move by Bottas was just to slow down Hamilton or to mess with his last race of the season and he did accomplish that spectacularly in the end. I had a lot of respect for Bottas up to this moment but it seems any idiot can drive in F1.

            1. “He didn’t move into him – he slowly went into his line and Bottas had ample time and space to avoid the collision – heck I could have avoided it!”
              Ha ha you think he moved slowly because you’ve seen incident in slow motion.
              Otherwise part of Bottas wheel wouldn’t fly away like that (no i dont mean tyre tread)

      2. He moved across in the braking zone and ended the other driver’s race, simple penalty.

        1. You make it sound like he waved violently. If you watch the footage, he moved across in a gradual manner, and even then, Bottas still had space.

          I don’t think its as clear cut as some people are making out. There was room for Bottas, and Hamiltons race was also ruined by a puncture, no need for the penalty, IMO.

          1. Bottas stayed on his line, Hamilton came across on him. If Hamilton had braked in a straight line instead of trying to bully Bottas out of the way he wouldn’t have gotten a penalty.

            1. Meh, storm in a teacup if you ask me. There was an incident in the race where 2 cars banged wheels into turn 1 but because their wheels hit exactly side-wall to side-wall, they could continue and no penalty was given to either driver. Then we saw Maldonado actually crowed another car into Turn 1, forcing one driver to take a evasive action, a collision happened between them, but again with no penalty.

              It just so happened that Bottas tyre and Hamiltons tyre hit in just the right place that damage occurs, a matter of a couple of centimetres would have seen them both continue no penalty given despite a collision having occurred.

              Hamiltons race was also ruined by that collision, again, punishment enough for a minor wheel to wheel racing incident.

          2. Hamilton didn’t move across on him. He was following the normal line into that turn. Even with the move across before turn-in there was a car’s width left for Bottas.

            Bottas should have known that he was going to take that line and positioned himself accordingly. Hamilton hadn’t seen Bottas approaching (Which is a little shabby, but as the Sky commentary mentioned he probably wasn’t expecting VB to come back at him) so it wasn’t a defensive move. It looks like a lunge on the replays because of the camera angle, but it was the standard, smooth approach to that turn that all the drivers (VB included) use.

            Hamilton wasn’t defending aggressively and Bottas wasn’t overtaking aggressively. It was just a racing incident.

            1. @gongtong
              Assuming what you’re saying is correct, Hamilton still caused Bottas’ retirement through negligence. I’m not sure why he’d leave more than a car’s width on the outside if he was taking a ‘normal line’ either.

              Personally I think Hamilton took a defensive line then moved over into the racing line where Bottas was. I’m not going to bother analysing the different lines lap by lap, any way I look at it it was Hamilton’s fault and he deserved the penalty.

      3. @freelittlebirds It’s that attitude that meant that strangely enough there have been some dodgy decisions in Mercedes favour, I wouldn’t suggest any type of actual corruption.

      4. Gordito Huevon
        29th November 2013, 2:49

        Just curious, but why would you bring up Hamilton’s issues in this thread?

    6. Stewards are not helping F1 one little bit

      1. Well in this case they were bang on. After issuing a warning and document to state what was wrong and right before hand the decision made seemed very fair. Massa appears to be a bit disgruntled and will hopefully gather himself after looking back at what he and everyone else had already been informed about prior to the start of the race.

        1. Its petty and pointless stuff like this interfering nonsense that is driving me away from F1. That pit entry hasnt been a problem for 20-odd years, then all of a sudden just as the little battle between Massa and Hamilton was getting interesting we have “oh Massa crossed a white line, lets put him back 20 seconds”. Pathetic.

          I’m sick of seeing silly drive-through penalties for virtually nothing incidents. Let the drivers race.

          1. Wow, so if it’s a rule as long as no one is impacted by you ignoring it than it’s ok?? If I was Bernie or Charlie I’d buy whatever new hobby you wanted to pick up for you so you take off. You can hide behind whatever you want but that is the kind of thinking I would expect from a child. If it is a rule and EVERYONE knew it than he should be smart enough to know I don’t drive there. But then I guess you would be ok if someone just decided to cut a chicane because well that’s a pointless line and no one got hurt by it.

