Guenther Steiner, Haas, Interlagos, 2019

Spending more money to reach budget cap could backfire – Steiner

RaceFans Round-up

Posted on

| Written by

In the round-up: Haas team principal Guenther Steiner doesn’t want to raise his team’s spending to reach the maximum allowed under the new budget cap for the 2021 F1 season.

What they say

Haas already spends considerably less than the $175 million (plus exceptions) cap which will come into force next year. Steiner was asked whether they intend to increase their spending to catch up to their rivals.

We’ll stay we with what we have got. We are quite conservative with these things. We are not going to do that.

We’ss do what we are doing and try to do it as good as possible. Because the next thing is the teams which now increases [their spending], then when [the cap] gets decreased again, they are the guys which then cry about it: ‘oh, we increased it’. Yeah, I mean, you knew it was coming.

If you have no vision and you just do what is convenient at the moment maybe that doesn’t work.

Quotes: Dieter Rencken

Advert | Become a RaceFans supporter and go ad-free

Social media

Notable posts from Twitter, Instagram and more:

Advert | Become a RaceFans supporter and go ad-free

Comment of the day

Is it the run-off, and not the chicane itself, which needs to change at Paul Ricard?

A major problem with that chicane isn’t within the track-layout, but rather the run-off.

A defending driver tricked into the outside lane under braking can just easily brake very late or slightly too late, and if he doesn’t make the chicane just retain the position by going wide and immediately shouting into the radio: “He pushed me off the track!”

With grass, gravel or a barrier that same situation is a yield, a significant time loss or a retirement.
Sven (@Crammond)

Happy birthday!

Happy birthday to Mantas Degutis!

If you want a birthday shout-out tell us when yours is via the contact form or adding to the list here.

On this day in F1

Chanoch Nissany, Minardi, Misano, 2005
Chanoch Nissany, Minardi, Misano, 2005
  • On this day in 2005 Chanoch Nissany (father of Williams tester Roy Nissany) and Christijan Albers tested for Minardi at a snowy Misano, along with Christijan Albers and Nicholas Kiesa

More pictures available via the image links above.

Author information

Keith Collantine
Lifelong motor sport fan Keith set up RaceFans in 2005 - when it was originally called F1 Fanatic. Having previously worked as a motoring...

Got a potential story, tip or enquiry? Find out more about RaceFans and contact us here.

Posted on Categories RaceFans Round-upTags , , ,

Promoted content from around the web | Become a RaceFans Supporter to hide this ad and others

  • 21 comments on “Spending more money to reach budget cap could backfire – Steiner”

      1. “There you go, that’s cut at least half a second off the time you’d have otherwise done.”

    1. Sounds like a load of bellends in Miami.

      1. And they want to keep their cover, per the Blood Stained Men ;)

      2. they say any exposure is good exposure, but associating F1 with the Blood Stained Men is surely not a good look. i’d never heard of this group – there really are morons for everything now. perhaps that will be the next big cult – Morons For Everything.

        1. People who think that mutilating children in the name of religion is bad? Crazy!

      3. “Outside Super Bowl, activists protest F1 racing and clash with anti-circumcision group (Miami Herald)” <<< It doesn't get more "Only in Florida" than this !

    2. That blog post about India’s 31 million fans raises one question, one interesting point, and one concerning suggestion (concerning, in my opinion, that is).

      A recently released report from Formula 1 indicates that India has a large 31 million fan base.

      Firstly, that equates to roughly one in 44 Indians being a fan of the sport. Anecdotally, that does not tie in to what I see. Even amongst the people of my generation, I don’t think there are 2 fans in 100 people I meet (yeah yeah, that’s not how statistics works, bear with me).

      So my question is, how are Liberty counting fans? Are they getting creative with their numbers, by measuring web/poll hits? It sure isn’t people tuning into the race, because the interesting point the author makes in that blog is:

      In fact, if this fan base tuned in to live broadcast, Star Sports would be able to actively work on delivering better quality content like their European counterparts. Currently, the critical mass of television viewers is not high enough for Star Sports to invest further in the broadcast via pre and post race shows, features and more. One wonders what would it take to activate this fan base for commercial gains.

      And then the blog goes down in my opinion, because it not only makes an argument for betting, but also ends up linking to a betting site:

      Along with television, the other opportunity that exists for this large fan base is in the area of betting. I’ve long written posts on betting in Formula 1 and there is ample opportunity to explore live betting odds with [site removed].

