Renault seek gains after increased investment

89 comments on “Renault seek gains after increased investment”

1. 

   sato113 (@sato113)
   5th August 2016, 0:01

   German GP onboard highlights
   https://vimeo.com/177436690
   no worries ;)
   1. 

      Uzair Syed (@ultimateuzair)
      5th August 2016, 0:12

      Thanks mate! :)
   2. 

      lockup (@)
      5th August 2016, 11:37

      Thanks @sato113 :)
   3. 

      pastaman (@)
      5th August 2016, 13:28

      Dude @sato113, I’m telling you, if you keep posting that publicly it’s going to get taken down! I know it feels good to share the ‘secret’ everybody, but it won’t feel so good when it’s gone.
      1. 

         sato113 (@sato113)
         5th August 2016, 14:49

         @pastaman ha mate it’s not that top secret! Also do you think FOM are really looking at comments on here?
         Also it’s a video produced by Canal+ of France. It’s a bit like me sharing a video link to a skysports F1 or BBC F1 video online.
         1. 

            pastaman (@)
            7th August 2016, 13:41

            @sato113 Yes, except these videos used to be open to the general public, until FOM found out and made Canal+ restrict the video by country. And the guy who now releases the video on Vimeo so we can see it, he’s had to shut down multiple video channels because of FOM. So yes, FOM might not be watching this exact site, but they are monitoring the video sites.
2. 

   dam00r (@dam00r)
   5th August 2016, 0:13

   Did not believe that it would be possible for Mr.E to get more greedy
   1. 

      NJRF1
      5th August 2016, 0:35

      Would explain why FOM are reducing the number of transmissions broadcast. Increasingly the value through supply and demand.
   2. 

      @HoHum (@hohum)
      5th August 2016, 0:39

      @dam00r, How innocent U R, money was the whole reason the radio ban was so vaguely worded and strictly prosecuted by Bernies henchmen, and the reason it was abandoned . Bernie always gets his way and it is always about more money now.
   3. 

      GT Racer (@gt-racer)
      5th August 2016, 0:42

      @dam00r As I understand it the plan is for it to be a part of the existing premium F1 Access subscription that already gives you access to team radio snippets (And a few other features) as part of the mobile app.

      I also gather that its the 1st in a series of interesting additions that will be coming to the f1 access subscription service over the next 12 months or so.
      1. 

         GT Racer (@gt-racer)
         5th August 2016, 0:44

         People have been saying the premium side of the app wasn’t really worth it for the team radio snippets & odd bits of exclusive video so there now looking at including more exclusive content to make it more worthy of consideration & as I said in past comment there is more stuff planned including some stuff fans have been asking for.
         1. 

            BasCB (@bascb)
            5th August 2016, 7:12

            It certainly seems like something that makes huge sense @gt-racer. This would finally makes the premium version of the app something one might actually feel the need to pay up for.

            If it works, that is
            1. 

               Stubborn Swiss (@stubbornswiss)
               5th August 2016, 11:27

               The only problem being that as they add more content to the premium access site, we can be sure the subscription cost will go up.

               Afterall it’s Bernie, isn’t it?
         2. 

            lockup (@)
            5th August 2016, 11:47

            Good to know @gt-racer.

            The website and the whole online product is shockingly poor. I hope they think how to integrate the radio properly.

            Atm I have a phone for the timing, laptop for the cars they haven’t fitted onto the HD App screen (but with less data), another phone for the driver tracker (which isn’t gps and jumps wildly) and the TV. I can’t record the onboards because it’s red button, and they never re-show them.

            It’s a mess. We can only hope that now Bernie has discovered there’s $$$ in it someone will get a grip on it.
            1. 

               GT Racer (@gt-racer)
               5th August 2016, 13:58

               @lockup “another phone for the driver tracker (which isn’t gps and jumps wildly)”

               Correct, The driver tracker is generated via the timing loops rather than GPS.

               Every car does carry GPS systems & both the FIA & FOM do have access to them but FOM don’t use it for the driver tracker as its easier & faster to have everything go through the timing system. They do use the GPS for post race extra things like the 3D analysis they have been making available to broadcasters which only Sky have used but everything that’s sent out live uses the timing loops.
            2. 

