Sebastian Vettel says it’s too soon to describe Charles Leclerc as the toughest team mate he’s had in his 13-year F1 career.
After 17 races together at Ferrari, Leclerc leads the four-times champion by 221 points to 212, and has out-qualified Vettel 9-6 over sessions where both drivers set times.But asked in Japan whether Leclerc was the hardest team mate he’d gone up against, Vettel said “I don’t think it’s fair, it’s been too short.”
“Certainly, obviously, he’s young, he’s very quick. I don’t think there’s anybody who doubts that.”
Vettel’s previous F1 team mates include Kimi Raikkonen (2015-18), Daniel Ricciardo (2014), Mark Webber (2009-13), Sebastien Bourdais (2008), Vitantonio Liuzzi (2007) and Nick Heidfeld (2007).
“Ultimately you can’t really compare because you would need to put Mark, Kimi, Daniel [and] Vitantonio in the same car at the same time so it’s not fair,” Vettel continued.
“Certainly in terms of raw speed [Leclerc’s] very quick but obviously is still very early for him. He’s only in his second season in Formula 1 so it’s very different to Kimi or Mark who spent a lot of time in F1 and had a lot more experience.”
However Vettel said he had benefited from Leclerc’s input when he had struggled with the SF90.
“It’s good that he’s a real reference and especially in the times where I struggled a little bit to to really get the most out of myself and the car then it’s good to have that because it can also help you. And as a team it’s good to have you know two drivers fighting for the same ground on-track.”
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Bulgarian (@bulgarian)
21st October 2019, 10:42
Vettel is right! He was destroyed by Daniel Ricciardo in 2014 (3-11 in races and 7-12 in qualifyings).
NewVerstappenFan (@jureo)
21st October 2019, 11:43
Ricciardo was then destroyed by Verstappen…
So nothing fancy there. Lewis was also destroyed 9 races in a row by Rosberg.
Nothin to it. Seb is very sensitive to a bad car.
Leclerc is super fast. In any machinery. Riciardo had that trait aswell. Vettel dervies his speed from perfection, that is why he is often viewed as inferior to Hamilton, Alonso, Riciardo now Leclerc.
But when car will be to his liking it will be a more even competition. He might still come in bellow Leclerc but time will tell.
Maybe next year their car will be further ahead of Mercedes and still poorly handling. Leclerc then could win the title who knows. A well handling slow car might be well handling and Vettel might be faster than his teammate in it. But a faster poor handling car might be faster overall.
Bottas has a similar issue in Mercedes aswell. When there were great difficulties in car handling Hamilton was able to drive around it much better. Now that car is much better Bottas can win races aswell.
MEGATRON M12 (@megatron)
21st October 2019, 12:21
Complete nonsense
lucifer (@lucifer)
21st October 2019, 12:59
+1
Mashiat (@mashiat)
21st October 2019, 13:05
@jureo Hamilton was never “destroyed” nine races in a row by Rosberg. Last 3 races in 2015, Rosberg had the upper hand, but not on pace in 2016. Vettel’s main issue is pure pace, more than anything. Hamilton was not slower than Rosberg on pure pace in Australia, Bahrain, Russia or Spain. Unlike Vettel, who was outqualified 9 times in a row.
Bruno Verrari
21st October 2019, 14:32
ROS 7 – HAM 0 (3 + 4)…
Not nine eins in a row, but still destroyed tvrough seven!!!
Mashiat (@mashiat)
21st October 2019, 15:41
He was not destroyed. In Melbourne, he was pushed wide by Rosberg on lap 1 from pole, leading to him dropping down the pack. Bahrain he was hit by Bottas after once again being on pole. In China, he had an issue in Q1 which meant he started last, then was hit again at the start. At Russia, he had an issue in Q3 which meant he started 10th, but still had the pace to hunt down Rosberg and put him under pressure until a late issue meant he had to back-off. Hardly “destroyed”. It was just a run of poor starts and luck. But he was never slow in the way was. Vettel is genuinely slower than Leclerc, and finally getting another pole when his teammate has had six doesn’t change that.
GeeForce
22nd October 2019, 5:03
Vettel’s race pace has been better than Charles. As we have seen in many races quali doesn’t win you races. They give you a better chance but races are won on a Sunday.
Todfod (@todfod)
22nd October 2019, 13:18
Vette’s race pace was better ? When???
In Australia? When Leclerc was lapping 2 seconds a lap faster than Vettel and was asked to stay behind his teammate?
Or in Bahrain? Where Leclerc stormed past Vettel and just built up a 12 second lead on his teammate?
