Vijay Mallya, Red Bull Ring, 2017

Mallya arrested over funds used on Force India

F1 Fanatic Round-up

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In the round-up: Force India co-owner Vijay Mallya, who was arrested in April on a fraud charge and faces an extradition hearing next month, has been arrested for a second time, this time for a charge relating to his F1 team.

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What should the FIA do in response to complaints from teams about Marcin Budkowski joining one of their rivals shortly after having access to sensitive data about their cars?

Budkowski must not be permitted to join Renault next year.

High ranking persons changing teams take a one-year sabbatical. How much more so for someone’s who’s been privy to the innermost technical insights into all the teams?

There will be a credibility crisis for the entire governing body. Can you imagine the implications if the teams suddenly can’t trust the motivations of FIA’s technical personnel? Row after row after row as teams just try different things, other teams protesting, arbitration, etc…
@Thepostalserviceisbroke

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  • 62 comments on “Mallya arrested over funds used on Force India”

    1. Obviously it depends on how Mallya’s court cases (multiple) go, but when so many things are stacking up against one man at the top, it’s not looking good. If the worst happens, I’m worried about how Force India could continue for 2018, and what the options are.

      It’s a team that has rebuilt itself from the ashes of the failed Spyker F1 project, and has become the fourth best team on the grid, so you’d think it’d be perfect for anybody looking to enter F1. The problem is, I don’t think there is anybody with a big enough wallet who wants to

        1. @strontium @shimks It’s not very helpful if you’re trying to sell a team but that team’s name starts to appear in headlines about court cases.

          Perhaps what that team needs is a different name.

      1. Honda have a big wallet.

    2. I sometimes wish Austin was in March as the first race of the season; it would be far better if it was not paired with Mexico; maybe MXC could be paired with Brazil or maybe even Canada. Maybe MotoGP could have Austin as one of their last races?

      1. @mfreire ”it would be far better if it was not paired with Mexico” – It would make zero difference. The only way Austin could achieve the same amount of Mexican attendees is if Mexico would lose its race altogether again. As long as the Mexicans have their own race, they will always go to that instead regardless of the scheduling of these two races, so, i.e., The return of the Mexican GP alone meant that Austin would lose attendees from that country regardless of the scheduling.

        1. The only way Austin could achieve the same amount of Mexican attendees is if Mexico would lose its race altogether again.

          There might be other legitimate reasons why Mexicans do not want to visit the USofA in this day and age.

          1. Lol.
            You got a point there.

        2. @jerejj ”the same amount of Mexican attendees as before 2015”

        3. I don’t entirely agree. If some of the wealthier Mexicans and Americans wanted to go to both races that were held months of each other they would have more time on their hands to do so.

          1. @mfreire ”If some of the wealthier Mexicans and Americans wanted to go to both races that were held months of each other they would have more time on their hands to do so.” – I can’t really agree with this claim. Why would anyone in their right mind rather travel to the same part of the world twice in a year separately than do both on the same trip, which lessens the need for unnecessary back-and-forth travelling. For example, by grouping the Middle Eastern races (either by moving Abu Dhabi to April or Bahrain to November), they would actually increase the probability of the same international race visitors attending both than with the current scheduling of them being at the opposite ends of the calendar. Both would actually benefit from being close to each other much more than being over seven months apart from each other.

      2. Did you see what Saward mentioned, that it would be more logical to pair Austin with Montreal in June @jerejjm, @mrfreire – https://joesaward.wordpress.com/2017/10/04/be-careful-what-you-wish-for/

        makes some sense to me with keeping Mexico tied in with the Día de los Muertos fesitivals and at the same time avoiding NFL (and highschool football) clashes.

        1. Austin and Montreal makes more sense than Montreal and Baku ;)

        2. @bascb Moving Austin to June would be a bit too risky temperature-wise as it can get unpleasantly hot at that time of year, so wouldn’t really be worth it.

          1. How much of a difference is there in June temperatures between Mexico and Austin (about 22-33 in June, vs. 20s in November for Austin, I guess Mexico is app. 22-25 most of the year)? And how does it compare to a place like Malaysia? Off course both Singapore and Abu Dhabi ale even hotter, but they do the night / dusk race thing to offset that.
            I am not sure June will be that bad – it would be stupid to do it mid summer in July or even August-September in Austin.