               GT Racer (@gt-racer)
               5th August 2016, 14:38

               This is what I was talking about when I mentioned the 3D analysis that FOM are providing to broadcasters this year-
               https://vid.me/biY4

               All broadcasters have access to those tools but as far as I am aware only sky have actually used them this year a few times.
            3. 

               falken (@falken)
               10th August 2016, 20:41

               It’s trivial to alter the website in order to display sector times. The data is happily being sent to you, it’s just a matter of making it displayed.
3. 

   John H (@john-h)
   5th August 2016, 0:13

   That Vettel incident was quite interesting . I wonder had that happened a couple of races ago he would have just kept cruising, with the team not able to tell him to get back on the throttle!
   1. 

      Strontium (@strontium)
      5th August 2016, 0:36

      I’m sure the penalty would have been much less than the cruising.

      Also, I believe teams were allowed to say things like “push now” and “last lap”. Amazed that it took that long for them to realise though.
   2. 

      @HoHum (@hohum)
      5th August 2016, 0:42

      Did we miss the bit when SV told the pitwall ” Stop bothering me, I know what I’m doing”.
   3. 

      NewVerstappenFan (@jureo)
      5th August 2016, 20:01

      Lol, Vettel clearly out of his zone. Poor guy.
4. 

   just.daz (@nemo87)
   5th August 2016, 0:17

   Surely I can’t be the only one super exited for F1 2016 after the latest trailers!? :)

   Looks like they’ve made huge gains since the last few instalments! Personally think this years game looks fantastic!
   1. 

      Biggsy
      5th August 2016, 0:22

      You sound like it’s 2003, getting excited for the game because of the trailer…
      Experience says that most games today seem to be all about the trailer, while the game itself is left behind. What we have thees days can be put in one sentence. Style over substance.
      1. 

         GT Racer (@gt-racer)
         5th August 2016, 0:46

         Initial feedback of the game from those who have played it at events has been positive.

         Sounds like they have fixed things that players didn’t like in past installments & added some things that again players have been asking for. Something i’ve been seeing is that they have made the handling & overall feel of the driving more realistic based on how well the recent Dirt Rally game went over because of its more sim focus.
      2. 

         Strontium (@strontium)
         5th August 2016, 0:49

         I agree, sadly.

         It’s such a shame, the trailers always misrepresent these things so much. F1 games often start out exciting, then after a few races, once you’ve got to know your way around the game, everything just becomes boring.

         Also, I’ve noticed with codemasters, every year they switch the focus to something else. In 2010 it was online and custom races, in 2011 it was career, in 2012 it was quick game options and career, in 2013 it was classics, in 2014 it was absolutely nothing (they were so busy working on 2015 they released 2013 just with the new cars and without the classics), I didn’t get 2015 so I can’t remember, but here we are in 2016, back to career again. They just go round and pick something else to make slightly better while the rest of the game is exactly the same. A shame really. They make minor tweaks to something, then ruin it for the next year just so they can claim they’ve improved it again the year after.

         I was looking at the trailers and what’s available of gameplay for Forza Horizon 3, and it’s incredible just how advanced the entire game is. Stunning graphics, handling like no other game, the entire map done bit by bit. F1 by comparison is embarrassing. They have an entire year to do really do something brilliant to improve it in whatever way they possibly can, and all they do is change the lighting and add a new menu location. Or reintroduce features they took out of the previous game, to advertise their introduction.
         1. 

            Gerulf Dösinger (@)
            5th August 2016, 1:12

            Actually, I think they might just get it right this year. I’ve seen extensive gameplay footage yesterday night and the whole experience seems to be enriched on all aspects.

            I felt that it all looks very lively with some neat things like (semi-)manual pit-lane speed limiting, fully manual formation lap and safety care phases (plus vsc-delta), plausible tyre-strategy scenarios (before and while the race is on) including realistic tyre-allocation for the weekend. The “car-development” game-mechanics look nice too, although I suspect this part might get repetitive soon.

            Driving model will surely be very arcade once again, so let’s just hope the best.

            The last two years renditions were cheap money-grabbing crap games and the last time I bought the game was the 2013 one but this one looks promising. I may even buy this one blindely if the reviews are not too bad. Could turn out to be a fun racer.

            FOM seems to have been way easier on game-development restrictions.