Or in China? Where Leclerc let Vettel by in the opening laps and Vettel couldn’t open up more than a 2 second lead on his teammate?
Or in Austria? Was Vettel quicker there?
Or in Belgium? Was Vettel even in the same league as his teammate?
petebaldwin (@)
21st October 2019, 13:16
Some good points there. Ignore the fanboys.
Some cars suit certain drivers more than others and Vettel seems extremely sensitive to it – he really struggles when a car doesn’t suit his style whereas some others can adapt better.
erikje
21st October 2019, 14:40
Nice nuance!
Carlos Medrano (@carlosmedrano)
21st October 2019, 17:34
Ricciardo got 3 times the poles and overall they were even in points over their whole time together and thats with the obvious favoritism red bull had for max
Mog
21st October 2019, 21:35
Which is why he left. The Drive to Survive series basically showed as much.
BasCB (@bascb)
22nd October 2019, 6:57
I think you misunderstand what “destroyed” means there @jureo. Yes, there have been times where Hamilton was beaten by Rosberg. And there have been periods where he managed to do that for several races in one go.
But being destroyed doesn’t mean just beating Hamilton often enough to win the title, but rather finishing far ahead more often than not, instead of having a fight on his hands almost all the time, like Rosberg had.
Yes, he did beat Hamilton, and outscored him for the WDC in 2016. He did do a better job than Hamilton that year. But he never got close to “destroying” Hamilton. Not to mention that it isn’t “destroying” when Rosberg himself was the first to admit that to be able to beat Lewis to the title he had to give his all.
NewVerstappenFan (@jureo)
22nd October 2019, 7:46
:D I use the term “destroyed” loosely. Vettel was never really destroyed by a teammate. At worst he is slightly behind. Destroyed is what Verstappen did to Gasly.
And Hamilton was never struggling with a car enough to be fully destroyed. Button outscored him during their time in McLaren, Rosberg did beat him by a tiny margin in 2016, and that is about it. Hamilton can turn a bad car around and be competitive against any teammate.
Vettel cannot cope with that, he is not that kind of driver. I reckon he never was. Maybe during that first STR win in Monza. But generally he under-performs if the car is not good.
DrG
22nd October 2019, 11:00
Button lost to Hamilton on every statistic that counts bar one year (2011)
You know, his worst year ever where he won the same number of races and scored the only none red bull pole of the year. The year where Button despite being second was out of the championship running several races from the end. Find a Hamilton year where he was not in the running at the end? Do not even talk about how many races Button or Maclaren have won since Brazil 2012 where Button inherited the win after the Hulk took out the leader (guess who?) thus allowing this new ‘out scored’ across multiple years to be introduced (by Button) and trotted out by the anything but Hamilton fans such as yourself on repeated occasions. Funny how only Hamilton is eligible for this unique status.
Rosberg lost to Hamilton on every statistic that counts bar one year (2016) You know, the year Hamilton won more races, won more pole positions, did not drive into other drivers repeatedly, but unfortunately also won the unique Mercedes unreliability battle by miles and thus the championship by 5 points.
But, yep despite 13 years of a broad enough canvas of records and topping virtually all but two stats once thought unattainable, he was ‘destroyed’ by those pesky world champions.
I mean they just thrashed him didn’t they?
You need a new dictionary and please refrain from the constant attempts to rewrite what is a pretty obviously astounding canvas of work to any onlooker.
F1oSaurus (@)
22nd October 2019, 18:47
@jureo
Oh come on, Vettel was utterly destroyed by Ricciardo. Vettel finished ahead of Ricciardo only 3 times! How is that “slightly behind”?
Even worse Vettel was only ahead ion those because either Ricciardo had to avoid a crash or Red Bull helped Vettel in front with an undercut pit stop.
Todfod (@todfod)
22nd October 2019, 11:30
@jureo
Just think about how badly Verstappen would smash Vettel then!
NewVerstappenFan (@jureo)
22nd October 2019, 11:43
:D Yeah, you could think that.
Like Schumacher was destroyed by Rosberg, Rosberg was destroyed by Hamilton, Hamilton must then be GOT with Rosberg #2. But nobody really would place Rosberg on #2 GOT list.
Verstappen right now is probably #2 only to Hamilton. Well this was few months ago. Now Leclerc is so hot all the cards are being reshuffled. For first time in his career Vettel looks like a clear #2.
Someday some driver in that #2 slot at Mercedes will make Lewis Hamilton look slow, unless he retires really soon at his peak.
