Max Verstappen says Red Bull need to completely overhaul their car before the next round of the championship in Bahrain.
The championship leader could only manage a sixth-place finish in today’s Italian Grand Prix, 37 seconds behind winner Charles Leclerc. One week earlier at Zandvoort he finished 22 seconds behind race winner Lando Norris.The team has struggled with its car in recent races. Verstappen was puzzled by the changes in its balance during qualifying yesterday, where he looked competitive in Q2 but slipped to seventh place on the grid.
“It’s really bad at the moment,” he told the official F1 website after the race. “Before Baku, we have a lot of work to do to basically change the whole car.”
Besides the car’s performance, Verstappen was also unhappy with his team’s strategy during the race. He was locked into a two-stop strategy early on as Red Bull fitted a second set of hard tyres at his first pit stop.
Verstappen was also frustrated by a slow tyre change at his first pit stop, and punched his steering wheel as he rejoined the track. He lost more time with a loss of power from his engine.
Speaking afterwards Vertappen said he “wasn’t really frustrated throughout the race, I was just doing my own race.” But he admitted “the pace was not there.”
“We had a bad pit stop. I think that our strategy was not on point today, even though of course it wouldn’t have changed our position. I think we could have done a better race in general.
“It doesn’t help that you can’t run full power for most of the race with the engine, because we had an issue. So all in all, a pretty bad race.”
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2024 Italian Grand Prix
- Verstappen faces post-race investigation along with five other drivers and McLaren
- Red Bull lose constructors’ championship lead for first time in two years
- “Never had so much pain in a car”: How Colapinto impressed Williams on his debut
- F1’s most competitive season for 47 years? Four teams now have three wins each
- “Can I have my PU performance back?” – Verstappen’s “tough” Monza race on his radio
Kribana (@krichelle)
1st September 2024, 17:47
Pirelli tyres rubbish all the time.
Nick T.
1st September 2024, 17:51
Not a Pirelli fan, but Max’s struggles have about zero % to do with the tires.
Nick T.
1st September 2024, 17:50
I think Toto will 100% end up getting Max for 2026. Max’s impatience and unrealistic expectations combined with the absence of Newey and Mercedes showing more form than RBR will sour Max on RBR. He’ll feel the need for “a new challenge” as the greats always say when they leave their first WDC team.
Peat Smoke
1st September 2024, 18:41
Is it really unrealistic to expect the team to fix the problem he’s been complaining about since around May?
Nick T.
1st September 2024, 21:07
I was referring to Max saying they need to change the whole car by the next race. However, of course they’ve been trying to fix the problem this whole time. Does he think they’re just drinking chocolate milk and watching cartoons back at the factory? Also, going 6 races without a win, but still being on the podium most of the time isn’t exactly Max spending time in the wilderness.
waertwaerfs
2nd September 2024, 2:40
Surely he meant setup wise. I don’t think he expects a fully new build of the car by next race…
MacLeod (@macleod)
2nd September 2024, 8:05
Max isn’t saying they are not doing anything as he knows they are working on upgrades the problem is those went to wrong way several months ago with every upgrades the car gets slower … like Ferrari upgrade..Mercedes except McLaren.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
2nd September 2024, 17:35
Mmmm, newey didn’t officially leave the team yet, if he’s in charge of upgrades, he knows what he’s doing and could potentially sabotage the car by bringing downgrades? It’s a bit of a coincidence how the car started getting worse when he said he was leaving!
SteveP
2nd September 2024, 19:20
@esploratore1
AN used to have an office right alongside CH, until the split, apparently his new office isn’t even in the same building. As part of the departure sequence, he is excluded from the development discussions.
Peat Smoke
2nd September 2024, 8:45
Well, the team ignored Verstappen’s concerns at first. The car was still able to win, there was no reason to worry, they thought. And that, combined with others improving and Red Bull being kind of stuck in a mud, was one of the reasons behind Verstappen’s outbursts in Hungary. Remember before Belgium Pierre Wache had a talk with him to clear the things up?