          2. I agree, I mean so ok if you crash into someone and ruins the other drivers race, then you should get a penalty. Or if you gain an unfair advantage, like overtaking outside the track, then you should get a penalty (depending on the situation of course). But this is just ridiculous. Remember Hungary for example, the corner where Grosjean overtook Massa outside the track and was punished (harshly imo), he was only punished that time because he overtook while driving outside the track. In the same race, in the same corner, some drivers drove outside off the track on every single lap because it was faster, yet no penalty. It’s not as if Massa overtook someone with a wheel in the wrong place, or as if he gained 20 seconds by crossing a line once. FIA’s inconsistency is just a joke.

          3. Well they made it off limits for a reason. Who’s to say it didn’t cause an accident at another time so they beefed up the track limit rules? I’ll be quite honest, there was a huge crash there one year (was it a Jordan?) and by an unbelievable piece of luck a car didn’t spear into the armco end. It’s always been a very dodgy part of the race track.
            All were warned and diagrams were issued.
            There were two Brazilians on the Stewards Committee by the way.

    7. disagree with Massa, others crossed the line between A&B but most seemed to stay clear of crossing between C&D.

      But the stewards need to be consistent – this season they were harsh which is ok, but then sometimes completely random (like Abu Dhabi) – so I totally understand his frustration.

      1. And now they ruled Vergne / Maldonado no action – that’s the kind of inconsistency that drives guys like Massa (and me) mad.

        1. Its petty and pointless stuff like this interfering nonsense that is driving me away from F1. That pit entry hasnt been a problem for 20-odd years, then all of a sudden just as the little battle between Massa and Hamilton was getting interesting we have “oh Massa crossed a white line, lets put him back 20 seconds”. Pathetic.

          I’m sick of seeing silly drive-through penalties for virtually nothing incidents. Let the drivers race.

    8. Steph (@stephanief1990)
      24th November 2013, 19:48

      Because Felipe was warned it’s a bit harder to criticise the penalty however I still think he’s right – especially when it comes to the attitude of the stewards. The stewards have been completely inconsistent since India about track limits and when they matter and when they don’t so to give a penalty when Massa never even overtook anyone was harsh, inconsistent and ruined his last GP with Ferrari for absolutely nothing. At least Hamilton messed up and got a penalty so it didn’t entirely ruin that battle.

      It would have been nice to see Fernando repay Felipe for Germany 2010 too. I get the feeling that those two really do have a lot of respect for one another and got on fairly well during their time together.

      Anyway, I’ll miss you in a Ferrari, Felipe. You were the ultimate team player and so loyal. I hope Williams can turn their fortunes around for next season.

      1. It would have been nice to see Fernando repay Felipe for Germany 2010 too


        1. So true but to say it and to do it are not always the same!

      2. @stephanief1990

        It would have been nice to see Fernando repay Felipe for Germany 2010 too.

        I appreciate the sentiment but I don’t agree – drivers should earn the positions they finish in and two wrongs don’t make a right for me.

        1. Agreed @keithcollantine . It does seem a bit harsh looking at it only from a sentimental point of view, but not from a sporting POV. Mercedes were competing with Ferrari in the WCC and if one team were violating rules and the other team were not, well, there you have why the stewards did not have much choice. Especially since this particular violation was laid out prior to the race.

      3. I agree with this post.

    9. I was bitter in the race, and still am a bit about that. I live by the books, but can FIA stop to change the existing rules one day before the event takes place?

      Since ’72 F1 raced there, and always cut that pit entry line – which is the normal line – and now we cannot in the name of safety. I’m ok with ever-improving safety, but seriously there is other things to be made: Grosjean had to run back through the pit entry as it seems to be no gate to get out of the track there.

      1. Same feeling here. Just ridiculous.

      2. To be honest, we could probably do a better job of making the rules ourselves/as a crowd, as Keith usually points to in his articles on the random rules in force at certain times.

    10. It’s not that the stewards’ decision was wrong. It’s the rule itself that is stupid. Especially given the place it happened – I’ve been watching races on Interlagos for a long time, and never thought that cutting that piece of tarmac there was in any way unacceptable.

      Terrible stewards-drama aftertaste to end a season with.