            I agree on the horrible “on-off” feature policy Codemasters executed in the last years, made me lose all of my hope that we might get a good F1 game ever again (compared mostly to Geoff Crammonds GrandPrix series).
            1. 

               KnGS (@)
               5th August 2016, 3:40

               Cheap money grabbing?
            2. 

               glacierre
               5th August 2016, 4:31

               >>The last two years renditions were cheap money-grabbing crap games and the last time I bought the game was the 2013 one but this one looks promising. I may even buy this one blindely…

               Man, the stone, tripping, tripping, tripping…
            3. 

               Gerulf Dösinger (@)
               5th August 2016, 7:38

               @godoff1 Cheap in the sense of Codemasters demanding the full-price in two consecutive years while offering no new interesting features, in fact they even downgraded their product massively in 2015.

               Oh, and @glacierre. What tripping stone are you referring to? I guess you think I played 2014 and 2015 as pirated copies, is it like that? If you think so I can assure you I didn’t. In fact I tried F12014 beforehand, looked around the game for five minutes and saw it was the same as F12013 just with upgraded licence. Verdict: not worth the money, immediate uninstall, not a single lap driven. And with F12015, it was clear I wouldn’t buy it. Watched a few YT reviews, not worth a single Euro spent on this.
   2. 

      zimkazimka (@zimkazimka)
      5th August 2016, 9:46

      I’m just hoping Motorsport Manager from SEGA is as good as it looks. Can’t wait till September release.
   3. 

      DavidTyrrellF1 (@davidtyrrell)
      5th August 2016, 12:16

      Compared to the last two years of F1 games from Codemasters this is massive step forward. It’s the most immersive F1 game they produced and is more aimed at building an F1 career than just hopping in a car as a current driver.
5. 

   Chris (@tophercheese21)
   5th August 2016, 0:40

   So there’s now been two tests with the new fatter tyres, but has anyone heard what the drivers actually think of them? I’ve not seen any quotes from any of them.
   1. 

      photozen (@photozen)
      6th August 2016, 1:02

      I have wanted to know the same thing, but I haven’t found anything yet.
      Seems like folks would want to know more about them, I know I do.
6. 

   Davy
   5th August 2016, 1:25

   Riccardo at first? That makes no sense.
   1. 

      Sravan Krishnan (@sravan-pe)
      5th August 2016, 8:49

      It does.
   2. 

      Duncan Idaho (@)
      5th August 2016, 23:19

      OCD for alphabetical order?
7. 

   Jay Menon (@jaymenon10)
   5th August 2016, 1:36

   http://www.autosport.com/premium/feature/7118/why-ferrari-needs-boullier

   I pretty much knew the journos would end up here.

   They are right, Ferrari need an Eric Boullier type. However, I doubt this will solve the problem. The team needs to restructure. Arrivabene needs to push through the changes that would allow a racing director type to do his job and not play Game of Thrones at Maranello.

   I dont see Eric leaving Mclaren in the near term. He’s probably invested way too much of his blood and sweat into Mclaren’s current project, which is showing all the signs of bearing fruit.

   Ferrari need help, but it has to be top down. Sergio Marchionne needs to take a step back, sign the cheques, and let the team get on with its job. Is Arrivabene the right person to lead the team? Not on the pitwall, but as CEO, most probably.
   1. 

      BasCB (@bascb)
      5th August 2016, 7:17

      I think if Eric Boullier is the racer in his heart he is supposed to be, coping with McLaren big organisation is one thing, but surely going to Ferrari, where the Factory politics is a huge, almost incremental part of the fabric, and certainly a huge part of their problem, would not be something he would want.

      Honestly, I don’t even think Ferrari needs to restructure, or even that they would help themselves by doing so @jaymenon10. What I think they should do is to stop meddling with the race team, shield it off from reacting to unpatient Italian press and just get on with using all their resources. They do need someone to head the team and be this “shield”. And yes, they do need replacement for Allison.
8. 

   Armchair Expert (@foreverred)
   5th August 2016, 1:55

   A question that no-one seems to be asking is what happens to Red Bull WHEN!!! Renault become competitive. There is surely going to be conflict if it’s Red Bull that is stopping Renault from winning. It’s going to become tasty again.
   1. 