Maybe they would’ve been in a better position now, had they listened to him in the first place? I guess it has bothered him.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
2nd September 2024, 17:37
Yes, that’s for sure, I personally thought he was exagerating saying they needed more performance considering the car was still easily winning, but seeing how it developed now, it seems he was right to complain, consider that if norris\mclaren had been more on top of things, they could seriously risk losing the WDC too now.
Patrick (@paeschli)
1st September 2024, 20:29
Newey is leaving the team and suddenly the team starts going backwards during the season (as opposed to forwards: in-season development has always been a Red Bull strong point). It is not exactly confidence inspiring.
MacLeod (@macleod)
2nd September 2024, 8:03
If we have to believe Christian Newey wasn’t important ……
Nick T.
2nd September 2024, 13:25
Christian Newey? Did Adrian name a son after Horner?
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
2nd September 2024, 17:41
Ahaha, that’s a fun one, especially people were saying newey didn’t like horner’s involvement in that investigation, but if newey called his son after horner, then that should change people’s mind!
But ofc macleod meant to put a “,” after christian, I just really liked this joke.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
2nd September 2024, 17:41
Ahaha, that’s a fun one, especially people were saying newey didn’t like horner’s involvement in that investigation, but if newey called his son after horner, then that should change people’s mind!
But ofc macleod meant to put a “,” after christian, I just really liked this joke.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
2nd September 2024, 17:41
Ahaha, that’s a fun one, especially people were saying newey didn’t like horner’s involvement in that investigation, but if newey called his son after horner, then that should change people’s mind!
But ofc macleod meant to put a “,” after christian, I just really liked this joke.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
2nd September 2024, 17:42
Ofc was meant to be only 1 comment, unsure why it doesn’t always block duplicate ones and makes even triples sometimes.
BLS (@brightlampshade)
1st September 2024, 17:53
It must be a shock to the system to go from winning with ease to being a bit stop behind winning. Especially when it happens mid season.
Have Red Bull had to take a trick off their car? Have the others just improved that much? Is it an outcome of the bad vibes within the team?
Doh
1st September 2024, 23:37
Could be a bit of it all, even newy leaving. But if this is the worst for the rest of the season then it doesn’t look to bad for the wdc. Although it’ll be close unless max can continue with consistent podiums. I wouldn’t mind at all to see it go to the last race. One it’s rare, two it’s only going to be increasingly rare going forwards
Observer
1st September 2024, 18:14
“It’s not my fault! It’s the team! The tyres! the car! A big kid did it and ran away!”
Nick T.
1st September 2024, 21:07
lol
J3d89
1st September 2024, 18:17
Is very easy to diminish the work of the other teams, the reality is that they improved a lot, Redbull ceiling was closer and they damage the car cuz doing too much of what it was good at, Redbull Is still faster than last year when they dominated everyone with an iron fist, other caught up and they’re desperately trying to keep improving the car to keep up.
AlexS
1st September 2024, 18:42
Baku.
sato113 (@sato113)
1st September 2024, 20:36
I thought I was going crazy for a moment xD
Biker56 (@biker56)
1st September 2024, 20:40
That question is still open.
David BR (@david-br)
1st September 2024, 18:57
‘Basically changing the whole car’ sounds desperate and a recipe for complete design meltdown.
Patrick (@paeschli)
1st September 2024, 20:30
It’s also impossible with the current budget cap. Red Bull are screwed.
The Old Cynic
1st September 2024, 20:46
“In F1 news: Red Bull install a new Hairdryer facility for Max Verstappen – with a staff of 50 aerodynamicists, the special 3m diameter hairdryer has fixtures to allow Verstappen to sit in a replica of next years car as his hair is dried at up to 350 mph. The budget for this new facility comes from the Personnel budget, not part of the budget cap.”
Nick T.
1st September 2024, 21:08
haha
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
2nd September 2024, 17:47
Ahah, that’s a good one too, not suspicious at all!
SteveP
1st September 2024, 21:20
RBR can switch to cheaper sandwiches, then they have millions to throw at the problem.
OOliver
1st September 2024, 20:46
I think the Newey quick fix is suddenly missing.
The speed is in the car but the genius to unlock it is now missing.
