I can’t believe how a sport like F1 can spend minutes reviewing if Ollie Bearman’s lap time was before the red flag or after.
It’s an electronic system. Someone surely presses a button and decides it’s a red flag situation. That has a time stamp. Just like Ollie’s lap, right? So is it inside or outside?
The margin of error must be like 0.0001 secs… How can it take so long (and potentially get it wrong)? @Fer-no65
Carlos Sainz Jnr: 'This is a high confidence track and I’ve been happy with the car since Friday. The lap in Q2 is testament to that confidence and I went into Q3 wanting to improve even more.'
Andrea Kimi Antonelli: 'I really struggled to put everything together in my single laps on the soft tyre and it just did not feel quite right. It was really tricky to get the tyres in the right window; I didn’t quite have enough grip, and I really struggled to get into a good rhythm.'
'It was a very tough day for us and, as was the case in Miami, we were not able to improve our times on the new tyres, doing our fastest lap (in Q2) with the first set from Q1. The tyre situation was strange for everyone today, but it seemed to affect us more than the others and I also think we didn’t execute the session as well as we could have done.'
'It was quite an easy race I’d say out front. I had a great start and was able to take the lead. From then on it was just about managing the gap, making sure nobody got in my DRS and that’s kind of what I did and just managed the tyres.'
'The German driver overtook his rookie team mate early in the 18-lap event before controlling things from the front to claim the win, as Nikola Tsolov rounded out the podium for Campos Racing.'
'For some reason the Federation International de l’Automobile, the governing body of global motor sport, has recently sought to cast itself as a sporting administrative version of The Blues Brothers’ Sister Mary Stigmata, the nun who becomes so incensed by the siblings’ fruity language she ends up furiously slapping them about the head with a stick before decrying their 'filthy mouths and bad attitudes' and ordering them to 'get out and don’t come back until you’ve redeemed yourselves'.'
Born today in 1928: Jo Schlesser, who was killed in 1968 when he crashed his Honda in heavy rain during his first world championship race at Rouen in France
Born today in 1967: Heinz-Harald Frentzen – Team mate to Michael Schumacher and Karl Wendlinger in Mercedes’ sports car team; Won three F1 races, with Williams and Jordan; 1997 championship runner-up to team mate Jacques Villeneuve
45 years ago today Carlos Reutemann won the Monaco Grand Prix after pole sitter Didier Pironi crashed
I’m also baffled by FIA’s (not F1’s) lengthy review despite all the available data & footage these days.
Q2 was first supposed to commence at 16:46 local time until postponed by 12 minutes due to this process, which ultimately affected everyone.
While the system is mostly digital, actual red flags also count and you need to review video to confirm when they are waved. The key appears to be when the very first red flag was shown anywhere on the circuit .
Add to that even modern electronics do not allow for instant updates to all electronic indicator boards plus all drivers displays – there are measurable delays which get bigger when you consider the track lengths are measured in miles.
Add to that even modern electronics do not allow for instant updates to all electronic indicator boards plus all drivers displays – there are measurable delays which get bigger when you consider the track lengths are measured in miles.
Radio waves as electromagnetic waves are just basically lower frequency light, so whether the transmission is down a fibre optic cable or over the air it’s pretty fast. The delay is in low single digit milliseconds for the track distances. My PC to the track would be double-digit.
Not instant, but most certainly not the 3.3 seconds the FIA quoted.
A more believable explanation would be that the FIA don’t have the red flag alerts linked to the timing system, because they are the FIA and “common sense” isn’t (common)
A more believable explanation would be that the FIA don’t have the red flag alerts linked to the timing system, because they are the FIA and “common sense” isn’t (common)
Also the red flag panels are flashing, which means they are off half of the time.
Thus a flashing light might appear off when coming into view. But even this would only be valid for a (few) tenth of a second.
They should divide the red flag panels into two parts flashing in opposite sequence.
Yeah, that seems the most likely explanation of why on footage we saw being analysed the lights seemed to still be off when Bearman came over the line. Really curious this took so long to be sure.
The driver extraction process was a bit concerning! They manually rolled the car back over with him still in it before he got out. It looked like he had clearance to get himself out, aeroscreen and rollbar did their job properly. Is that normal in Indy? What if there’s a fire?
He did seem a little dazed at first but clearly concious. Rolling the car over seems to putting driver and crew at unnecessary extra risk.
PS Sorry caught the report button before the reply button!
They spoke to him first so its not concerning but compare and contrast when they tipped Barrichello upright at Imola in 94. THAT was concerning and its why they spoke to Herta before even attempting to right his car
@gdog The AMR safety guys are some of the best in the buisness. They know what they’re doing. They were speaking to Colton the whole time and since he was mobile decided to flip the car over to make extraction easier for everyone.