      Jay Menon (@jaymenon10)
      5th August 2016, 2:44

      @foreverred

      Haha..that would be interesting wouldnt it?
   2. 

      Dom (@3dom)
      5th August 2016, 12:42

      @foreverred I said the same thing to my wife and friend. Renault will lie in bed with Red Bull for as long as it’s advantageous for them, but as soon as they make strides up the grid then there will be less cooperation.

      We’ve seen how important it has been to be a “works team” since 2014. It’ll be interesting to see how important it is from 2017 onwards when the regulations chance and the engine development token system is scrapped. Even if it is still important, then out of all the teams, the team probably best equipped to succeed without that advantage would be Red Bull
   3. 

      Alec Glen (@alec-glen)
      5th August 2016, 13:20

      I think it’s fair to say that Renault are competitive now, not at the same level as Merc but close enough to be a real threat. Too often commentators say that Red Bull are slow in the speed traps but if you ask people in the know they say that Red Bull always carry more wing and therefore drag anyway. The amount of wing that they use other teams would see as being inefficient but RB must be able to squeeze more downforce/less drag out of it which must give them much more downforce for a limited amount of increased drag. This will make them slower through the speed traps but better on tyres, lap time and with an advantage on any straights off med-high speed corners.
9. 

   KnGS (@)
   5th August 2016, 3:44

   Renault pours money into the team yet they are still noodling around fighting for 15th place. And they can’t get half decent drivers. Bringing Vergne back would be good for Renault. Experience and Talent. Palmer is not looking too good. Kevin is driving finely but car performance is a major issue.
   1. 

      Craig Woollard (@craig-o)
      5th August 2016, 5:51

      Five year plans don’t come to into full effect overnight.
      1. 

         Ju88sy (@ju88sy)
         5th August 2016, 8:51

         This, the poor performance of this year Renault is a symptom of Enstone’s lack of money through 2015. Great news the funding is brought forward they can target a move towards the midfield in 2017, it will be 2018-19 before we see the fruits of the investment.

         I really love the Renault Sport Yellow, it’s a great livery.
      2. 

         bull mello (@bullmello)
         5th August 2016, 16:02

         @godoff1 @craig-o
         Not to mention that the 2016 car is a kludge since it was not originally designed for the power plant it is using. Next season should prove a better measure of progress for the team no matter who is driving.
   2. 

      2face
      5th August 2016, 6:24

      Talk is cheap. They sound more and more like McLaren and Ferrari.
   3. 

      BasCB (@bascb)
      5th August 2016, 7:22

      I think you fall to the same trap that has Ferrari going into self destructive cycles of firing by impatience @godoff1.

      Renault mentioned a 5 year timeline. And if you look at McLaren and how they fared with new engine partner Honda, that is the kind of path you should expect. First year they really are no where (although Renault seems to have at least solved most of the big issues with the engine by now, McLaren is still somewhat behind on that). The second year they should have at lease a somewhat workable chassis with a solid engine, helping them to get into the points regularly.

      After that, the really hard work begins – building a car that really beats the opposition. It will be 3-4 years into the foray before they can hope to finish in the top 5 of the championship. But maybe they get it right and will be able to be in the championship battle by year 4-5.
      1. 

         KnGS (@)
         5th August 2016, 8:24

         Right guys. I forgot about the 5 year timeline. JEV still is not that old. He would do well as a guide to them in Renault’s return. Magnussen will become like Perez in 2 or 3 years. Scoring consistently. You have a point there @bascb. Palmer….well he is not horrible but he does not seem as exciting as JEV when he first came in 2012 or Hamilton in 2007. Ocon and JEV are French. French and Talented = A happy Renault.

         Oh and PS What are Renault’s plans with Sergey Sirotkin?
         1. 

            BasCB (@bascb)
            5th August 2016, 10:08

            I am sure that if Renault can get Ocon in the car, they will be on it (probably depends on Mercedes too though) @godoff1. Let’s see how Sirotkin goes this year in GP2, he seems to have picked himself up, sorted out the incidents and is on a solid path. If he can improve further this year, and brings money, I can see him being at Renault next year (unless they can really get Ocon).
            Isn’t JEV still in the Ferrari stable as test driver? I don’t really see him emerging as a candidate at Renault.

