Carlos Sainz Jnr, Fernando Alonso, Circuit Gilles Villeneuve, 2015

Alonso deserves more titles – Sainz

F1 Fanatic Round-up

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In the round-up: Carlos Sainz Jnr says Fernando Alonso deserves to have won more F1 championship titles.

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Antonio Felix da Costa, Carlin, Macau, F3, 2016
Antonio Felix da Costa, Carlin, Macau, F3, 2016

Antonio Felix da Costa won yesterday’s qualifying race for the Macau Grand Prix and will start the main event today from pole position. UK viewers can watch live coverage of the race on BT Sport 3 from 7:30am, which I’ll be introducing.

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Tristan tackles the idea that there is no close racing in F1 at the moment:

This is a huge misunderstanding I think. In any given race there’s always close racing. It may not be wheel-to-wheel or between those in the lead, but with an understanding of everyone in the race and their machinery, it doesn’t take too much following of the time sheets to figure out what’s worth keeping an eye on.

If anything what annoys me is how little that’s revealed through the broadcast. The smaller teams rarely get a mention unless they’ve crashed out or find themselves well out of position as they were in Brazil.
Tristan

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  • 73 comments on “Alonso deserves more titles – Sainz”

    1. To each their own, the F1 I 1st. knew was a battle at close quarters on the track dependant on skill, bravery and luck, the cerebral side of the competition took place back at the factory, or in many cases, garage where the engineers/designers brainstormed ideas to make the chassis corner better, make the engine more powerful or otherwise improve the cars performance.

      1. When was that again? Please point me to a season that accurately depicts this romantic vision that cannot be debunked in under 5 minutes.

        1. The next time four cars finish the Italian Grand Prix at Monza within a second of one another 1.2.3.4. after a terrifying to watch slip stream battle at over 190 mph in fragile death traps .

          1. What year was that? I’d like to review the results of all races that year.

            According to you and the OP every race should be identical to that.

            I don’t even have to bother though, since we both know it was a one off example.

          2. 190 at monza. Guess this was about 1953?

            Fans are really so desperate to cry for racing similar to what we had 70years ago?

            This is why F1 is failing. Fans.

            1. 1969 and then even closer in 1971 with Peter Gethin winning. I do not dispute that today’s drivers would be able to put on a similar show given the correct machinery but the grand prix cars of today cannot be driven in this way. Plus the sanitised circuits are frankly boring to the point of comatose. I have followed F1 since 1965 and the likes of Verstappen ,Max of course, have illuminated my twilight years but I am afraid the last few years have been dire . As an armchair critic we should not set ourselves as more credible than Fernando Alonso whose opinion of the latest breed of cars is well documented.Hopefully next year’s regulation changes will redress the boredom level to some degree , I live in hope.

        2. The Duke, try the early 60’s to early 70’s, unfortunately you’ll probably find very little and very poor film coverage of that time, the cars were not as fast as today but the racing was better.

          1. A man after my own heart ,the cars were not as fast , but a 450 bhp go kart capable of speeds up to 200mph driven at 10/10ths on circuits with virtually no safety consideration was awesome. Of course JYS. was absolutely correct to campaign for driver safety and many race drivers owe their lives to his vigorous efforts but even Sir J. surely can’t approve of today’s pantomime.

            1. Amen @jeffpowell.

            2. @jeff you mean you liked lottery racing for death? no safety, 200mph, no walls or speed traps, death race all the way… hmmm must be great to watch but bitch to be inside one of them…

      2. I think that’s a perfectly apt description of F1 today really. I’m missing where the huge disconnect is between the supposed F1 of past versus today.

        1. you can find that disconnect in the parking lot sized run off which 15/20 drivers use every race

          It’s no a feat to drive on the edge, because there’s no penalty for going over it

        2. No huge disconnect? DRS? Constant conservation? Gadget tires? Slow cars? Forgiving tracks?

          F1 may have never truly had constant nose to tail, side by side racing all race long, but at least drivers used to be taxed, and performed great feats.

          The more accurate question would be ‘Where has the connection to the past gone?’ Thankfully changes are coming that should start to address that concern. The very fact that such vast changes (never mind trying to project what they’ll mean until we see them race together) are happening, is an indication that F1 now gets the size of the disconnect that has been allowed to evolve. And that the current evolution has done nothing to improve the show and bolster viewership. Just the opposite.