            1. @bascb ”I am not sure June will be that bad” – Then why was Austin moved to the end of the season in the first place? It was originally scheduled to take place in June a week after the Canadian GP in its inaugural season (2012), but was later moved to its November 18th slot of that season due to the concerns regarding the temperatures in June, so why would it be any different now than it was 6 years ago when the finalized 2012 race calendar was set in stone?

            2. @bascb Texas in June can get desert levels of hot, Thats why the Indycar race at Texas Motor Speedway at the end of May/Early June is always a night race (While the old season ending 2nd race at TMS held in October was a day race).

              The reason they wouldn’t want COTA to be an evening/night race is that it would shift to race to 10-11pm Sunday night in the UK/Europe (And into the early hours of Monday morning) & that would severely hit potential TV Viewership.

              As I’ve said in the past when coming up with a season schedule while on paper grouping certain races together makes sense, There is a lot more to think about which often prevents the thing that looks right from actually been right. Climate is one, Other local/regional events is another & what the circuit owners/promoters/local government want is another.

            3. Looks like you guys know more about Austin weather than I do @gt-racer, @jerejj, a night race in Austin is really not on the cards I would think!

              And yeah, it can get hard to try and fit all considerations about climate/season, preferences, commercial viability/region and time zones together to make a sensible calendar for a global sport.

            4. @Jere is right because there are better times to host the AUstin GP than in June. In June temperatures are known to average in the 90s F (32C) and are also known to go past 100s F (40s C). So nobody who knows there are better times for the race to be held will want to spend 2 hours in unpleasant heat outside for a motor race. Also there is a chance of the track breaking up in those temperatures. Malaysia is different because theweather is effectively the same year round thanks to KL being near the Equator.

            5. *nobody who goes there

            6. @bascb @gt-racer Perhaps very early-June could work for Austin as both this and last year the highest daytime temperatures at that time of the month were in the low 30s and or high 20s, but yeah, any later than that is a bit too risky.

            7. @bascb Furthermore regarding the Abu Dhabi GP: Yes the fact that it’s a day-to-night race kind of offsets the temperature-thing, but even if it was an afternoon race it wouldn’t be too bad as the temperatures there in November usually never really exceed 30 degrees Celsius or only exceed it slightly unlike Austin in June, so, i.e., daytime temperatures in Abu Dhabi in November aren’t as unpleasant as they’re in Austin in June. Abu Dhabi in June, though, is even worse than Austin is, LOL.

          2. @jerejj ‘unlike with Austin in June’

    3. I might be going against popular opinion here but I want Pascal Wehrlein in the Williams next year. Martini’s request for having a driver above 25 can be bent with money or having a third driver such as Kubica or Di Resta. Mercedes want Wehrlein in a midfield car so his abilities can be seen, alongside people like Ocon, Vandoorne and Sainz. And Lawrence Stroll’s demand of having an experienced driver alongside Lance would be fulfilled to some extent as Wehrlein heads into his third year in 2018. If it is a shootout between Di Resta and Kubica, fine but I just don’t want to see a potential seat wasted by a driver who will stick around for a season or two.

      1. And Lawrence Stroll’s demand of having an experienced driver alongside Lance would be fulfilled to some extent as Wehrlein heads into his third year in 2018.

        Well, yes, to some extent; but not much.

      2. As Martini, would you really want a fine gentelman such as Wherlein representing your brand?

        I say Kubica vs DiResta, whoever is faster in testing.

        Potentially even have both of them next year just in case.

        Wherlein brings nothing to the table when compared to those two. He is not consistently briliant for his talent to really stand out. He has good races, but that is about average for all current decent drivers.

        Even Stroll has had some great races by now.

    4. Sundar Srinivas Harish
      4th October 2017, 1:42

      But Nico’s been very strong this year and it’s not surprising that if you’re on the back foot then the team is looking around.