            As for Palmer, yeah he has not impressed a lot. When we look back to his GP2 career, maybe he is a driver who needs a bit more time to adapt. Time one doesn’t get in F1. So I would be rather surprised if they kept him on.
            1. 

               lockup (@)
               5th August 2016, 12:00

               @bascb Manor have been sounding unsure of keeping Wehrlein. I would not be amazed if Merc moved him to Renault to continue his apprenticeship and maybe Ocon into Manor so he can start on the bottom rung preparing for Renault in a couple of years when they should be mid/upper grid.

               Anyway it’s cheering news about Renault.
            2. 

               BasCB (@bascb)
               5th August 2016, 12:33

               Why would Manor be unsure of keeping Wehrlein (you mean, they are not sure Mercedes will not want to move him further up the grid?) @lockup?

               Still not too sure Renault would want to cooperate on that one (they would prbably be more happy with French Ocon) and for Wehrlein it would be better to have a second year in the same team, especially if Manor can build upon the solid base they have. And since they scored points this year, it’s quite possible that they will be able to keep their FOM payments going to have money to build with.
            3. 

               lockup (@)
               5th August 2016, 13:00

               Can’t find it now @bascb but I was reading an item where Manor were saying they ‘hoped’ they’d be able to keep Wehrlein for next year. He’s just on a 1-year contract. I see Autosport are floating the idea of Perez to Renault and Wehlein to FI. I suppose that might make more sense, engine partner wise.

               Though Ocon is a Merc driver isn’t he? With the various ages and experience I could see him being a fit at Manor, then moving up to Renault later, while Werhlein moves up a rung to FI before Merc in 2019.
            4. 

               Optimaximal (@optimaximal)
               5th August 2016, 21:54

               You guys discounting a Merc-stable driver to Renault are missing that Daimler owns 3% of Renault & vice-versa. Rumour has it befor Red Bull roped Ilmor into fix the engine, Daimler we’re going to send Merc HPE engineers in.
         2. 

            PorscheF1 (@xtwl)
            5th August 2016, 10:08

            @godoff1 JEV wasn’t that good, you give him too much credit. There is more potential in Magnussen and Ocon than JEV.
            1. 

               KnGS (@)
               5th August 2016, 12:39

               @xtwl But JEV is that bit better than Palmer. And in my opinion JEV has more experience. Yes @bascb he is still with Ferrari but he would be good with a new team like Renault. That and he is French.
   4. 

      Armchair Expert (@foreverred)
      5th August 2016, 12:51

      @godoff1
      It’s this type of thinking why i’ve fell out of love with football after United sacked LVG, fans expect things to work instantly because you spent more than everybody else, only see the negatives, only see what they want to see to further their agenda, there needs to be a long term solution, you need to build and grow together, survive the pit falls, but everybody nowadays expect Rome to be built in a day, Mercedes were not built in a day, neither was Red Bull. Thats why the English national team is s£$t, expect everything to work instantly and if it doesn’t it’s time for a change. I’d rather Renault have a plan and be the next Mercedes or Red Bull rather than be just be like those unstable souls down at Marranello. Lets look at 1 of the positive for Renault, their engine can now keep Red Bull in front of Ferrari for a whole race, compared to last year it would just be demolished. Long term is the only way forward in F1 and most team sports, im sure Mclaren know that, thats why i believe they will be challengers for the title before Ferrari are.
10. 

    PorscheF1 (@xtwl)
    5th August 2016, 6:14

    If football players can respect a simple white line with the help of four guys standing there with some flags I’m pretty sure F1 drivers would so too if they knew it was being detected via a electronic device. No need for all the cries for gravel or the nonsense Toto is trying to sell. Track limits is the easiest problem the FIA have on their to-do list yet they don’t seem to grasp that.
    1. 

       ColdFly F1 (@)
       5th August 2016, 6:26

       Fair point @xtwl, but they haven’t sorted out how to throw-in an F1 car ;-)
    2. 

       BasCB (@bascb)
       5th August 2016, 7:26

       I agree @xtwl. The white lines are the border of the pitch. Put more than 2 wheels over it and your lap should be discounted, and in the race a penalty should hover over you. Either hand out points on the licence, give time penalties or something.

       But off course the first step should be telling the drivers that there will be no more of this “gained an advantage” consideration up front. Let the drivers get used to the idea over the summer break. When I go 53 kmh in town I also get an automatic penalty when a radar measures it, no one is interested in whether I gain anything from doing so or not.
       1. 