          1. If you watch old races you will quickly hear them talking about tyre management and new fangled devices.

            1. Of course. As with all racing series. But never to the degree that has been purposely built into these tires. Nevermind combined with more parts and fuel conservation than ever, going on at the same time as the limiting tires.

              To slough off the state of the current formula, by claiming that’s the way it’s always been, is disingenuine, and ignores the facts. The degree of management of every aspect of these cars has never been so extreme, so simultaneously.

            2. To slough off the state of the current formula, by claiming that’s the way it’s always been, is disingenuine, and ignores the facts.

              Definitely that’s not what I was doing… If you follow along you’ll regularly see me opining on all sorts of areas where F1 can improve, or where it’s lost its way. I was speaking specifically in regards to @HoHum‘s description. I think those raw elements of the competition are all still evident today, despite whatever other issues there may be surrounding them.

            3. @Tristan In hindsight I could have been a bit more clear. My response was directed moreso to @mike for his comment about tire management and new tangled devices existing in the past.

            4. What’s the difference between tyres that are designed to wear and tyres that aren’t if the result is the same?

    2. petrov deserve a title too, what he did in 2010 is worth it

      1. and he didn’t move under braking, just old school clean defence! Who remembers scudera’s worst pit call that season

    3. I will start a campaign in change.org. Alonso deserves 8 WDC, an statue and his own holiday. Please support him. It’s obvious that he has take F-1 teams to the next level. With his samurai wisdom and strong will to develop F-1 cars, team spirit and incredible PR with his team, his team mates and his rivals.

      1. @camo8723 hahaha… And send the link of your petition to Nelson Piquet Jr. and Felipe Massa.

      2. Yes (@come-on-kubica)
        20th November 2016, 14:40

        I agree, hopefully they redact every the last decade of champions and give them all to Alonso.

      3. Well, he does have his own museum. Try for a minute to think what it would be like to have a museum dedicated to yourself!!… It’s pretty ridiculous to be honest. I hope Petrov has one :)

    4. Jonathan Parkin
      20th November 2016, 4:44

      Is it just me or would Vettel be slightly less passionate or sweary if his car allowed him to be in his favourite position i.e. The lead

      1. Yeah Captain obvious…
        What would he complain about being in front?

      2. Ignore all complaints, sweary or not, it’s when the troops, those who go out and do battle, AKA drivers, stop complaining that the officers, those in comfortable quarters miles from the front line, AKA team bosses, should worry.

      3. Yes, who knew Seb was really an Italian.

    5. Thanks for the cotd, but not really worthy I don’t think, or at least not attributed to me. It’s just the attitude I’ve picked up off the more respectful commenters around here.

      Wonderful colours on that F3 machine!

    6. Alonso deserves more mass dampers and more kimi’s mercedes v8 detonating if he wants more championships….

      1. A few more Nelson Piquet Jrs and a few less Vitaly Petrovs?

        1. More Felipe Massa and less Lewis Hamilton

    7. Since when is life about what you “deserve”.

      1. And interestingly Sainz does not utter the word ‘deserve’, @medman.
        He said:
        “his countryman would have had more than two titles if he had better machinery.”
        “It’s like he has won five or six,”; “Championships depends on the car”
        “What he did with that Ferrari (.. and ..) is doing with the McLaren is standing out.”
        “everyone agrees he’s one of the best in history.”

        All fair comments IMO, and I’ll be happy to use them if they ask me to speech at his farewell dinner ;-)

    8. Alonso deserves to be F1’s mascot.

    9. He would have had a chance of more titles had he not scurried away after getting beat by Hamilton in his debut season.

      1. He “scurries away” because of the way in which he was treated at McLaren, not because he got beaten.

        1. McLaren didn’t kiss his backside so he ran away. He expected Hamilton to be his lackey but Ham, nor McLaren were having it.

        2. No, he left because he didn’t get favoritism. Which, based on his relative performance to Hamilton, he didn’t deserve.
          His mindset is that he deserves more wdc titles just because he managed to beat Fisichella in a car that was the class of the field for 2 years.
          He’s a spoiled little brat who got exactly the amount of titles he deserved. F1 is a team sport. Alonso seems to forget that from time to time.