      1. To be micro-analysing how a driver has driven over a line or not with 4 or 2 tyres is crazy IMO, with the best example being Grosjean in Hungary. So, moving to avoid any contact is worse than holding line, taking contact, and the other guy getting a penalty in their minds, and that’s only if both guys haven’t flown off the track and crashed from the resulting light contact.

        Why don’t they just put a bollard there, or a barrier etc. that would get their point across about where the track limits are. But of course that is less safe than the current situation. If the kerbs are not part of the track, then why are they there (big enough to fit a full car on) and what are they there for? We’d technically have more overtaking if there were less kerbs, as cornering speeds would be reduced and braking zones longer.

    11. Two things:

      I really don’t get why Massa and Ferrari are complaining, given how clear the FIA were about this rule before the race.

      I really don’t get why this whole pit lane entry line thing was suddenly an issue this weekend when it’s never been a problem ever before at Interlagos.

      Even if the stewards are trying to be consistent after their Grosjean decision in Hungary, I really don’t think this is an intelligent application of the rules at all.

      1. Agree @magnificent-geoffrey. Drivers were warned in advance, but when a driver makes a mistake and goes off track by accoident he doesn’t get penalised, and Felipe must’ve earned less than a tenth by doing so, therefore I think a reprimand was enough. I heard other drivers did the same during the race but got warned for it, while Felipe was directly punished. If this is true, it’s unfair, and while I like consistency and coherence by the stewards I still prefer good sense.

      2. I guess it’s because the pit entry is unsighted, so if there’s a slow car going in, making the cars take a wider line is less dangerous? Either that or they’re just discouraging drivers going right up against the pit wall for overtakes, which probably makes more sense.

        Either way, it’s a moot point. The drivers were warned and he chose not to listen, assuming he got one warning like other drivers, it was completely fair. If the stewards had warned the drivers then not taken any action it would be like India all over again, they end up looking stupid.

      3. I don’t get this… they gave advice about WHERE THE EDGE OF THE TRACK IS DEFINED…. but leaving the track isn’t a rule-breech… only gaining an advantage by doing so.

        At least that is how Charlie Whiting defined it on TV last weekend….

        1. If he was cutting that bit of track he was gaining an advantage. He was cutting a corner, shortening the track.

          1. The potential gain though is negligible, as can be found out when driving the precise track on iRacing in the Williams FW31.

            1. @fastiesty

              To be honest, I think it was more due to safety concerns regarding the pit entry than that.

            2. These are valid concerns, and I did have a thought about that during the race, when cars were disappearing left and others carrying past at full speed. But, I think they brake past that point, and anyway it is so obvious who is pitting (as they enter the pit lane before the white line to not get a pit entry penalty), that someone would have to really not be paying attention to draft them into the pit lane proper before turning right and carrying on down the pit straight, with the chance for a MW Valencia type incident if the pitting car brakes early for the pit speed limit.

        2. Ah but it is, it was defined by the stewards as a breech of article 20.2 of the sporting regs, leaving the track without justifiable cause ,
          As has been said the solid white line isn’t the issue it’s the box hatch section, the reason they cited it is for safety due to blind entry and a huge concrete wall END on seperating the pit lane and track, imagine a car slowing down entering pit lane , car comes round track unsighted and they clash, you will end up with a huge accident and possibly one of them hitting the seperator wall end on ,
          Its a good call for safety but one that should have been done before now and in a better manor.

      4. Well said Geoff.

    12. Massa’s blunder cost Ferrari second place in WCC. Finishing the race 4th (instead of 7th) would have netted an extra 6 points, and moved Rosberg down one position (and 2 points less). Would’ve been Ferrari 360, Merc 358.

      1. @billy59824 Massa’s whole mediocre season cost Ferrari the second place.

        1. You are usually a quiet character, @silence (pun intended) but that comment was spot on! :-D

          1. @gdewilde Haha, amazing pun :P

        2. Gordito Huevon
          29th November 2013, 2:52

          Simple truth

      2. Wake up guys! That’s exactly why they gave him the penalty, they needed Mercedes in 2nd postion…

        1. Yeah . And they needed to give Lewis a penalty just to help Merc get 2nd . what a load of crap .

    13. Yeah, quite a pointless penalty, I mean why was it acceptable for Vettel to leave the circuit several times on his India pole lap but now Massa receives a penalty for cutting the pit line, he didn’t gain much if any advantage, and before people ask “Why did he do it then?” Well, Massa has driven hundreds of laps around Interlagos, if you drive hundreds of laps around a circuit you can drive it on instinct and not think about the racing line, so he was probably cutting the pit line not consciously realising he was doing something incorrect. I know the penalty was technically correct but I’m getting bored of this FIA steward decision lottery where some drivers get away with something significant e.g. Hulkenberg overtake Korea 2012. Yet some drivers get a penalty for a minor infringement such as Massa, we need consistency in the sport but so long as every steward has a favourite driver it’s not going to happen.