      It is admirable that Palmer is quite objective about his performance, and not blaming everything squarely on the poor reliability of his car. Renault, on the other hand, have been rather immature by not being open about body shopping for a new driver, something that they did in 2016 as well. If this sort of attitude continues on from their side, it will be difficult for drivers to trust the team in future contract negotiations.

    5. It would be a shame for Hiroaki Ishiura if Gasly isn’t there to compete for the championship. It would dimish somewhat the satisfaction of winning the title, I guess.

    6. Regarding Mallya: He has reportedly got bail. Extradition is not an easy process and government data suggests India has managed bringing in only 62 fugitives since 2002. But the bigger question is how much executive control does Mallya have on the team? Are there any potential buyers who would be willing to dip their hand in case things get messy? If not, then I guess its going to be a backward journey for Force whatever.

      But there are a few more interesting news in this roundup. It would be good to see a knockout test between Kubica and Di Resta and hope Williams share the laptimes. It is a chassis war between Red Bull and McLaren in 2018. Brown’s comment suggest there is still a concern that Honda might improve performance.
      Also, presumably a move away from Honda was aimed at McLaren’s move to retain Alonso. Then what is the delay? Is Horner concerned that Max is thinking Red Bull is no longer his best option?

      1. Yeah, @pinakghosh, he did get out on bail.

        I am sure that Mallya will do all he can to resist extradition and it will take years. For FI this case is more dangerous than previous ones because it directly names the team as being the “beneficiary” of that money involved. I think there would br buyers … for the right price. Seems both Mallya and Roy Sahara are wanting to much money for the team, so unless they cut the price, it will not be sold. Maybe money needs will bring that moment forward.

        With the price money from the last couple of years, I think FI is in a relatively solid position for another 2 seasons, let’s hope they can continue at that level.

        1. For FI this case is more dangerous than previous ones

          I wouldn’t be too worried about the reputation of FI; other teams shrugged off much bigger controversies.

          1. I am not thinking about the reputation of FI at all “Why M?” I am rather thinking about the possible implications of being deemed to have been on the receiving end of money being laundred. That might pose a serious issue for the team and its cashflow.

            1. The act of laundering money is illegal; not what is being done with it when ‘laundered”!

              Yes, FI might have to pay it back earlier than anticipated, but that will only facilitate a sale.

      2. McLaren will be waiting till after suzuka to announce Alonso staying as a result of the renault deal, out of respect to Honda

    7. I just don’t understand the logic of the topic of the Reuters article. At the end of the day, it would make zero difference whether the Mexican GP took place at a different time of year than the US GP or at the same time as it has been so far. First of all the distance between Austin and Mexico City is a massive 1,213.62 km by air which is greater than the distance between Spa and Monza, for example, and also greater than the distance between Hockenheim and Hungaroring, but no one is complaining about the scheduling of those races. Furthermore, it’s more or less the same as the distance between Montreal and Indianapolis that were scheduled subsequently from 2004 to 2007, and no one complained. But regardless, as long as the Mexicans have their own race they will always go to that instead regardless of the scheduling of this and the US GP. Austin could only achieve the same amount of Mexican attendees if Mexico lost its race altogether again, but until that happens, the situation won’t change even if you did put Mexico to a different time of year. The return of the Mexican GP alone meant that Austin would lose attendees from that country regardless of the scheduling. Also, it wouldn’t be the best idea to put it after Canada as it’s rainy at that time of year.

    8. I don’t think you have to spend “an arm and a leg” to watch F1 in the UK. On Now TV, without subscription, you can watch an entire F1 weekend for around £10, legally and in HD. To me, that’s good value for money; and you can watch the ones on C4 for free.

      1. Is it the Sky coverage? If so, can I pay more for a “delete Crofty” option?

        1. Gary: haha: yes. And sadly, no.

        2. This weekend you will have a add acting world champion option.
          The return of……..Rosberg

      2. You can also get the Sky F1 channel on TalkTalk (plus half a dozen or so football, cricket, golf etc channels) for £8.50 a month.

        1. Are you sure about that price for TalkTalk? I’m on their site now and can only see the Sky Sports package as costing an extra £34 per month

      3. @mattb I’d never pay that much for a service with such insane amount of ads.
        Rather I’d go for pirate streaming or even pirate catch up videos and watch it later.