Newey is great at finding the optimal balance of the package.
isthatglock
1st September 2024, 20:48
Lol. This whole thing stinks. Something deffo happened behind the scenes. The fact Max & Perez are suddenly so close & Checo hans’t dropped off as much says a lot. Wouldn’t even be surprised if they ran something dodgy on Max’s but no Perez’s to reduce the odds of being caught in checks. Now level is more even whereby Max has a more natural advtaage over Checo. The descriptions of the issue & the sheer level of drop off does not correlate to this idea of ‘downgrades’. Don’t forget how big their advantage was. Aston had a similar slap down from the FIA where they went from pdoiums to midfield. FIA or teams involved never acknowledge these confidential agreements. The whole world knows about Ferrari’s 2019 engine, but no one will ever confirm it….but we all know it’s true.
MadMax (@madmax)
1st September 2024, 23:02
+1
MacLeod (@macleod)
2nd September 2024, 8:08
-1
Matn
2nd September 2024, 12:39
When conspiracief comfort the idea of a driver not standing out, I donno, but ifyou see the onboards it’s pretty obvious the car can’t be pushed and a car that can’t be pushed won’t be anywhere near it’s limits. Once the balance is restored one driver will outpace the the other by a far larger margin. It’s always been that way, but some prefer conspiracies over logic
roadrunner (@roadrunner)
1st September 2024, 22:24
I’m always skeptical of how vast the influence a single person can have, but the history book doesn’t lie.
Wherever Adrian Newey went he build competitive cars immediately (Williams 1991, McLaren 1998, RedBull/Toro Rosso 2008. And whenever he left a team they immediately lost competitiveness (March 1990, Williams in the middle of 1997, Redbull in the middle of 2024). McLaren was the exception as they had good cars in 2007 and 2008 but they still based on the car Newey designed for 2006 and they made a mess of the new rules for 2009.
Logic still says it’s a coincidence, but as it’s happening for the third in a row it’s at least a suspicious coincidence…
Addme (@dontme)
1st September 2024, 22:42
This is I hope he goes to Aston, just to see if he is “that” guy who almost single-handedly designs race winning cars.
MichaelN
2nd September 2024, 11:22
But Newey has been at Red Bull in earnest starting with the 2007 car, which was nothing special and the 2008 car was arguably worse. Newey has been pretty reliably good at coming up with new concepts for big regulatory changes (the 1998 McLaren, the 2009 Red Bull, the 2022 Red Bull). I suppose Red Bull would blame Renault for the 2017 Red Bull being a bit meh in that regard.
Can he carry it forward? That’s more of a question mark. Williams eventually lost out to Rory Byrne’s Benettons, and might not have had their brief resurgence in ’96 and ’97 had the Benetton dream-team not jumped ship to Ferrari. Ross Brawn famously thought the Benetton B196 was just as competitive if not more so than the near-dominant B195, but Alesi and Berger were unable to use the car anything remotely like Schumacher had done the year before. He then also left to Ferrari.
Then following his initial 1998 success at McLaren, Newey’s cars couldn’t keep up with Rory Byrne’s Ferraris, eventually leading to the infamously flopped MP4/18 in 2003 which never even raced.
Now two years into another big cycle, Red Bull is starting to lose its advantage. A pattern? Coincidence? Who knows.
Nick T.
2nd September 2024, 13:28
Michael, this is a terrible take for so many reasons. The team didn’t even have the capacity to execute his designs when he first got there. They had to build new facilities and hire more engineers. Jaguar had been operating on a small budget. Moreover, the McLaren that should have won the 2007 WDC was his design.
roadrunner (@roadrunner)
2nd September 2024, 23:51
All Williams from 1991 on were great cars. The FW 16 in 1994 was poor initially, but rock solid after some modifications and arguably quicker than the B 194 in the closing part of the season and nobody would call the B 195 dominant. Williams was clearly faster for most of the year but they were struggling with driver errors, strategy, reliability and slow pitstops. Plus at the time Michael Schumacher was head and shoulders above anyone else. Berger and Alesi aren’t worse than Hill and Villeneuve imho so the comparison of the performance of their respective 1996 cars is quite legitimate.
