Mercedes = Car potential never reached
- This topic has 14 replies, 9 voices, and was last updated 6 years, 5 months ago by Anonymous.
- 11th June 2015, 9:01 at 9:01 am #299833
Now here it is again Mercedes ruining F1 by not leting
their drivers race against each other. Dont get me
wrong on this because Hamilton did his job by staying in
the front in canada, BUT!!!! probably only thanks to the Mercedes
team not allowing Rosberg to attack him at all under the whole race.
Boring boring boring and unjust. To scared the brakes would heat up
and so on and so on. I and many more of us who love f1 actually pay
good money to watch the races and to see other teams trying so hard
and then Mercedes doing their little tricks just makes the f1 races
more boring than ever. Come on give everyone a chance…and especially
the second driver of mercedes team who as in second place will
always be there in the races to come.11th June 2015, 9:35 at 9:35 am #299834MatthijsParticipant
I guess you didn’t watch the 2014 Bahrain GP then.12th June 2015, 2:13 at 2:13 am #299949StrontiumParticipant
@matthijs That is a pretty poor comment by any standards, instantly coming out with that in what is a forum for good debate on F1 things. The original post put forward made a point for discussion. I do not agree with @george1066, but a good point is made.
It is interesting to note that Rosberg did clearly have enough pace to race Hamilton, but was he physically able to get close enough without the aerodynamics becoming a problem?12th June 2015, 7:34 at 7:34 am #299953PorscheF1Participant
How harsh it can be the team did nothing wrong. Even when it would have said in Monaco ‘we’re going to let Hamilton win it and say Rosberg must come second’ that would still be within the rules. Team orders are allowed. Though I don’t think they effected the result in Canada. Hamilton was just matching Rosberg but when he felt it was needed I’m sure he would have been able to pull a proper gap.
One must remember that from a teamview 1-2 or 2-1 does not matter, it’s both 43 points. And outside of F1 they would even like to have the same one finish on top all the time as he will create records in the teams car and colors.12th June 2015, 9:25 at 9:25 am #299955MatthijsParticipant
George1066 starts with “Now here it is again Mercedes ruining F1 by not leting
their drivers race against each other.” I immediately started thinking about Bahrain 2014 where the two Mercedes drivers put up quite a fight. And that’s not the only race they fought hard. Furthermore, even in the Canadian GP Rosbarg was allowed to attack Hamilton. This was broadcasted over the radio: “You’ve done a really good job with brakes, there. We want you to continue like that for the moment, it will give us margin to attack (Hamilton)”. Lap 46, Tony Ross to Nico Rosberg.
So I could have chosen my words differently but I don’t think I say that much wrong. I feel that Georges rant is unjust.12th June 2015, 10:37 at 10:37 am #299847David Not CoulthardParticipant
Seeing @george1066 makes me think that Bernie’s gimmicks are more brilliant than we think and that we sane F1 fanatics are just out of touch from reality, busy with our own bubble in which every F1 fan were smart people who wouldn’t say something like the opening post.12th June 2015, 10:51 at 10:51 am #299971
well nice to see that one can have a comment on this f1 fan site
replies were understandible, lets hope the next race will be better.
.12th June 2015, 11:49 at 11:49 am #299976AtticusParticipant
I kind of agree with you – but it would have taken another driver with Hamilton’s personality in the #6 car for this to happen.
Because I can’t disagree with the team using the data they have available to keep a 1-2 finish as safe as possible (the underlying problem is the massive data stream F1 telemetry technologies provide; that would be among the first things I would clamp down on), and Rosberg is a driver who always respects what the team asks from him – unlike Hamilton. Hamilton is a bit more focused on (obsessed with?) victory and so already repeatedly violated team orders in the past, when instructed not to attack. He just goes for it when he senses an opportunity arises and plans to deal with whatever tyre, fuel, etc. issues are there later.
Such an opportunity was there for Rosberg, when on new tyres, medium fuel load, just after their pit stops, he (finally and for once) had a better pace than Hamilton. He should have pounced – but, again, he’ll never do, if the team asks him not to do so. And the team asks so rightfully – in the current rules framework. If they hadn’t had the data available, they would have no tangible reason to hold Rosberg back and the German would’ve been free to go. That’s how I see it.12th June 2015, 13:38 at 1:38 pm #299978safeeuropeanhomeParticipant
It would be nothing short of lunacy to let them race as you suggest, if to do so would severely compromise the ability of either car to reach the finish. Canada is a tough car on fuel and on brakes, even more so without a safety car. Also they have to consider the penalties for engine changes.