          PorscheF1 (@xtwl)
          5th August 2016, 9:20

          @bascb Yes! Everyone is stuck on ‘oh but he didn’t gain an advantage’. I don’t care, at all costs you need to stay within the white lines. Obviously one can lock-up and go wide, or one needs to take avoiding action, that’s why you use a system to determine the amount of trespasses but a steward to decide on a penalty.
          1. 

             Robbie (@robbie)
             5th August 2016, 12:24

             Sure they could easily make it like there are virtual walls around every track, via sensors like in tennis, or referees like football, or photo radar like on domestic roadways. But how much slower do you think F1 is willing to make lap times when the appetite by them and fans is for faster cars and lower lap times? Should drivers be able to define their own track? No. But nor do I think virtual walls is the answer either. Not unless folks want less racing and higher lap times in an already ultra-conservative format.

             Perhaps let’s leave any hard and fast rules until the wider cars and tires are back and then determine the new lap times and perhaps different abilities to keep cars within lines due to said new format cars. Perhaps the added mechanical grip…the very nature of the new cars, will make for drivers able to better stay within limits while maintaining speeds and lowering lap times.
             1. 

                PorscheF1 (@xtwl)
                5th August 2016, 16:23

                @colfly @bascb @robbie faster cars and lower lap times?

                Faster cars, yes. Lower laptime, not interested. People don’t want to go back to V10s because it would decrease laptime, it’s for the sound of it. People don’t want different aero because of laptime, they want it so cars can overtake. In the end your logic to go from virtual walls leading to less racing is flawed as neither has anything to do with the other. Opening the white lines would not lead to more goals in football.

                Your second alines implies (or that’s how I read it) that is it is difficult for drivers to stay within the white lines. I don’t see it like that at all. They know they can gain an advantage there so they just don’t bother.

                For as long as they don’t get penalised for it either, only when they actually overtake someone, they’re going to abuse the tracks, they don’t deserve corners like Eau Rouge if they are going to straight line it, they don’t deserve Ascari if they don’t have to work on a proper exit, they don’t deserve the Stowe or Copse if they don’t need to stay within the freaking white lines!
             2. 

                Robbie (@robbie)
                5th August 2016, 17:34

                @xtwl As the commentary went on Sky during the last race, drivers are not the ones to trust in that they will always look for any advantage. So if there’s a rule for track limits at some corners but not all, they will bend the rules as much as they can get away with, and that’s because they are racers.

                Of course the drivers are well capable of keeping within white lines if it becomes a hard and fast rule. All I’m saying is that if they were to make it so written in stone such that there might as well be walls there, then there will be less variation in drivers’ approach and exit to corners, more processions, less passing attempts, slower lap times. It is not about you not caring for lower lap times…most people including F1 itself seem to want faster cars, lower lap times, closer racing, less processions. To me forcing the drivers to race in more and more Monaco like circumstances does not help the direction many inside and outside F1 seem to want it to go.

                You say drivers don’t ‘deserve’ certain corners if they can’t stay within the white lines…do the fans deserve stifled drivers who have to tiptoe around tracks, races decided by the stewards as they add up penalty after penalty?
             3. 

                PorscheF1 (@xtwl)
                6th August 2016, 8:58

                @robbie There is no link between respecting track limits and the quantity of overtaking. So your entire arguement of saying driver will have to tip toe around the track and there will be more of a procession is nonsense. Drivers can still outdrag others if they have a proper exit out of Ascari, Eau Rouge or can still outbrake people into Stowe or Copse if they know they know they have to respect their the white line on their exit.

                You’re also straight away jumping to the conclusion there will be many penalties deciding the race outcome. Well, I believe if a simple electronic detection system is in place drivers won’t go wide that often, and there won’t be penalties. Just 22 drivers respecting track limits.
          2. 

             ColdFly F1 (@)
             5th August 2016, 12:41

             I’d prefer less rules and policing, @bascb, @xtwl.
             Circuits should just make it ‘physically unattractive’ to leave the track; that can be grass, gravel, slippery surface, or just annoying rumble strips. Whatever works best in the specific case as a natural deterrent to find a faster route, and have a direct impact if they inadvertently still ‘cross the line’.
             1. 

