New Losail gravel will help avoid repeat of last year’s Qatar “mess” – Stroll

17 comments on “New Losail gravel will help avoid repeat of last year’s Qatar “mess” – Stroll”

1. 

   Jere (@jerejj)
   29th November 2024, 7:13

   When the race director change happened, I hoped the obsession of arbitrarily shortening some activation zones would finally stop for good.
   Apparently, it still won’t, regardless of who’s the race director.
   Rui Marques kept the same starting point for Strip which Wittich had chosen, so he should’ve equally kept the same starting point for the Losail S/F straight, & the weirdest thing is that Losail already received a shortening for last year’s edition by 75 meters (from 130m after last corner to 205m after) from the initial starting point choice before the event began & 5 meters beyond the 2021 starting point (200m after), which was more than enough, not to mention worked perfectly in both sprint & the race, so zero justification for any further shortening, especially as the Losail International Circuit is a relatively difficult circuit for overtaking due to its flowing nature, so the risk of further magnified DRS train effect exists, & therefore, zero benefits for anyone once again.
   This whole shortening thing ever since early-2023 has been entirely unnecessary & unjustifiable, especially with following getting harder season by season, so contradictory & inconsistent as well.
   What’s more, no activation zone has ever got shortened for two consecutive seasons before, so a first-time thing as well, which means that even Jeddah, Imola, Montmelo, Spa, COTA, & AHR aren’t necessarily safe from further shortening for next season if Marques continues as the RD, & he might even cancel Wittich’s decisions of bringing the starting point forward in Monza & Baku, even though they were done for a reason, even if he didn’t cancel his predecessor’s decision to bring forward the Strip starting point by 50 meters during last year’s edition.
   I don’t know what happened after Masi because neither he nor Charlie was obsessed with activation zone shortenings, but Wittich was & apparently, Marques as well.
   The post-2025 DRS removal couldn’t come any sooner when this unnecessary shortening thing stops at the very latest as the manual override system will be available throughout a lap like KERS or ERS, & the active aero zones can cover the entire straight or full-throttle section lengths, given it isn’t like DRS & will be available for everyone on every (except maybe lap 1/first lap after SC & red like with DRS) sprint & race lap under fully green-flag & dry conditions without any detection point/below 1-sec reference like with DRS anyway.
   1. 

      S
      29th November 2024, 8:04

      This whole shortening thing ever since early-2023 has been entirely unnecessary & unjustifiable

      The F1-associated FIA team have deemed it both necessary and justifiable.

      given it isn’t like DRS

      Oh, yes, it will be – but even worse.
      And then they’ll modify its usage as it will have caused too much harm to what little actual racing F1 has ever been able to muster.
      1. 

         Jere (@jerejj)
         1st December 2024, 7:42

         S Then explain why Jeddah, Spa, COTA, & AHR didn’t get shortening last year like Bahrain, Miami, Baku, & Losail, but this year separately even though following was already harder last year relative to 2022 & even harder this year.
         Likewise, Imola didn’t feature any easy-looking passes in 2022 nor did Kemmel straight feature them in any higher quantity in 2023 relative to ’22, while all easy-looking passes in the 2023 Spanish GP were solely down to big car & tyre deltas caused strategic variability.
         Shortening simply shouldn’t be done on any circuits that are even remotely difficult for overtaking & regarding Losail’s extra shortening for a second consecutive year being unjustified, I think the Sprint speaks volumes & proves my point.
         Shortening should’ve only been done in 2022, if at all, & not at all either this or last year anymore.
         Some zones were extended within the previous technical reg cycle in response to following getting harder season by season, so the current cycle shouldn’t have been treated any differently.
         As for active aero, simply no, because everyone can use it on each lap, so no one’s disadvantaged.
   2. 

      notagrumpyfan
      29th November 2024, 8:58

      I hoped the obsession of arbitrarily shortening some activation zones would finally stop

      You are wrong to assume that this is done ‘arbitrarily’.
      .

      The post-2025 DRS removal couldn’t come any sooner when this unnecessary shortening thing stops at the very latest as the manual override system will be available throughout a lap

      And, you might be disappointed when they introduce the new addition to the family F1 of racing intervention tools. According to Jan Monchaux their mom might not wear a dress she can lift, but “works a similar way to DRS”.