Newey changed mid 1997 to McLaren and suddenly they were competing for poles and wins regularly only hampered by poor reliability. I’d say 2000 they still had a better package and even in 2001 they were pretty much even with Ferrari on raw pace. The 2002 car was of course not a match for one of the best F1 cars ever, but it was still an ok car which it proved especially in the following year. But it was indeed the beginning of a decline with the infamous MP 4-18 that never raced and it’s modified variant, the almost equally bad MP 4-19 in 2004. But that decline was stopped with its modified B-Version and the fantastic MP 4-20.
The 2007 Redbull was bad, but the team was still building. The 2008 Redbull was actually really good. Remember, they used the updated 2007 car in the first part of the season and when the new 2008 car was introduced it was quite racy in the hands of Vettel with the Ferrari engine.
I do indeed believe that the 2017 and 2018 Redbull were good. Especially the 2018 car with better drivers (Hamilton, the Verstappen of todays) and reliability could have challenged for the title.
In his long career he build 8 cars that were absolutely dominant (92, 93, 96, 2010, 2011, 2013, 2022, 2023) 6 that were easily class of the field (1995, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2005, 2012) and 4 that were fast enough to fight for championships (1994, 2003, 2009, 2021) Another 4 cars could fight for wins more or less regularly (2001, 2018, 2019, 2020) and only 3 cars he build didn’t win at all (2006, 2007, 2015).
Only in 2002, 2004 (first half) 2007, 2015 and arguably in 2014 his cars weren’t really competing at the front and of course the MP-18 was a complete failure but replaced well.
No team he left has won a GP in the year after.
Tiaki Porangi
2nd September 2024, 0:15
How important was Adrian Newey to Red Bull’s dominance?
Newey’s departure was confirmed at or around the Miami Grand Prix, May 5th.
Up until that point, Max had taken pole position in all 7 races, including Miami.
In the 9 races since Newey’s departure was confirmed by RB, Max has been on pole only once.
Before Newey’s departure, Max had won 5 of the 7 races run.
Since Newey’s departure, of the 9 races, Max has won just 2.
Give or take a day or two in the stats, but this correlation does strongly imply causation. Whatever it was that forced Newey out – was it a disagreement on design direction, was he overruled, was he ignored, etc – it’s clear that, post-Newey, RBR are going backwards at a frightening clip.
Robert (@lekkerbek)
2nd September 2024, 6:48
They work months in advance to design and fabricate things for the car. So the timeline doesn’t make sense. Max has been complaining about the car since Miami.
So it’s either the FIA made them change something or Newey is leaving a sinking ship. Something he was (partly) responsible for. The stronger argument would be that Rob Marchall is the key factor here. The timeline makes sense and the rise of McLaren can’t be ignored in this aspect.
Broderick Harper (@banbrorace)
2nd September 2024, 12:34
Marshall’s a good shout.
Nick T.
2nd September 2024, 13:34
This is just wrong. Their updates weren’t designed 6 months ago. With additives departments and much more rapid manufacturing processes, their updates are now primarily designed a 6-8 weeks ago. You may be confusing McLaren’s update timeline from last year because they had an entirely new car coming out during the season and that was planned with a much longer lead time.
Also, just as critical as the poor updates, has been the absence of Newey for suspension setup. And since he designed the suspension and you also need to understand how the aero and suspension work together holistically, their performance immediately started trending downward when he stopped doing that.
MCG (@malrg)
2nd September 2024, 5:05
At this level it is almost always the car, all the top drivers are so close to one another it is the car that makes the difference. Always was, always will be.
Broderick Harper (@banbrorace)
2nd September 2024, 12:32
The problem is when great drivers have had great cars and been winning all the time (i.e. Alonso, Hamilton, Max) they have a tendency to say things about a relatively (to them) non performing car, that just look stupid.
Nick T.
2nd September 2024, 13:39
Drivers are all spoiled babies. To be fair to Alonso, he had much more reason than the others to complain as the car was only capable of finishing in the top 16 at best. But, yeah, none of these drivers have a clue what/how parts needs to be redesigned. That’s down to those with PhDs. They just know in what ways it’s not performing.