I am quite certain nobody would make Vettel look second rate in 2012. But 2019 here is Leclerc getting the job done.
Dewald Nel (@ho3n3r)
21st October 2019, 10:43
Obvious and logical conclusion.
/inb4 “Seb this, Seb that” meltdown
Yaru
21st October 2019, 11:41
Shots fired.
Ipsom
21st October 2019, 11:56
Yea, it’s still Ricciardo
magon4 (@magon4)
21st October 2019, 12:18
Interesting stat: How many times has Seb outscored his teammate. And how many times has Lewis done the same to his team mates.
Look it up :)
Mashiat (@mashiat)
21st October 2019, 13:10
@magon4 All of Vettel’s teammates combined have a world title count of 1, which was a well-past-it Raikkonen who was a clear number 2. Hamilton’s teammates have had a combined world title count of 4. And two of them were the reigning world champions at the time. Not to mention the way it’s going in 2019, they are both going to have been beaten by teammates for 2 seasons each. I’m far from a Hamilton fan, but it’s laughable when people try to compare him to Vettel. They are not on the same level.
Tango (@tango)
21st October 2019, 13:14
All Hamilton team mates have been race winners too :)
erikje
21st October 2019, 14:43
All ham team mates drove a winning car.
NewVerstappenFan (@jureo)
22nd October 2019, 11:44
All Ham cars were winning cars also :D
magon4 (@magon4)
21st October 2019, 19:46
I don’t put Vettel at the same level as Hamilton (I would have in 2017, though). But I do think that Rosberg is comparable to Webber, and Button to Kimi. I think that is a pretty fair assessment.
Mashiat (@mashiat)
22nd October 2019, 7:04
@magon4 I disagree. I rate Rosberg much higher than Webber, and likewise for Button vs. post-comeback Raikkonen. Look at Alonso vs. Raikkonen in 2014, then Alonso vs. Button the following season. Raikkonen is a far easier teammate than Button. Button won 8 races from 2010-2012, while Raikkonen managed 1 total in 2017 and 2018. And as for Webber vs. Rosberg, a rookie Rosberg matched him on pace for most of 2006. Not to mention Webber struggled to win races in a dominant Red Bull.
NewVerstappenFan (@jureo)
22nd October 2019, 11:46
Rosberg was for some time the best driver not to win a world championship. He rectified that in due time against Hamilton who is on course to become GOT.
Jose Lopes da Silva
21st October 2019, 22:53
No one beats Alain Prost on that, with 9:
Lauda 3
Rosberg 1
Mansell 1
Senna 3
Hill 1
David
22nd October 2019, 0:40
Massa 10:
Schumacher 7
Kimi 1
Alonso 2
MEGATRON M12 (@megatron)
21st October 2019, 13:27
KUB has more points than RUS, points mean nothing without context. VET has been thoroughly outclassed by both RIC and LEC, and has made far more mistakes than any multi wdc driver in F1 history.
magon4 (@magon4)
21st October 2019, 19:44
yeah, right.
Carlos Medrano (@carlosmedrano)
21st October 2019, 14:29
He isn’t if we are going based on facts that was ricciardo, he absolutely dominated Vettel. Even if red bull were favoring ricciardo once vettel announces he was leaving, Ricciardo still absolutely outclassed him
Edvaldo
21st October 2019, 15:35
Vettel made his name mostly on dinosaurs like Webber and Kimi. He could have them for many more years if they wanted to.
And if it was up for him to choose, Leclerc would still be driving a Sauber.
Thunder Sky
21st October 2019, 16:07
Those dinosaurs are still faster than tortoises like Rosberg and Bottas. No wonder, Hamilton is not allowing any cheetah to join Mercedes.
NewVerstappenFan (@jureo)
22nd October 2019, 11:48
:D I believe Rosberg has proved quite enough that he was a well accomplished racing driver. Certainly at or above Kimi level and far beyond Webber.
dan
21st October 2019, 18:11
I never liked Vettel alot of it is jelousy everyone hates how Vet is on 4 and there guy Alo is on 2 titles and zero since Ham and Vet enterd the sport. Then move on to Ricciardo he will never go down as a great in F1 and the fans of these guys do not like it. I know i didn’t when it was Ham on 1 title, you feel cheated or something.
But luckily i got to see Ham make Vet look silly in a very even car arguably slower in 2018. Ricciardo fans should worry about Hulkenberg the guy who can out qualify Ric many times then get beat by about 5 seconds. Ricciardo as not outclassed anyone for a long time. Ves was way too much for him we know that.