      Ugh, no thank you.

      1. Yep the bit about betting….. nuff said.

        However it is an interesting point – how did they come up with a count of 31 million fans. Are they including gamers playing the F1 games on devices or someone that maybe read a story about the passing of Niki Lauda.?

        Still I guess we have to expect inflated numbers – gotta keep the shareholders happy with great numbers.

      2. As a thought, F1 releases a short video for news broadcasts showing the winner of an F1 race crossing the Finish Line, and it probably includes some dramatic highlight from the race. I suspect this is free to most TV companies for their news program. So maybe Liberty Media believe that watching that news clip equates to being an F1 fan.

      3. I’m going with “metrics indicate 31 million unique devices connected to YouTube official F1 content long enough to cross the 15-minutes a season marker I believe is the length of time used”. This swaps one problem with the traditional method (some sort of intention to access the F1 content likely exists) with another (were click farms – common in many industrialised countries with cheap hardware) and people owning multiple devices properly taken into account?)

    3. yes, Haas do not need to spend more. the competition will come back to them, at least initially.

    4. Ferrari is absolutely correct, however I thought the scuderia were clever enough have realised that it is better not to question the media. Being open didn’t work, closing off didn’t work either, just live with it, as the blood stained men ought to.

    5. Still I think it’s an incredible failure of Liberty that the budget cap didn’t come into effect this year, maybe even from 2019 season. They have preserved the dominance of the top 3 and the most ridiculous, amateurish way.

      1. @pironitheprovocateur I disagree completely. First of all, there have been contracts in place from pre-Liberty times that may have prevented them from doing this sooner. Secondly, they needed and wanted consensus from all the teams on this, as they (Liberty) have not wanted to make the knee-jerk decisions that we saw in the BE era by forcing things on the teams. Liberty has been working very hard on all aspects of F1, trying to get everyone on board with a vision, and that has worked. But it has taken time and negotiations. I really doubt that while they’ve been negotiating this wholly new F1, they could have suddenly cut the legs out from under the bigger teams financially ahead of the new sporting and technical regs. Should have done it sooner you say? I suggest that would have caused way more problems for them in organizing everything else they have had to, and would have seen them look like knee-jerkers with little regard for keeping the entity of F1 united for a better future.

        No, Liberty has put the budget cap in place at a time when it is appropriate to do so contractually, and for the overall health of the sport, which includes treating the top teams and their employees with respect, not just only worrying about the lesser teams. The potential of a spending race has been around for decades. What’s a couple of more years, but especially a couple more years with the spirit of cost cutting in place, being blended in, when the end result will be happy teams happy to be in F1, with teams closer to each other and cars racing closer as well. I don’t see how another entity could have tackled all the issues Liberty has, on such a short time span, any better, given what they or any other entity that actually would have stepped up, could have done.

        Done in an amateur way? No that is way oversimplifying the task at hand, and in fact they have been extremely professional and inclusionary given the massive task they have at hand. And let’s keep in mind they aren’t perfect, nor would any other entity be, and it is always a work in progress subject to tweaking .

        1. I think you missed the point. While it is important that the budget gap gets done properly it is still pretty amateurish it took this long and its introduction coincides with new tech rule change. At least they had the sense to trial run it in 2020 by just overseeing with no penalties. It would have been ideal to have the budget gap be enforced this year to prevent the spending race for 2021. All the big teams were stalling and so it took this long to get everybody to sign the dotted line. Typical infighting and political nonsense.

          1. @socksolid You see to me I just don’t see what went on as in-fighting and political nonsense. Rather, negotiations and consensus seeking as to how collectively they as a whole entity could tackle this issue that has been hovering for decades, and an issue that Liberty has finally made huge progress on, when it would never have happened under BE, who brought F1 to this brink.