      1. All drivers saw the picture before the race together with the warning that the stewards will not accepts drivers crossing the C-D line with all 4 wheels.
        I saw the picture before the race in an article about the warning.
        It was mentioned in the TV broadcast.
        Only Massa was stupid enough to cross it with all 4 wheels.
        The stewards had do something when they made the warning.

        1. Yes, I agree the penalty was justified but why is exceeding track limits acceptable some races and not others, seems weird they’re being strict on this particular part of the track, what advantage do you gain by cutting the pit entry line, a miniscule amount I would imagine.

    14. “The race today would have been in the fourth place and maybe even third, you know, Fernando was maybe going to back off at the end, you know, let me by.”
      COTD. This was as likely as Vettel letting Webber by.

      1. No way. Definitely would have let him past. Alonso was so done with the whole season, he just wanted some solidarity with anyone but Vettel.

        1. Alonso himself confirmed in an interview w/ SKYF1 available on their website that he would’ve let Massa through…

    15. I don’t think it is his frustration… He means the rules. The rules in F1 are ridiculous. Give that more with stewards who can’t make good decisions

      1. Hence why the FIA need to employ a team full-time traveling stewards who “officiate” each GP, to ensure both professionalism and consistency in the implementation of the rules, and not this Mickey Mouse BS that has ruined much of the racing…

        1. @joepa yes. The standards were hugely different between Interlagos , Abu Dhabi and India . Quite Naturally so as the people were different . There has to be more precise rules and must not be track specific .

    16. Vettel did the same thing in the last corner of the race! He is glorified as a record breaker and Massa is penalised for the same thing! Outrageous!

      1. Ferrari to protest … Seb gets a 20 second penalty – can almost hear Horner:
        “Mark Webber, you are the winner of the Brasilian Grand Prix. Fantastic Mark, fantastic!”

        1. Even Ted on Sky said Vettel crossed the line on the last lap…without penalty….so its feasible there could be a protest, and there could be a penalty added to Vettel…and possibly Mark could get the race win…..Unlikely??? well it is F1
          But lets have rules fairly applied next year..

      2. Outrageous my foot. First of all, he didn’t, and the line he crossed isn’t the one we’re talking about. What are you going to take away a drivers victory and two records on the last corner? That’d make F1 real popular. And Webber doesn’t want some garbage victory hours after the race is over. And the champion can do whatever he wants as he comes in at the end. And there were no pit stops left so the point of the rule, safety, was irrelevant. And again, Vettel didn’t break the rule anyway.

      3. Vettel crossed the white line between points A & B which is allowed.

        Massa got the penalty for crossing the 2nd line between points C & D.

        The penalty for Massa was 100% fair & Vettel does NOT deserve a penalty because he didn’t break the rules.

        1. You see in this picture that Vettel did not cross the line between points C & D-

    17. “I didn’t do anything wrong”

      Er… yes you did.

    18. Question to Keith or anyone else that has better F1 coverage, info, interviews etc.
      Did Massa received the penalty directly or did he get warnings before it (during the race I mean) ? Why Webber got only a warning, a few laps later (after Massa got the penalty) ? If I understood the communication from the pits to Webber, it was something like “don’t do it again, we will not get any more warnings” ?


      1. Massa also got a warning.

        Sky showed that he crossed the line between points C & D at least twice & we heard a radio call from Rob Smedley telling him not to do it again.

    19. Racetrack positions are decided at Stewarts office and not at track, that’s unacceptable. This is where they should use their heads but they don’t. Nobody else was hurt by his move so why penalize him with that kind of punishment? They could have penalized him with a fee and nobody had complained about it. I mean Lewis ended Bottas race (and that’s pretty much worse), and was equally penalized, so they need to use their heads a little bit more and don’t read everything by the book.