Vandoorne’s Formula E win in Tokyo was extremely suspicious. I suspect that the race may have been fixed, in a very similar way to Crashgate (Piquet deliberately crashing in the Singapore F1).
Like Alonso’s insanely early pitstop in Singapore, Vandoorne deliberately wasted energy as much as possible in the opening laps, e.g. by wheelspinning, to guarantee that he would be by far the first to be allowed to do his mandatory pitstop, which he took as soon as it was possible. He wasn’t even doing that well in spite of this energy wasting.
Almost immediately after Vandoorne pitted, Guenther ground to a halt on track. Guenther is not Vandoorne’s Maserati teammate, but his DS team is the sister team to Vandoorne’s Maserati team – they are the only 2 teams to run the Stellantis powertrain.
Guenther’s car triggered a rare warning that it was in a ‘red’ state (which has only happened once or twice in the 10+ year history of Formula E), which necessitates marshalls to take great care procedurally to avoid electrocution when recovering the car. This automatically forces the race director to red flag the race, as happened with Jake Dennis early this season.
Immediately after the red flag was triggered, Guenther’s car miraculously recovered from the red state. You could just see the FIA race director cursing before the TV editor cut away from him – I certainly hope he didn’t swear…
Once the race restarted with Vandoorne close at the back of the pack, all of his opposition had to pit at various points over the next 8 or so laps, as their mandatory pit stop must be taken within a certain middling window of remaining battery capacity according to the rules. Once they had all pitted, Vandoorne was left with at least 20 second gap ahead of second place, and was able to cruise home to an underserved win.
A similar scenario happened to Mueller in Monaco, more due to genuine luck. But I feel this may have been race fixing collusion between the sister Stellantis teams, who perhaps got the idea from that previous race. Guenther may have been made to deliberately made to break down in such a way as to cause a red flag.
Much like Renault were in Singapore, the Maserati team are under enormous pressure for their future existence. The team was forced into a precarious position last month when a deal for it to be purchased fell through. Maserati MSG subsequently moved into the hands of Formula E, which has the right to recall the ownership licence if a team fails to meet certain financial obligations.
The FIA can’t even look at TV footage and see that Bearman passed the timing line significantly before the red flag lights turned on – certainly not 3.3 seconds after, as they tried to gaslight us afterwards. So I have no faith in their ability to check this. The same day, the Formula E race director and safety car driver inspected the treacherously wet Tokyo circuit to see if it was too dangerous by drifting round in a 1000bhp Porsche Taycan ‘safety car’ without even wearing helmets.
I’d expect more from others. But weirdly, nobody seems to have seen what I’ve seen. Again.
This time, unlike the various helmets striking halos I’ve observed, particularly in F1, it’s because nobody is watching Formula E. Which is a shame – it’s consistently entertaining, albeit a bit silly at times. But it is a FIA world championship, so this potential race fixing should have been investigated to verify that Gunther’s break down was genuine. But nobody even questioned this possibility.
Kringle
18th May 2025, 1:39
Glad there’s a comma after thrilled…
Go Weeyums!
Jere (@jerejj)
18th May 2025, 5:55
I’m also baffled by FIA’s (not F1’s) lengthy review despite all the available data & footage these days.
Q2 was first supposed to commence at 16:46 local time until postponed by 12 minutes due to this process, which ultimately affected everyone.
HW Small
18th May 2025, 6:39
While the system is mostly digital, actual red flags also count and you need to review video to confirm when they are waved. The key appears to be when the very first red flag was shown anywhere on the circuit .
Add to that even modern electronics do not allow for instant updates to all electronic indicator boards plus all drivers displays – there are measurable delays which get bigger when you consider the track lengths are measured in miles.
SteveP
18th May 2025, 7:13
Radio waves as electromagnetic waves are just basically lower frequency light, so whether the transmission is down a fibre optic cable or over the air it’s pretty fast. The delay is in low single digit milliseconds for the track distances. My PC to the track would be double-digit.
Not instant, but most certainly not the 3.3 seconds the FIA quoted.
A more believable explanation would be that the FIA don’t have the red flag alerts linked to the timing system, because they are the FIA and “common sense” isn’t (common)
S Arkazam
18th May 2025, 9:52
Also the red flag panels are flashing, which means they are off half of the time.
Thus a flashing light might appear off when coming into view. But even this would only be valid for a (few) tenth of a second.
They should divide the red flag panels into two parts flashing in opposite sequence.
BasCB (@bascb)
18th May 2025, 13:31
Yeah, that seems the most likely explanation of why on footage we saw being analysed the lights seemed to still be off when Bearman came over the line. Really curious this took so long to be sure.