        I could eventually pay 10€ for a multicam ad-free service IF racing is good, overtaking possible, no DRS, level field, 24 cars on grid, …
        In the meantime, I’m happy and lucky to still have access to free-to-air TV.

        1. Fair enough, I’d go free if it were legal. But it is the full Sky stream, no additional adverts, no advert breaks during the race. For me, i watch all of the qualifying hour and two hours for the race- works out around £3.33 per hour of entertainment. Cheaper than a pint of beer.

        2. @spoutnik

          I’d never pay that much for a service with such insane amount of ads.

          There are no ad’s shown during Qualifying or the race.

          They do show ad’s during practice sessions but even then they don’t show too many & if you have access to the Red Button service (Or ipad app which features even more feeds) all of the additional video feeds continue playing during the Ad-break (And the pits channel has the world-feed on it) so you never miss any of the track action.

    9. They don’t want Austin date to be close to México city, because two years ago we mexicans used to fill the COTA stands and spend our money with joy, we love F1, now we don’t need to go to USA to enjoy F1, my opionion is there is not enough american f1 fans for any track or any date at the moment, they are so in to their NASCAR oval borefest, it doesn’t matter if you move the event to March in México or to COTA, USA just lack enough fans to fill the grandstands.

      1. Josh (@canadianjosh)
        4th October 2017, 14:43

        Are you saying Mexicans traveled from Mexico to fill the COTA stands? I would say there are enough Mexicans in the state of Texas to fill the COTA 1000 times so having your own race in Mexico affecting the US GP doesn’t make sense.

    10. Getting so tough to watch F1 in the UK without paying an arm and a leg to SKY. I don’t understand why they don’t stream direct if I pay.

      Lee Peterson’s comment looks like it is a trivial complaint about a trivial matter, but it isn’t. It is the guardsman at the back of the train waving “good bye”, the passengers waving as the ship sails away. The issue isn’t “Why don’t people want to watch F1?” because people do want to watch it, the issue is “Why doesn’t F1 want to be watched?”. This is a problem F1 needs to own. It isn’t me or you, it is F1 that has to accept responsibility for the decling audience. Demanding people pay a lot to watch races is a sure fire way to discourage viewers from watching. If Formula One wants to be watched then it has to make sure its races can be seen cheaply or for free, excluding average people isn’t a going to revitalise the declining audience.
      I recently heard that the Dallas Cowboys were the world’s most highly valued team. Someone on this forum said it was because of their ability to exploit merchandising and such like, but why isn’t it an F1 team like Ferrari, Mercedes, or Red Bull Racing? Revitalising the audience would increase the value of teams.
      Max Verstappen’s win at Malaysia was the last item mentioned on our local radio station’s sports news in the morning, but why wasn’t it first? Why wasn’t it mentioned in the afternoon? The reason is popularity, or rather the lack of it. Popular sports get first place on the sports news, unpopular sports get last or the rubbish bin. F1 should be popular, but it isn’t. It was once very popular even though people had to stay up to midnight to watch the start of the race, now …? Now people would have to pay a vast amount so they can watch a race every two weeks, but they’ve higher priorities, so F1 gets ignored.

      1. Totally agree with Stephen Crowsen. In addition, I think Liberty Media should compensate the teams financially for the fact that F1 has moved in the direciton of pay-per-view. Why? Because in doing so, they are diminishing the audience and diminishing audiences also means diminishing exposure for team sponsors, which in turn means sponsors going/staying away or wanting to pay less. So the higher pay-per-view rights contracts earn Liberty Media money, but at the expense of the teams. Therefore, they should compensate.

        1. _direction_ of pay-per-view
          (OK, I’ll get my reading glasses out the next time I’m posting)

        2. One might argue that someone who isn’t prepared to shell out a few quid a month to watch F1 probably isn’t going to be buying whatever the major sponsors sell either and is therefore of little or no commercial interest.