As it goes i say Leclerc easily his toughest teammate best junior driver and beat a 4xWC 9 times in a row in qually. Ricciardo of 2014 had the race pace but Leclerc is just flatout quicker imo. The guy has the most poles this year in his second year of F1. When Lec is 4 tenths up the road and a Merc can outqualify Vettel it shows how good Leclerc is. Imagine Kimi and Vettel in Ferrari this year? Haha what a bad benchmark th\t would be Hamilton would have had about 4 extra pole positions if that was the case lol as he many times splits Leclerc and Vettel.
dan
21st October 2019, 18:13
About the Hulkenberg Ricciardo what i meant is Ric barely beats him he does not outclas shim atall. It is alot closer than it should be. Ricciardo contract is one of the worst in F1. I lost alot of respect for him aswell running from Max
Pete
21st October 2019, 22:44
You should actually watch the races properly re Hulk vs Dan. If you had any idea, Ricciardo would easily be ahead if not for the dumb strategies by Renault e.g. leaving him out on mediums ALL race in Spa, pitting him when he was on for 5th in Monaco etc.
Also if Hulk was that good, Renault would not be dumping him. Sure Ricciardo has had a poor year by his standards but is still ahead. Not to mention stuff like Singapore when he won qualifying only to be excluded.
That isn’t to say Hulk is not bad, but he is not as close to Ricciardo as you make it out to be.
jamt
22nd October 2019, 12:15
The same you can say in the other way. How many times Hulk had played the team game to help Ric?. Ric did a bad desition when he accepted the deal with Renault. We now just speak about the Verstappens and Leclercs as the future of F1 not the Rics. Nevermind considering that Mclaren looks in a better position than Renault for the upcoming years.
stjs16 (@stjs16)
21st October 2019, 20:29
To me, Vettel is like Button; Unbeatable when the car suits but otherwise struggle to adapt as quickly as other champions
Gabe
22nd October 2019, 1:06
That’s a low blow. Vettel is many magnitudes better than Button ever was.
stjs16 (@stjs16)
22nd October 2019, 8:56
I think you underestimate Button, maybe only a single WC but after 2009 He walked into Hamiltons team and certainly didn’t disgrace himself, especially 2011 and the outstanding Canada masterclass.
CHIKANO (@chikano)
23rd October 2019, 7:04
@stjs16
Didn’t Button take out HAM in 2011 Canada?
stjs16 (@stjs16)
23rd October 2019, 7:22
@chikano
Think it was the other way round!
RB13
22nd October 2019, 10:26
Really? Button may not have set the world alight but he didn’t make as many consecutively bad mistakes as Vettel has in the past 2 years. His final race at Monaco as a last minute stand-in post retirement notwithstanding.
praxis (@praxis)
22nd October 2019, 8:44
@stjs16, I’d say Button was at the level of someone like Webber. But that’s my opinion.
stjs16 (@stjs16)
22nd October 2019, 9:11
@praxis Button certainly more successful than Webber. Although, I always felt Webber was never the same after Korea 2010
F1oSaurus (@)
22nd October 2019, 18:50
@stjs16 Vettel is more like Massa. When the car is faster than all other cars, he can put out a good quali lap and then control the race from the front.
If only the slightest thing goes wrong during the ace and/or the car is not at least 3 tenths of a second faster than the other, they start dropping back and crashing into other cars
NewVerstappenFan (@jureo)
22nd October 2019, 11:57
Interesting debate here going on. Who is better who isn’t etc etc.
But in the end number of titles is a fairly good indication of drivers quality.
We all like to say how Verstappen, Riciardo and Leclerc outclass Vettel. I’d like to see them win titles year after year with everyone out to get them.
Look at Hamilton, he struggles to go whole season in top form, always trying to implode at some point. This year could be a lot different if there was a proper #2 alongside him.
We now eagerly anticipate how next year Leclerc will destroy Hamilton and Vettel and establish a clear rival to Max Verstappen. But what if Vettel becomes unbeatable? After 3 years of struggling maybe its time?
Vettel needs 1 more career turn around to rival Hamilton for quality in current generation.
Everyone else is far far behind in titles.
dan
22nd October 2019, 17:16
@jureo haha yeah he as really imploded in fighting back in 2014 2016 and the masterclass of 2018 were not in 2011 anymore bud
dan
22nd October 2019, 18:08
@jureo To add to that i have not seen Hamilton implode atall, if you are gonna be fair than call Vet out onit 3 seasons in a row huge mistakes, one was title losing mistakes. Abit like you saying no one would beat Vet in 2012, 2 years later that was put to bed by Ricciardo so do not understand what you mean as Vet was mega in 2013 with a bad teammate.