Jere (@jerejj)
18th May 2025, 11:37
HW Small Track lengths are actually measured in kilometers & smaller portions in meters as per FIA standard.
Derek Edwards
18th May 2025, 7:30
I still love the tribute to Jo Schlesser by Guy Ligier, remembered in the JS designation of his cars.
MichaelN
18th May 2025, 8:11
Glad Herta is okay. The folks in the stands seemed thoroughly unimpressed. Bit odd.
gDog (@gdog)
18th May 2025, 8:39
The driver extraction process was a bit concerning! They manually rolled the car back over with him still in it before he got out. It looked like he had clearance to get himself out, aeroscreen and rollbar did their job properly. Is that normal in Indy? What if there’s a fire?
He did seem a little dazed at first but clearly concious. Rolling the car over seems to putting driver and crew at unnecessary extra risk.
PS Sorry caught the report button before the reply button!
S Arkazam
18th May 2025, 9:57
Especially the fact that they dropped the car the last few centimetres seems a bit concerning.
Tony Mansell (@tonymansell)
18th May 2025, 12:32
They spoke to him first so its not concerning but compare and contrast when they tipped Barrichello upright at Imola in 94. THAT was concerning and its why they spoke to Herta before even attempting to right his car
S Arkazam
18th May 2025, 21:36
Dr Herta confirmed that he did not have any vertebrae damage? :P
Thank you listing other concerning situations.
Mark in Florida
18th May 2025, 13:16
@gdog The AMR safety guys are some of the best in the buisness. They know what they’re doing. They were speaking to Colton the whole time and since he was mobile decided to flip the car over to make extraction easier for everyone.
Alesici
18th May 2025, 18:30
Vandoorne’s Formula E win in Tokyo was extremely suspicious. I suspect that the race may have been fixed, in a very similar way to Crashgate (Piquet deliberately crashing in the Singapore F1).
Like Alonso’s insanely early pitstop in Singapore, Vandoorne deliberately wasted energy as much as possible in the opening laps, e.g. by wheelspinning, to guarantee that he would be by far the first to be allowed to do his mandatory pitstop, which he took as soon as it was possible. He wasn’t even doing that well in spite of this energy wasting.
Almost immediately after Vandoorne pitted, Guenther ground to a halt on track. Guenther is not Vandoorne’s Maserati teammate, but his DS team is the sister team to Vandoorne’s Maserati team – they are the only 2 teams to run the Stellantis powertrain.
Guenther’s car triggered a rare warning that it was in a ‘red’ state (which has only happened once or twice in the 10+ year history of Formula E), which necessitates marshalls to take great care procedurally to avoid electrocution when recovering the car. This automatically forces the race director to red flag the race, as happened with Jake Dennis early this season.
Immediately after the red flag was triggered, Guenther’s car miraculously recovered from the red state. You could just see the FIA race director cursing before the TV editor cut away from him – I certainly hope he didn’t swear…
Once the race restarted with Vandoorne close at the back of the pack, all of his opposition had to pit at various points over the next 8 or so laps, as their mandatory pit stop must be taken within a certain middling window of remaining battery capacity according to the rules. Once they had all pitted, Vandoorne was left with at least 20 second gap ahead of second place, and was able to cruise home to an underserved win.
A similar scenario happened to Mueller in Monaco, more due to genuine luck. But I feel this may have been race fixing collusion between the sister Stellantis teams, who perhaps got the idea from that previous race. Guenther may have been made to deliberately made to break down in such a way as to cause a red flag.
Much like Renault were in Singapore, the Maserati team are under enormous pressure for their future existence. The team was forced into a precarious position last month when a deal for it to be purchased fell through. Maserati MSG subsequently moved into the hands of Formula E, which has the right to recall the ownership licence if a team fails to meet certain financial obligations.
The FIA can’t even look at TV footage and see that Bearman passed the timing line significantly before the red flag lights turned on – certainly not 3.3 seconds after, as they tried to gaslight us afterwards. So I have no faith in their ability to check this. The same day, the Formula E race director and safety car driver inspected the treacherously wet Tokyo circuit to see if it was too dangerous by drifting round in a 1000bhp Porsche Taycan ‘safety car’ without even wearing helmets.
I’d expect more from others. But weirdly, nobody seems to have seen what I’ve seen. Again.
This time, unlike the various helmets striking halos I’ve observed, particularly in F1, it’s because nobody is watching Formula E. Which is a shame – it’s consistently entertaining, albeit a bit silly at times. But it is a FIA world championship, so this potential race fixing should have been investigated to verify that Gunther’s break down was genuine. But nobody even questioned this possibility.