Don’t forget Vettel is actually not that far behind in the driver’s championship. A DNF for either for either or both Merc drivers and things can change very quickly. It is responsible management to let them race up to a point, but not so much that they compromise a 1-2 finish.12th June 2015, 14:05 at 2:05 pm #299980AtticusParticipant
Canada is actually THE toughtest on both fuel and brakes, I believe.12th June 2015, 16:43 at 4:43 pm #299985
Bahrain 2014 was a great fight but who wants to wait another year
before it happens again. F1 is for racing not follow the leader.
I am for a good race and against crashes and drivers being injured
and lets face it the drivers know what they are doing.
If whilst trying to win a race the car may konk out well thats what
its all about…make a better car, and lets go racing.12th June 2015, 18:13 at 6:13 pm #299988safeeuropeanhomeParticipant
But why would you do that when you can conserve the car and still finish 1-2? It would make absolutely no sense. If you’re going to blame anyone I would blame the other teams for doing a worse job than Mercedes, if there were more than one team capable of winning each weekend Mercedes would have to push their package much harder.
Actually F1 is for getting to the finish line in the fastest possible time and always has been, it’s a bonus if there is racing. Drivers used to routinely win by massive margins in the 50s and 60s, and even in the 80s and 90s there was often a car with a massive performance advantage, think the Newey Williams’ or the Mclarens of the 80s. The only difference nowadays is cars are much more reliable so we don’t have the possibility of the fastest car breaking down as much to add a bit of variation.14th June 2015, 0:39 at 12:39 am #300005PoloParticipant
The issue isn’t that Mercedes aren’t letting their drivers race each other. Rosberg’s contract demands that he has equal status to Hamilton, and Toto Wolff has repeatedly reiterated that they are free to race.
The real explanation for why we haven’t seen much racing between the Mercedes teammates this year is because the new nose regulations have made it considerably more difficult to follow closely behind the car ahead (within 1 or 2 seconds, depending on how aerodynamically-dependant the circuit is).
There is another difference to last year. In 2014, Hamilton tended to make mistakes or have issues in qualifying, and so he often started behind Rosberg. Combined with the fact that the cars were pretty decent at following each other last year, this meant that we often saw the Mercedes fighting for position as Hamilton tried to fight back in the race.
This year, Hamilton has upped his game in qualifying and has out-qualified Rosberg 6-1 so far this season. In 2014, the only time Rosberg overtook Hamilton on track (with a healthy car) was in Bahrain, and he didn’t even make it stick as Hamilton took the position back each time. With cars that are much worse at following each other this year, it will be even more difficult for Rosberg to pull off an overtake on Hamilton.
We can also ask if Hamilton would be capable of overtaking Rosberg either – as Hamilton has never been running directly behind Rosberg this year we cannot be sure. But since Hamilton has had issues overtaking Vettel so far this year, I reckon that the lack of racing for the lead is mainly the result of the cars this year being very bad at following each other (this is probably the worst it’s been since the complex aero era prior to the 2009 rule changes).14th June 2015, 11:00 at 11:00 am #299987David Not CoulthardParticipant
To explain my original banter-only comment Mercedes’ task is to get the best result possible – whether it’s entertaining is the FIA’s and FOM’s problem (neither are doing a good job solving it). It’s not team Brackley’s job to make the race entertaining.
I and many more of us who love f1 actually pay good money to watch the races
The money was paid for an F1 race, not for a good race (technically anyway), and again it’s not team Brackley’s problem. It’s FOM’s and FIA’s
other teams trying so hard and then Mercedes doing their little tricks just makes the f1 races more boring than ever.
1. What has the other teams’ attempt to catch up got to do with what you’re accusing team Brackley of?
2.So you think the main reason for team Brackley to do their “little tricks” is to make the races more boring? Seriously? After what happened here last year? Seriously?
3.So you think F1 is, at the moment, more boring than ever? Than EVER? EVER???
At the end of the day F1 is #1 a competition, #2 an entertainment spectacle. If you disagree with my ordering in the previous sentence, than it’ll probably nicely back up my original banter-only comment.14th June 2015, 13:23 at 1:23 pm #300015AnonymousInactive
I’m afraid George’s accusation is complete and utter nonsense. If you want to talk about teams which manipulate their drivers, look no further than those noble people at Ferrari.
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