                BasCB (@bascb)
                5th August 2016, 12:54

                yeah, I agree that should the the target. But we saw how most of the solutions tracks have come up with were then removed once the cars got racing on them BECAUSE they abused it nontheless @coldfly.

                Graveltraps, sousage kerbs, speedbumps, the kerbing at turn 1 in Hockenheim etc, all have seen cars launched in the air when sufficiently abused. We do not need complicated policing. Just tell the drivers that there will be no tolerance for going off track, maybe put in sensors for the first few races to make a point.

                I am convinced that ALL drivers ARE fully able to keep to track limits when they know they have to. Thing is, once you make it clear that just no part of the car is allowed off track at all (unless maybe when one can prove without doubt that it was due to an issue, etc. – burden of proof with the culprit) with the white line being the track limit, you have a very simple border, you don’t need much in the way of complicated devices to police it.
             2. 

                Gabriel (@rethla)
                5th August 2016, 13:11

                @bascb Are you saying you dont want any more kerbs and just white lines with all 4 wheels inside of it?
             3. 

                BasCB (@bascb)
                5th August 2016, 14:42

                I am fine with kerbs lining the corners, I just don’t think that when the kerbs are outside the white lines that define the track, drivers should be allowed to be driving on them and even behind them @rethla
             4. 

                PorscheF1 (@xtwl)
                5th August 2016, 16:30

                @coldfly Please also read my comment above.

                I agree we should have less rules, and gravel but sadly that is no longer of this time. We can want whatever but it’s not coming back. These electronic devices however work brilliantly and do what they need to do. Also, sure there should be less rules but maybe it’s just sane to have that rule. You don’t say ‘we shouldn’t have a rule against shooting people, because we already have rules you can’t do drugs’.

                Guarding track limits by the governing body is what makes the best drivers in the world to use every inch of their talent to keep a fast race car going fast on a track.
             5. 

                ColdFly F1 (@)
                5th August 2016, 17:19

                @xtwl, I don’t mind the ‘electronic devices’, but I do mind that the pain comes later and there is a (potentially seen as) arbitrary body in between.

                Maybe link those ‘electronic devices’ to an immediate loss of MGU-K for a certain amount of time (like a 21st century ‘gravel trap’)
             6. 

                Michael Brown (@)
                6th August 2016, 0:19

                @coldfly I don’t agree with a cut to power. In a high speed section of the track, the safest speed to rejoin the track is at the same speed that everyone else is going. The FIA just needs to actually enforce its track limits rules, rather than caving when the drivers all go off track.
             7. 

                anon
                6th August 2016, 9:01

                @coldfly, the thing is, it could be argued that we had such a situation in Austria when they introduced the new style of kerbs on the outside of the track, which caused suspension failures on a number of cars if they hit them too hard and therefore made it less attractive to run wide on the exit of the corner. However, we saw that there was a fairly sizeable backlash against that type of kerb, both amongst the fan base and amongst the drivers and teams.
    3. 

       ram
       5th August 2016, 16:02

       You have Nailed it!
       If they are not skilled enough to drive on “the track” get better drivers.
       They didn’t run into the walls in Monaco or Bacu. They choose to disregard the track.
       1. 

          Robbie (@robbie)
          5th August 2016, 17:41

          Yeah that’s great if you want all tracks to provide as little passing as Monaco does. It’s not about drivers not being skilled enough to stay within the lines. They’re racing. They’re trying to go faster than everyone else. There’s so little racing as it is that isn’t because of DRS or widely different tires or tire states, and now you want to handcuff the drivers even more.
          Anyway, imho they should see how the racing is starting next year before they make any hard and fast rules about track limits.
    4. 

       Sensord4notbeingafanboi (@peartree)
       5th August 2016, 18:35

       @xtwl I don’t think it’s quite the same thing, although often, football pitches have either astroturph or steep drops that deter anyone from going outside the white lines, just like F1.
11. 

    Nu
    5th August 2016, 6:18

    Renault is selling KEV this season – junk car with a sleeping pit who allways mis the right tyre strategi… give KEV a chance in a fast car and we will see his potential. He is as good as any top f1 driver.. dont forget his former merits..he won everything…
    1. 

       anon
       6th August 2016, 9:17

       Nu, Jan Magnussen, Kevin’s father, was also extremely successful as a junior driver – I believe than Jan still holds the record for the most dominant Formula 3 season ever, with 14 wins from 18 races – and also had a strong record as a test driver for McLaren.