    20. F1 is on a ridiculous path with all this enforcement of rules. It hampers true racing and often focusing on contra producing details, it’s gone to far. Let them race about it and sometime crash.

    21. I mean they are already driving the safest cars of all time, so don’t regulate every tiny detail that possibly could be a threat to safety. Let them fight for positions on track and the point system will have a
      self regulating effect on driving sooner or later. The issue for Lotus last year with Grosjan was not the safety of others, it was lost points. Lost points means lost money and everbody knows, with no money no racing.

    22. Massa got a penalty for nothing! Ridiculous stewarding is ridiculous.

    23. Didn’t Vettle did the same at the last lap ? Just watch the replay and I see crossing the line …

    24. I saw Vettel cross this line on the last lap. Where is his drive-through penalty?

      Inconsistent applications of the rules is making a mockery of the entire stewarding system.

      1. The line Vettel crossed was the line there allowed to cross.

        There are 2 segments to the pit entry line. The 1st is a single white line & they are allowed to cross that, However it then forks into 2 lines with stripes inbetween & that was the area they are not allowed to cross.

        In this picture you see that Vettel did not cross that 2nd line on the final lap-

        1. You and your fancy “facts” and “pictures”! He’s guilty because Vettel.

          1. Wow. Somebody is upset! Don’t get yourself too bothered, it’s only a sport. ;-)

        2. I wasn’t aware there was a distinction between the two different pit entry lines prior to posting. Thanks for the information.

      2. @oblong_cheese Check your eyesight, or just look at it again on BBC iPlayer at 2:31:41:

        … and you shall see that Vettel did not cross the line on the last lap.

    25. I want to know where penalty for that idiot Maldonado is. Did I miss it? Not that it matters, he was rubbish in the race anyway, but to attempt a schumacher chop for 15th place against the second red bull teams second driver……….what a joke. Hes an embarrassment to the sport. Rather than **** the money into the hat of a formula one team; he and Cecotto Jr. should open up a venezuelan oil-money funded bumper cart track for children, but lets hope they dont attempt to teach kids how to drive.

    26. thankyou for the last 8 years felipe!

    27. Vettel did that too before the chequered flag but no action from the FIA!

    28. What was unacceptable was the attitude of Massa crying like a bitch after the team ask him to pass for the pits to take his penalty, good thing he is out of Ferrari next year

    29. While watching the race I was suprised by the penalty to Massa. I read F1Fanatic’s tweet about the pit entry before the race, so I knew that crossing that line was forbidden. Still, I saw him crossing the line only once, I didn’t know that there were warnings, so I was very surprised by the drive through.

      But now that I read how it happened I don’t understand why Massa is complaining. He was told not to cross that line more than once, he didn’t listen, he was punished and he still complained! I expect this kind of behaviour from a GP2 driver, not from a guy who has raced in F1 for many years. Very disappointing.

    30. Re Hamilton vs Bottas; see detailed rules below…

      When unlapping himself, Bottas created a situation where he immediately became a blue-flag candidate and a hindrance unless he cleared the Mercedes immediately – something that he could not do in the braking zone or on that bend. Any driver un-lapping themselves needs to have the express compliance of the “faster” or leading car to comply with the rules below because as soon as the lapped car is causing an aerodynamic hindrance ahead of the faster car it is liable to comply with a blue flag.
      It is also true in this case that Bottas had what can clearly be seen to be a tyre’s width before being crowded off of the track (see his own black skid-marks) and it can be seen by watching the vid. frame-by-frame that the Mercedes was actually pulling back to the left at the point of impact…

      20.5 Manoeuvres liable to hinder other drivers, such as deliberate crowding of a car beyond the edge of the track or any other abnormal change of direction, are not permitted.
      20.6 As soon as a car is caught by another car which is about to lap it during the race the driver must allow the faster driver past at the first available opportunity. If the driver who has been caught does not allow the faster driver past, waved blue flags will be shown to indicate that he must allow the following driver to overtake.

    31. Massa is right from a sporting perspective, but he was clearly over the line with 4 wheels. Stop stewards power to penelize drivers with track position punishment for that kind errors when nobody else are involved.

    32. I think Massa needs a lesson from Vettel on how to make a donut with your car…that was horribly funny to watch…

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