            Put another way, Liberty is doing what many thought for decades would never happen, as it could never be policed. In-fighting and political nonsense would guarantee that, seemingly, we all assumed…for decades. And yet here we are, and the best thing you and @pironitheprovocateur can come up with is “amateur” and “not soon enough.” The reality is they have performed a small miracle, so I think it is you who have missed the point. The point is it is amazing that Liberty has even gotten the top teams to agree that this is one of the ways and means to a sustainable F1. To quibble over the timing of this, that would have had them have to go all hard ball (ala BE) on the teams within their first season or two of taking over the reins in order to organize a cap by now, is what is amateur. They had to start off their (so far 3 season) tenure by organizing their own plans first, and then communicating that direction to the teams, and then getting into talks with said teams as to the best ways and means to achieve the goals which as I say they first had to feel the teams out on to even see their reaction and hear their valuable input, always respecting that individual teams are going to have their individual takes on things as well as their desires for the future. How would you have enforced a cap such that it would already be in place, while discussing every other issue with no stones unturned, while getting all the teams on board, in three seasons? After decades of it never ever going to possibly happen?

            Sorry but no, the last thing Liberty and Brawn have been is amateur on this.

            1. Liberty and Brawn are not amateurs and I never said such thing. What you need to remember is that budget gap has been talked about for over ten years. And while the first stronghand political approach by mosley and ecclestone for sure was amateurish and a failure it is worth remembering that it has been a very tough road for brawn and liberty to get anything done at all. I don’t know any better word than infighting to describe the process that finally gave the sport the new tech rules and the budget gap. For sure brawn and liberty did a great job getting it through but as a whole it took so long and was so stalled and politics orientated (the quit threats for example) that for me that overall was an amateur hour for f1. And in the end they weren’t talking about new direction for f1. It was just fixing mistakes (massive downforce levels, high spending, unfair profit sharing, unfair decision making structure, imbalance of power between the teams…). How many things did they fix? 2/5 of those I listed. It is a step to right direction but it is still a compromise that took over 10 years to materialize.

            2. @socksolid The budget cap has been considered for much longer than 10 years as it is much longer than that that the top teams have had the hands down advantage over the lesser teams. The hybrid era alone is already about to start it’s 7th season, and that is when the costs and the complexity for the lesser teams really changed the goal posts for their chances of competitiveness mid-game in an unprecedented way.

              I don’t know why you can only find the word in-fighting, when once Liberty took over it became much more about co-operation. Liberty, as the new owners, laid out their plans for a new and better and more sustainable F1, and the teams have been given an opportunity to provide their input, debate, negotiate, and here we are, with them on board and a wholly new direction being instigated. Where’s the in-fighting? Sure the top teams put their two cents in as to what they would like for themselves, and Brawn always acknowledged that he was going to have to be mindful that teams will start by acting selfishly to keep what they have, but that is why negotiations and compromises take place. Ultimately the teams have bought in to Liberty’s vision with what to me seems quite a bit of ease. Sure Ferrari threatened to leave if they didn’t retain their bonus…what a surprise…and the compromise is they still get a bonus but a lesser one, and they will stay.

              You say it took 10 years to materialize? How so? Liberty has only been in power for 4. You can throw out everything before that, because Liberty, along with the teams co-operation, has attended to all aspects of F1 and it’s issues, and is moving forward with said changes for the better. What 2/5 are you talking about? F1 will become more affordable for teams to enter and compete. The money distribution will be better balanced. The cars will be completely redesigned to race more closely. Those huge things will have a snowball effect in making F1 a better product on the track which will attract more audience and more attention and more sponsorship.

              The real ‘amateur hour’ was BE’s last 10 years of service, hand in hand with CVC, which we all know was just a money grab for himself and CVC, and in order to get away with it he placated the top 4 teams by giving them all the power to make the decisions for F1. As if there weren’t already problems in F1 prior to that…well…no wonder Liberty has had a mountain to climb, and is doing a great job at it. But kudos to the teams too for acknowledging the excesses of the past and how unsustainable that model was, and co-operating with Liberty on a new and sustainable direction.

    6. ‘Guys, we have to have the budget cap limit lower than originally planned.’
      – My Caption Competition-choice in case the top-image would get chosen for the next post in the series.

      I don’t necessarily agree with the COTD. Yes, Dan went a bit wide on the final lap of the last French GP, but other than that, no problems with the run-off areas there.

    7. The works at Zandvoort is going very well I even hear that and of this month the first cars could drive around. Something for the fans the data will be not given to the teams untill the start of the GP i wonder what that is going to do.
      Jan Lammers expect a round time of 1 minute and during qualifier even lower then that.
      I hope the pittime (enter, pit, exit) stays below 15 seconds which could trigger interresting plans.

    Comments are closed.