          1. It would be good to know how much “a few quid a month” is where you live. Where I live “a few quid” is actually NZ $99 per month, or NZ $54.99 per month on a 6 month contract, if you view the races online. I’m not familiar with the amount you would pay viewing via the satellite, but I think it is somewhere in the region of NZ $79.81 per month via satellite. Whether the exact amounts are a bit more or a bit less isn’t the argument, the argument is the minimum amount you pay to watch the races legally is really more than just “a few quid a month”.

            1. £8.50 on TalkTalk or £10 on NowTV as above, both without having to commit to a contract beyond the current month. Or about eleventy-four godzillion a month with a thousand year contract direct from Sky.

    11. Why would they put Kubica first in that test? This seems a bit unfair.
      Di Resta has experience with the car, but they will put Kubica first, so Di Resta may benefit from what the team learns with Kubica.

    12. It sure is quite unfair to put Kubica first.

    13. Some breaking news from the US.

      NBC Sports have decided to end talks with Liberty & drop F1 from the end of this season. Liberty have subsequently done a deal with ESPN for 2018.

      Gather that NBC wanted to retain F1 rights & that Liberty were happy to have them keep them…… However Liberty were insisting on something been a part of the deal that NBC felt they couldn’t agree to so they backed out.
      NBC wanted exclusivity (As most broadcasters do), Liberty have plans for an online subscription service. NBC felt that a competing service that will take viewers, revenue & sponsors away from them made the terms of there deal worthless so backed out.

      1. Back on ESPN again, I wonder if they will bring the announcers with them over to ESPN.

        All races will air live on ESPN, ESPN2 or ABC, and will include all practice sessions, qualifying and races, will be shown live and in replay across ESPN platforms.

        1. Hopefully ESPN will replace NBC’s current crop of “experts”. Personally, I can’t stand Leigh Diffey’s hysterical outbursts, David Hobbs’s buffoonish mumblings and Steve Matchett’s wild speculations regarding technical issues, sporting regulations and other F1 issues he doesn’t fully understand.

          Who should ESPN hire? Well, besides the anchor commentator, who can be any solid US motor sports commentator (Mike Joy, Bob Varsha), the second host could be a former successful F1 driver such as Jacques Villeneuve, Eddie Irvine, JP Montoya, etc., and for the third commentator, each race can be co-hosted by a different F1 personality – driver, team manager/principal (not Eddie Jordan), designer; lots to choose from.

        2. I wonder if they will bring the announcers with them over to ESPN.

          Initial talk suggest’s that ESPN won’t be producing there own coverage (Outside of maybe the USGP) & will instead be picking up the Sky UK broadcast as Fox Sports in Australia as well as others do.

          Also seems as if ESPN aren’t paying anything for the F1 rights, When NBC backed out Liberty were suddenly faced with no US broadcast so effectively panicked & gave them to ESPN for free.

          Got some more details on why NBC backed out. Part of it was the threat of an OTT service from FOM as I describe but another equally big sticking point was that NBC wanted a long term deal & Liberty were only willing to offer a short deal.
          F1 has been a major success to NBC, They have been getting strong ratings & have grown F1’s viewership in the US by a nearly 200% since they got the rights in 2013 & NBC wanted a long term deal to go along with long term plans they have for motorsport. Liberty refused to give them more than a 2 year deal & NBC didn’t feel they could go forward with there long term plans with such a short term offer & lack of real commitment from Liberty.

          NBC are apparently furious with the way Liberty dealt with them given how much they (rightly) feel they have done for F1 in the US since getting the rights.

        3. There isn’t a better color commentor in sports television than Steve Matchett. I will be very upset if ESPN doesn’t go after him hard.

          It is also worth pointing out the excellent work Will Buxton does as well.

          I hope Diffey and Hobbs just move over to IndyCar and pair Paul Tracy with them. Townsend Bell can go do something else.

    14. “It shows that the works that we did since our poor start in Melbourne paid off, and the development goes in the right direction. Chassis-wise, for sure we are the best now.”

      It may well be the best “now”, but it hasn’t been until now and that isn’t good enough for a team like Red Bull. It was also the exact same thing that happened last season: weak start, good development run (while having a dig at Renault), strong finish. Red Bull need to start hitting the ground running. The season starts in late March, not October!

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