       However, when Stewart signed him, he performed nowhere near as strongly as his junior career suggested he should have done. Jackie Stewart later noted that he was hopelessly disorganised and had a relatively poor understanding of the technical aspects of a race car, resulting in poor driver feedback and endless struggles with setting the car up, as well as lacking the drive and interest needed to improve his knowledge in those areas.

       From what has leaked out of McLaren and Renault, it sounds as if, in some ways, Kevin has taken after some of Jan’s worst traits as well – he has also been criticised for being too passive and disengaged when it comes to developing a car and providing technical feedback. Kevin might be quick in a well sorted car, but it sounds as if he lacks the skills and knowledge to spearhead the development of a car and is ultimately lacking in a number of key areas.
12. 

    WheelToWheel (@lolzerbob)
    5th August 2016, 7:45

    Renault are just trying to lure Bottas and Perez to join them. Also they want Ocon, but what’s the point of having this talent when Mercedes takes him away when he realises his potential
    1. 

       PorscheF1 (@xtwl)
       5th August 2016, 9:18

       @lolzerbob Perez and Bottas? Please elaborate?
       1. 

          WheelToWheel (@lolzerbob)
          5th August 2016, 11:32

          Perez – http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/125518

          Bottas –
          http://m.mtv.fi/sport/f1/uutinen/artikkeli/kommentti-bottaksella-jopa-vara-valita-poydalla-toinenkin-tarjous/6011422

          For both drivers it’s either Williams or Renault for 2017
          1. 

             ColdFly F1 (@)
             5th August 2016, 12:26

             For both drivers it’s either Williams or Renault for 2017

             Or Force India in the case of Perez, @lolzerbob. He has a signed ’17 contract after all!
    2. 

       DavidTyrrellF1 (@davidtyrrell)
       5th August 2016, 12:20

       Would be a odd move by Perez if so but by recent reports his sponsors are the boss and he’ll go where they say. I’d like to see Bottas at Renault and do well. All he has achieved at Williams is podiums. He wants to win races and Renault have the plan, I think, to do that in the next 3 years.
    3. 

       Bustertje (@datt)
       5th August 2016, 12:20

       Will someone please enlighten me how Ocon can both be a driver for Mercedes and Renault?
       1. 

          Robbie (@robbie)
          5th August 2016, 13:59

          I believe he’s a Mercedes guy on loan to Renault.
          1. 

             KnGS (@)
             5th August 2016, 14:14

             I believe he’s a Renault guy on loan to Mercedes. We may never know… Ocon should stick with Renault.
13. 

    Nu
    5th August 2016, 14:49

    I can’t see what Renault would gain – both KEV And PAL know what they are doing, they are talented race winners from other series and MAG have a f1 podium – now they know the crew and the car. They want to work hard for getting up front…they are young and in 2017 they are the most Renault experienced..
    Renault don’t want a star banning the car every second it doesn’t perform – like Alonso or Perez would.. have you ever heard MAG or PAL complaining even when the pit is ruining their race and make them look like fools..never..
14. 

    Sensord4notbeingafanboi (@peartree)
    5th August 2016, 18:30

    Hilarious photoshop and an unbelievable post from Hulk, that’s bold. I can’t depict the floor changes on the Ferrari and RB test cars but it’s easy to spot that RB isn’t, like Ferrari using a wide rear wing. Ferrari one step ahead or is RB just making sure they understand to what extent, the wider tyres change their car.
    1. 

       Optimaximal (@optimaximal)
       5th August 2016, 22:07

       @peartree The teams participating in these tyre tests are not allowed to run genuine 2017 parts, they have to run whatever they feel they need to run to simulate 2017 conditions on the 2015 cars being using (sort of like when Williams ran that dual-layer rear wing).

       Also, every iota of CAD, sensor and running data has to be freely shared between the 3 teams running, the FIA and the other teams not participating. In a nutshell, if they took the chance to run a clever trick design on their car, not only would the other teams see it, but they’d have every single bit of data needed to recreate it.

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