I am a huge Ham fan but i am unbiast, the guy come on strong every year near the end to win his titles or lose as in 2016 but he was still the one putting the pressure on. Hamilton has been incredibly clutch as americans would say. 2011 he imploded that isit, not on pace though Hamilton as never been shown to be slower than a teammate over a whole season and that is a fact. He as been beat but he was not slower.
F1oSaurus (@)
22nd October 2019, 19:03
@jureo Yeah agree to some extent. People say Verstappen would easily be winning races if he had the fastest car, yet he couldn’t do so in Monaco two times in a row when Red Bull was the car to beat there. Nor in China 2018 where he clumsily rammed into Vettel and Ricciardo took the win instead. Or Brazil 2018, where his feud with Ocon got the better of him.
The strength of Hamilton is that, like Schumacher or Senna, he never gives up and nearly always extracts the maximum from the car. Notably winning races where he didn’t have the fastest car (in 2018 for instance races like Baku, Germany, Hungary and Monza)
Leclerc is even more error prone than Verstappen and to be honest, I don’t think Leclerc is even nearly as impressive as Verstappen is (on his good days).
So yeah, lets first see them mount a full season WDC challenge and actually take the title.
NewVerstappenFan (@jureo)
23rd October 2019, 8:20
Yup, so we can agree maybe right now in F1:
1. Hamilton
2. Verstappen
3. Leclerc
Is that a fair order?
And Vettel is at best around 7-10?
dan
23rd October 2019, 12:22
@jureo I would say
Hamilton/Vestappen
Leclerc
Ricciardo/Vettel
Bottas
I would even put Bottas in that group i mean he is being beaten by someone many say is the best so he is not way off the pace is he. Also his qually times are very good with Hamilton
I think im taking 2018 Hamilton over any driver though he was on another level, he was also brilliant as a youngster some even say his first 4 years was probably the quickest he ever was but i feel he was a better driver from 2012 onwards.
I would say he was actually the quickest as a rookie
We will never know who is the fastest out the top 3 i personally do not feel Hamilton would be the quickest in qually over a season anymore vs Leclerc and Ves he would be fairly even, but i feel his racepace and racecraft is the best.
You have to remember Hamilton is alot older than the other 2 guys and has been in alot more battles. I would rather take the qually/racepace combo though as it is more than half the job it is hard to overtake a fairly even driver as a teammate.
I still do not get you’re Hamilton would implode though where as that come from, has he even imploded because of a teammate? Because i have never seen it, i seen his teammate retire though fairly young as he could not hack Hamilton.
Chears.
DrG
23rd October 2019, 17:43
I have trouble understanding how they the guy with the most astounding record of poles in the history of F1 is suddenly being questioned as to his 13 year history of such by a guy with err… one!
I mean really?
Hamilton in his worst year took the only none red bull pole. The only one the whole year. Even the Merc years struggled there.
You chaps need to think about that.
FiamD (@fiamd)
23rd October 2019, 19:39
@jureo I disagree with you on the issue of number of WDCs as a mark of quality of the driver – it really depends on circumstances. I consider podiums (total or more realistically the percentage) as better measure of driver productivity over his career, over different cars and maybe different teams. On that score, I think history will treat Vettel much more kindly than some of the comments herein (though I am not his fan and don’t consider him as good as his contemporary, Hamilton)
But your 2020 scenario is an interesting one. If the relative running order (Ferrari>Merc>Red Bull) remains, then I don’t see Merc having a chance at the WCC; it will be Ferrari’s. But, in the WDC I see a super consistent Hamilton taking it. LEC and VET will not give each other an inch, and VET will be fighting hard for his legacy.
NewVerstappenFan (@jureo)
25th October 2019, 12:32
@fiamd
Yes that is an even better metric.
There are a few guys who really throw statistics at the issue of driver performance. But in the end mostly the same people pop up.
There is not a driver list where Vettel isn’t close to the top. However you throw at it. Podiums, Wins, Poles, Championships, even penalty points. :D
But then again even Hulkenberg is a lot better than his podium stats show for it. Any singular stat is just an approximation of driver quality.
Best situation for next year would be a fight between slightly faster Ferrari and slightly slower but much more consistent Hamilton. I think for his 7th championship he should really have to fight for it.
It is hard to see how any team will be faster enough from Mercedes though. But if Ferrari really hook up, I don’t see Vettel going down without a strong title fight. Leclerc will have a fight on his hands. And I don’t see Lewis not having a say in it either.