      I’d argue it’s even worse as there are no longer visual cues for the fans, and the impact lasts much longer (full lap).

      Both DRS and MOM might not be arbitrary, but IMO it’s an unfair manipulation of giving an artificial benefit to one driver only because he has a natural disadvantage at another part of the track.
      1. 

         notagrumpyfan
         29th November 2024, 9:09

         If not removing (nor replacing) DRS entirely, then they should design it in a way that as close as possible neutralises the disadvantage of following in the curvy bits.

         One way to do this is by allowing DRS when exiting a corner (rather than later on the straight) and allow it to be open for roughly the amount of metres it takes to offset the lost time in the corner.
         It will have 2 advantages: 1) when at top speed – and mostly even before the overtake is finished – it will deactivate (maybe not as abruptly) and both drivers have to fight for the lead with the same technical rules; 2) and, drivers can pick their point where to activate it, it becomes a driver skill not to activate it too early, which we can observe as fans.
         1. 

            Jere (@jerejj)
            1st December 2024, 7:30

            notagrumpyfan DRS automatically deactivates only when applying brakes.
            1. 

               Jere (@jerejj)
               1st December 2024, 7:31

               notagrumpyfan & yes, arbitrary indeed.
      2. 

         notagrumpyfan
         29th November 2024, 9:15

         Also the new regulations missed one huge opportunity to replace DRS.

         The cars will have active aero, including a z-mode in which the front wing can create maximum downforce.
         They should’ve developed this z-mode in a way that it only benefits cars in corners when closely following another car.
         Had they done it like this then it would be the perfect DRS replacement: directly offsetting the disadvantage they want to eliminate; and, available for all drivers at all times.
      3. 

         SPArtacus
         29th November 2024, 14:10

         Obviously he didn’t mean 100% arbitrarily, but rather poorly thought out adjustments, which are too infrequently tweaked one way or the other if the DRS zone is shown to be either way too powerful or totally useless.
         1. 

            Jere (@jerejj)
            1st December 2024, 7:30

            SPArtacus No, I indeed meant that way because if overtaking wasn’t too easy with 2022 or 2023-spec cars, neither can it be with 2024-spec cars if the starting points remain unchanged simply because following is harder.
2. 

   Red Andy (@red-andy)
   29th November 2024, 7:24

   To Sean Kelly’s point: they don’t. People will get ill, like they did last year. Holding two GPs on consecutive weekends on opposite sides of the world is just reckless.
   1. 

      S
      29th November 2024, 8:09

      Except it’s not reckless – it’s voluntary.
      Not a single person needs to attend both events. Not even one. They can swap out mechanics, engineers, strategists, logistics crews – even the drivers could have one of the weekends off.

      F1 teams might not like sufficient staff rotation, but every sensible business that operates in this manner in any industry makes proper use of human resources. Except F1.
      1. 

         Jere (@jerejj)
         1st December 2024, 7:43

         S Teams can only do so much rotation in any case, even at the very maximum rather than literally unlimitedly.
   2. 

      SPArtacus
      29th November 2024, 14:16

      People have quickly forgot people got ill because the race turned into one big quali session since the drivers were required to change tires every 18 laps + they went there at the worst time of year. Driving a quali lap feels like sprinting (in terms of heart rate) while race pace feels like jogging (I speak from personal experience + also what bio-tracked F1 drivers have shown). This year, the temps and humidity are radically lower. It will not be an issue for anyone.
      1. 

         Red Andy (@red-andy)
         29th November 2024, 14:53

         It wasn’t just drivers, but people all over the paddock. They got ill in Abu Dhabi too (with apologies to Fred Flintstone). The ridiculous end-of-season schedule had more to do with it than conditions in Qatar.
3. 

   Moshambles (@moshambles)
   29th November 2024, 9:53

   I hope the curbs at Losail aren’t wider than an F1 car and we don’t sill have to have lap deletions and penalties.
   1. 

      S
      29th November 2024, 12:30

      If lap times get deleted, it’ll be for the same reason as it is everywhere else – because the drivers choose not to stay on the track.
      It really doesn’t matter how wide the kerbs are – all that matters is where the cars are in relation to the white lines.

      Or at least, that’s what the rules say – so that probably won’t be how it happens in reality.

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