Dangerous and Non-Raceable tracks
- 6th September 2011, 16:31 at 4:31 pm #130041Oli PeacockParticipant
The title may be a little misleading, but what i mean by that is that can you think of any modern day race track that was too tight or narrow etc to race on
To get the ball rolling here is one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beijing_International_Streetcircuit
For the inaugeral race at the Beijing street track, a new corner had to be devised overnight because the serise that was racing there (A1GP) was not able to get round a hairpin because it was too tight, once they added another, wider hairpin before the previous hairpin,the cars had to avoid the pit lane entry wall. Also there was loose drain cover and advertising boards, yet the race still went on!!6th September 2011, 17:33 at 5:33 pm #177933GeorgeParticipant
Are we talking for F1 cars or just in general? Pau and Macau both have very tight hairpins and limited runoff, although series like F3 still race there.
I’m not sure what the last F1 track to be dropped due to safety issues was actually, Imola perhaps? I cant remember whether Hockenheim was neutered due to safety or just someone being criminally insane either.6th September 2011, 17:45 at 5:45 pm #177934Tom L.Participant
I’m going to be a bit controversial to get some discussion going… Monaco.
It’s generally accepted that the circuit is not wide enough compared to modern track safety standards.
Access to and removal of cars varies between different parts of the circuit, raising questions on driver and marshal safety. The fact that DRS was banned in the tunnel this year could be interpreted as acceptance that if an accident were to happen in this part of the circuit, the safety standards would not be adequate.
The tunnel has not only poor visibility but can cause cars to lose 20-30% of downforce.
There are bumps, for example the one on the left after Casino Square that the drivers have to actively avoid, that wouldn’t be allowed to remain on a more modern circuit.
Some teams have to adjust their cars’ steering lock especially for Monaco, to enable the drivers to negotiate corners like the Fairmont (/Loews/whatever you want to call it!) Hairpin and to a lesser extent Rascasse.
The accidents suffered by Perez and Petrov in this year’s race showed that even with the safety of modern F1 cars, drivers who suffer accidents have a higher risk of injury than at the majority of other venues.
I’m not sure what the elevation change is and how that compares to the FIA regulations, although it always struck me as being among the greatest – does anyone have any information on that?
If Monaco were to be proposed as a new venue, it would be not be judged suitable for modern F1. Is its “rich heritage” a good enough reason to overlook this fact and perhaps put safety at risk?6th September 2011, 18:08 at 6:08 pm #177935Keith CollantineKeymaster
I caught some footage of the Lithuania 1000km race on Motors TV the other day.
I don’t know who sanctioned it but the track did not look very safe. The cars were blasting around a dual carriageway and pulling into a petrol station for refuelling stops!
Here’s some amateur video from what looks like one of the support races:6th September 2011, 18:34 at 6:34 pm #177936RatboyKeymaster
Thanks for that Keith, best racing video I’ve seen on there
in terms of dangerous tracks I’ll say the Isle of Man track, theres always fatals there. im not saying its a bad track or they shouldnt go there. I love the track. its just a dangerous one.
Un raceable I’d say Valencia. it should be banned and forever removed ;)6th September 2011, 19:06 at 7:06 pm #177937IcthyesParticipant
At 1:18 in that video you can see someone with something that says “acme”, says it all really!
I’m going to agree with Monaco (the gradient of the run down to the chicane is just one concern) and also the Manx TT course.6th September 2011, 20:45 at 8:45 pm #177938Ned FlandersParticipant
I’ve always wondered what MotoGP would be like racing on street circuits like Monaco. Obviously Monaco is way too dangerous for modern bike racing so we’ll never know, but I imagine it would be a fantastic spectacle6th September 2011, 21:24 at 9:24 pm #177939ZazeemsParticipant
Oh I don’t know Ned, they race superbikes round Macau, and it’s an absolutely electrifying (and nail-biting) spectacle.6th September 2011, 21:41 at 9:41 pm #17794091jb12Participant
Keith that race is the Omnitel 1000km race in Palanga, Lithuania. I have the track on a pc game and it literally is one half of a motorway with a tyre chicane, a hairpin onto the other set of lanes then another tyre chicane into an uphill slip road with a sharp left onto the road (which that sliproad leaves) and then a 270 degree right down a sliproad under the bridge and then a chicane onto the start /finish lane of the motorway.
it is chaos and the pitlane is ridiculous6th September 2011, 21:47 at 9:47 pm #177941RatboyKeymaster
@91jb12 so in Lithuania for a motor race they shut a motorway? That is fantastic dedication to motorsport :D6th September 2011, 22:12 at 10:12 pm #177942AnonymousInactive
Yeah I saw that race on Motors TV also and thelack of safety was really really shocking. It was funny listening to the commentators as they had absolutely no idea about the race but that it was the 12th race that had been held. It was funny to see the cars down the motorway.6th September 2011, 22:29 at 10:29 pm #177943Prisoner MonkeysParticipant
For the inaugeral race at the Beijing street track, a new corner had to be devised overnight because the serise that was racing there (A1GP) was not able to get round a hairpin because it was too tight
See also the Beijing International Street Circuit (wow, the Chinese are not very imaginitive when it comes to naming things):
Stupid Football Thing raced there last year, but because a stretch of circuit across the back of the track was too narrow, the circuit was downgraded at the last minute and was considered a “national” event, which meant it became a non-championship round. The officials even considered permanent yellow flags at the section in question so that it could be a points-scoring race, but the FIA said no.6th September 2011, 22:52 at 10:52 pm #177944Juan Pablo HeidfeldParticipant
How do you find that kind of thing Keith? :P7th September 2011, 0:25 at 12:25 am #177945Colonel SandersParticipant
watching the spa 98 race on the red button a couple of weeks ago…..you realise how far safety has come on at spa. at that point, parts of the track were still closed public roads with little to no run off.
Now of course run off areas like pouhon have been de gravel trapped but i still think the fences aren’t high enough. IF (AND ITS A BIG IF) webber and alonso had made contact in the compression of eau rough, the positioning of the fences in front of the stands overlooking this immense corner would have made it difficult to contain the debris from the crowd.
I know this will bring up the age old ‘motor racing is dangerous….it says so on the ticket’ argument but should there not be an FIA fund for sorting these issues out, with all the technology available we should be looking at improving these issues.
motor sport has been lucky recently with a number of accidents on what the FIA deem safe circuits but we can never get complacent in terms of safety. apologises for the length of this post but raised a few issues in my mind…..but back to point did anyone else see the safety truck heading towards graham rahal on the exit on turn 1 at baltimore…..MOMENTS from disaster. Street circuits represent the most dangerous circuit, but the new ones (mainly f1) are being designed in a way to use runoff where possible. i think i got out what i wanted to say but apologises if i rambled on a bit7th September 2011, 8:11 at 8:11 am #177946Keith CollantineKeymaster
How do you find that kind of thing Keith?
The wonders of Motors TV!
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