          If he truly was the greatest of this generation he would not have self destructed in 2007. And then he would have still been at McLaren in 2008 with another very good shot at the title.

          His 2010 and 2012 campaign are romantisized greatly. Especially by ‘the samurai’ himself. Those Ferrari’s were not seconds off the pace. Yes in qualy trim they lacked that one lap pace (not seconds) but in the race the Ferrari was a lot stronger and the Red Bull less so. Besides that, Alonso made several mistakes in 2010 besides not being able to pass Petrov. In the end of 2012 Massa was outperforming him in several qualy’s and races as well. So if Alonso always opperates at 120% as he likes to say, what was Massa operating at back then? 123%?

          Also, after Japan ’06 Alonso said God wanted him to win the title that year.
          So that means there is no luck involved. It’s all Gods plan.
          So God didn’t want Alonso to win in 2007, 2010 and 2012. Or any of the other years since 2006 for that matter.

          1. He’s a spoiled little brat who got exactly the amount of titles he deserved. F1 is a team sport. Hamilton seems to forget that from time to time.

            Oh, sorry, I forgot what year we were arguing about.

            (Feel free to interchange Rosberg’s name to suit).

          2. Yes in qualy trim they lacked that one lap pace (not seconds) but in the race the Ferrari was a lot stronger and the Red Bull less so.

            lonso made several mistakes in 2010 besides not being able to pass Petrov. In the end of 2012 Massa was outperforming him in several qualy’s and races as well

            Your animosity for Alonso muddles facts and generates ridiculous statements.

            1. You’re totally free to correct me.
              And since you didn’t do so first hand tells me you can’t.

              It’s a fact the Ferrari in 2010 and 2012 was much more competitive in the race compared to qualy. It’s a fact Massa sacrificed his grid slot during the 2012 US GP to help Alonso get ahead and on the cleaner side of the grid. It’s a fact that Massa showed stronger pace during the 2012 Korean GP.

              It’s not a fact that the Ferrari was 2 seconds off the pace at the beginning of 2012 as Alonso claims.

              And lets not forget the bullet proof reliability of those Ferrari’s. That alone helped Ferrari and Alonso tremendously.

              I think it is your hatred towards Vettel rather than my animosity for Alonso that’s the problem here.

            1. (@omarr-pepper) +Baron

              2010 is debatable, but 2012 he deserved.

              It’s now been confirmed Vettel is full carbabby, to state otherwise is pure denial. The problem F1 has is that the machine is (and always has been) too instrumental in success – particularly when Newey is around.

            2. Yep, that explains 2015.

          3. If anyone deserves a championship it’s 2005 Kimi.

            Alonso 2005 = Rosberg 2016.

            If Alonso is a worthy champion then so is Rosberg. If you think Rosberg isn’t worthy, you’re saying Alonso isn’t.

            End of.

        3. He scurried away because the team wouldn’t tell Lewis to move over for him…..

          1. What a bunch of rubbish!

            1. Yep you do talk alot of it….

        4. Lets face it, Alonso was a sook in 2007 by getting smashed by a rookie

    10. Alonso deserve nothing.

    11. Alonso has no one to blame for his 2010 campaign but himself. His 2012 and 2013 where top performance though, but that doesn’t mean he “deserves” it. A better package in Vettel + RB where there to grab the title, and this is a team competition no matter how many try to bring it down to a driver competition.

      1. As much as I root for him, he doesn’t deserve it. He’s got to go out and win it.

    12. Saint’s respect for Alonso has a slight tinge of hagiography.

      1. Yes, but still agree Alonso is worthy of being 5-time champion. The way he handled Schumacher and pulled Ferrari so close leaves no doubt of that.

        Such a terrible waste of talent last years and likely more to come. It’s been painful to watch.

        1. I disagree. When did he handle Schumacher excatly? In 2005 when Ferrari was 4th fastest team and Michael still managed 3rd? The only reason why Alonso won that year was the fact McLaren let Kimi down. In 2006 Renault was better than Ferrari and he still only managed to win WDC in the last race. And his Ferrari years? I believe in 2010 Mark should have gotten it. Alonso couldnt get past Petrov and was angry at him for that. What a champion! And in 2012 he could have won if he didnt crash into Raikkonen in Suzuka. I dont see how is he worthy of being a 5 time champion. Seeing how Hamilton has 3 right now and beat Alonso in his rookie year in the same car… The only one he might deserve is his 2006 title. His antics also doesnt help his case. The amazing lone “samurai” who blames his team the moment something goes wrong, but when everything is good it’s his amazing ability to bring seconds to the car. He is a good driver there is no doubt about that, but 5-time WDC? Give me a break.

    13. How come Carlos is so outspoken these days? He seems to lead the round-up almost every second day, and is one of the few to make public comments outside of race weekends. I like that he’s opening up about various aspects of the sport, I’m just surprised about it considering the prevalence of press officers and the protocol of political correctness in F1 circles today.

    14. I’m not a great fan of Alonso, but to suggest he’s not one of the best drivers of the current generation seems a bit childish to me. He’s had the worst timing possible when changing teams, some of it is his own fault, some of it was bad luck, but he’s always delivered on the track, and Lewis is the only team mate he’s had that’s kept close to him throughout the season.

      Some of his performances this season, in what is a dog of a car, have been outstanding.

      1. @beneboy but the most important of what you said is, that it was HIS own fault sometimes. I will especially say he was the one responsible to cause his break-up with McLaren in 2007. He tried to play politics with old wolf Ron, and in the middle of the Spygate he got luckily deemed all innocent, then moved to Renault and after crashgate he also got luckily innocent.
        I would say that, instead of considering Alonso unlucky to have “just” two championships, he is utterly lucky for not having been banned from the sport after two scandals which I don’t know how he got away with.

    15. Alonso is the best driver in post Schumacher era. It´s very clear that he deserves more titles

    16. I’m really becoming a fan of Sainz Jr. The way he speaks is a little outspoken but very refreshing in this day and age. The thing I like is he seems to understand things and most things he says are true and warranted.

      1. He is a bit of an Alonso fanboy though. Other than that, your right

    17. So much hatred for Alonso here…….especially considering we’re interpreting/reacting to comments made by another driver.

    18. Whilst the F1 content above the line on this site is informative, the Fanatic posts below the line are the opposite, proved here by the anti-Alonso dribble that has flowed uninhibited by an FIA fuel flow sensor.

      Just stop. You are embarrassing yourselves.

    19. I just wanted to post a comment regarding Alonso/McLaren in 2007 & why that relationship fell apart & led to Fernando leaving the team.

      It wasn’t as some here are saying simply because Lewis was matching/beating him & it certainly wasn’t because he asked the team to get Lewis to move over.

      It was purely down to a perception that the team was more behind Lewis & that the lack of trust that formed between Fernando & the team leading to a perception that the team were against him & to be perfectly honest as somebody that was in the paddock throughout 2007 (My last year at FOM) I can fully understand where those perceptions came from as while they were treating both cars equally & giving both drivers the best shots at winning it was abundantly clear that from an emotional standpoint the team was more behind Lewis simply because he’d been there for so long, Knew everyone within the team so well & was considered ‘there guy’.

      Fernando picked up on that like a lot of people in the paddock did & it created a dis-trust between him & the team which ultimately got out of hand & which Ron Dennis didn’t deal with soon enough or effectively enough.

      It was almost an identical situation to what happened with Prost & Senna in 1989. Senna was closer to Ron & the team & that put the idea in Alain’s head that Ayrton was been treated differently & been given the best of the available equipment & then like in 2007 the team didn’t deal with it in a way that diffused it quickly enough to cause problems.

      1. which Ron Dennis didn’t deal with soon enough or effectively enough.

        Amen to that. I said something to that effect in a thread a couple of weeks ago.

        1. Oooops! Got the ”quote” and my comment the wrong way around! LOL

    20. Alonso deservs more titles he nearly lost it in 2010 and 2012.both were impressive pperformances by Alonso.Alonso is one of the best drivers on the grid along with Hamilton.

    21. Fernando Alonso’s career in F1 is like a chequered flag. So one may either praise or be critical, but there is no denying his talent. Personally I would like to see him one more time in a competitive seat before he leaves the sport.

    22. Alonso is 8 points short of being 5 times world champion. No one else was so close.

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