Three-stop strategy works for Kobayashi, not Button

46 comments on “Three-stop strategy works for Kobayashi, not Button”

1. 

   Icthyes (@icthyes)
   8th May 2011, 21:06

   Kamui Kobayashi: Hard, Soft, Soft, Soft

   I think that’s probably the answer to the difference. I’m amazed Alguersuari was the only other person to try it.

   One of the striking features of the race was the large gap that opened up between the leading trio and the rest.

   It’s amazing. Clear the chart, add in Vettel, Webber and Alonso. Then add in Hamilton. The scale is more than doubled!

   Great work, thanks as always.
   1. 

      NW
      8th May 2011, 22:26

      Its times were not so awfully off, except for the horrible pitstop.
   2. 

      jake
      8th May 2011, 22:36

      i think what doing that actually shows is that if Lewis didn’t fall back at the start, and didn’t have the bad pit stop, he would have been able to compete with the top 3.

      Of course people will say there is no point in ifs, but what it does show is that the Mclaren still has the pace, despite the lack of updates, and that this was just an off weekend
      1. 

         alex
         9th May 2011, 3:44

         “races are races” (fangio)
         :)
      2. 

         bosyber
         9th May 2011, 9:02

         True, but as it is, his first two stints clearly show the tyres were done three laps before the end of the stints – as it is he might have done better to listen to the team and be less agressive there, being slightly slower, but more consitent; as it is, by that bad pitstop, he had already lost about a pitstop worth of time already.
         1. 

            Icthyes (@icthyes)
            9th May 2011, 10:09

            It’s hard to manage your tyres when you’re trying to overtake a slower guy who’s holding you up.
2. 

   s7orm
   8th May 2011, 21:23

   Keith, a question regarding the data – how did you get the tyre compounds used during the stints, since the official f1 timing doesn’t provide the data (I don’t think at least)?
   1. 

      Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
      8th May 2011, 21:29

      It’s published by Pirelli.

      Which is great – Bridgestone didn’t bother to do that, although usually it was pretty straightforward to keep track of who’d used what. Not so easy when there’s over 100 stints in a race though!
      1. 

         BasCB (@bascb)
         9th May 2011, 7:07

         Another plus for Pirelli then! nice job.
      2. 

         sumedh
         9th May 2011, 9:52

         With Bridgestone it was pretty straight forward: Soft, Hard, fullstop!
         1. 

            Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
            9th May 2011, 10:12

            Exactly!
3. 

   RIISE (@riise)
   8th May 2011, 21:28

   Jenson was just too slow on the 2nd stint, he should’ve been about 1 second a lap faster to make it work.
   1. 

      jake
      8th May 2011, 22:38

      am i right in thinking that was the stint he got held up with Massa and Rosberg? I think it was that battle that cost him 4th
   2. 

      wigster (@wigster)
      8th May 2011, 22:43

      On Jensons 3rd stint he was stuck behind Massa and Petrov (who was on hards) for 8 laps and was over a second a lap slower then Hamilton for that part of the race and maybe damaged his tyres or lost his rhythm for the last 5 laps. I think thats what lost him 4th place.
      1. 

         zecks
         8th May 2011, 23:00

         what i don’t understand is why teams persist with using the hards in the final stint, surely it is better to do a longer second stint on the hards and if it doesn’t work out you can still switch onto a 4 stop. the benefit of leaving the softs until last is that at the very least the car will be as fast (if not faster) than everyone else
         1. 

            jake
            8th May 2011, 23:12

            i think the problem is that it will lose you track position and the driver will have to do a lot of overtaking, which, whilst possible, is not ideal
         2. 

            Icthyes (@icthyes)
            8th May 2011, 23:18

            I don’t understand it much either. Starting on the hards pays off as it gives you more time on the softs throughout the race, because you’ll be running three soft stints on lighter fuel and get the slow tyres out of the way.
            1. 

               Icthyes (@icthyes)
               8th May 2011, 23:21

               But as jake says, clean air plays a part in making it work. I think the strategy works best when starting on the hard tyres too.
            2. 

               DVC
               8th May 2011, 23:42

               Starting on hards works for fast drivers out of position. Starting on hards works because the time you would be losing passing the other slower cars around you when on softs, you don’t as you’re now the same pace as them.
            3. 

               Todfod (@todfod)
               9th May 2011, 6:26

               @Ichtyes. If you are staring on hards while most of the others around you are starting on softs, you will be bombarded at the start by drivers trying to overtake you. At the start (first 5 laps or so), the entire field is together. So it is very possible that if you are over a second a lap slower .. you could easily lose 5-6 positions at the start. It will be much harder to make those 5 to 6 positions up in the last stint of the race, as those 5 to 6 cars might have a gap of close to 20 seconds or so between them. So there would be a lot of pressure for you to go more than a second a lap quicker in making up those positions. I guess if the hard tyres lasted significantly longer than the softs than it might be a little different.
            4. 

               Icthyes (@icthyes)
               9th May 2011, 10:13

               @Todfod so what? You’ll be going a second a lap slower than the guys on soft tyres around you, so what does it matter that they pass you at the start? They’d pass you anyway.

               If you can get clean air or not being held up by a slower driver (unlikely now because of the DRS – look at how the drivers who passed Webber in China sprinted away from him), it’s swings and roundabouts, except with a slight advantage.

               If by your last stint you have to pass five cars who are 20 seconds apart from first to last, chances are the front one or two probably would have beat you on race pace anyway.
            5. 

               Mr draw
               9th May 2011, 12:39

               Strategy is the key-issue in F1 nowadays. I expected Massa to start on hard tyres, as it’s impossible to be very fast in the first laps in the midfield. An important advantage is, by delaying the first pitstop, you avoid “traffic”, which otherwise may ruin your valuable laps on fresh tyres. So probably the timing is more important than the number of stops. Besides, what’s the performance-difference between fresh soft and hard tyres? It can’t be that much, I think, as the hard tyres are only slightly more durable.
         3. 

            BasCB (@bascb)
            9th May 2011, 7:09

            This time round a lot of the leading drivers used the hards in the 3rd stint, to have the option of making another stop, but not having to do that.
            1. 

               BBT (@bbt)
               9th May 2011, 8:57

               Starting on hards or a second stint on hards and there is a safety car and you are laughing.
               At the end of the day no one wants to lose track position which is why they go with the softs first.
4. 

   Salty (@salty)
   8th May 2011, 21:34

   Now here’s a funny thing… someone on the LF pointed out Perez’s FLAP about a third in. Showing Perez’s lap over Button and Kobs is rather impressive – this guy had speed, but was he flattering for the team?
5. 

   ledzep4pm (@ledzep4pm)
   8th May 2011, 21:38

   Great work Keith (as usual)
   Hamilton seemed to have lots of degradation on the first to stints (compared to Vettel) but after that he was matching on pace.
   Hopefully when they get the big update at the next race he could really be challenging them.
   1. 

      wigster (@wigster)
      8th May 2011, 22:50

      In the 1st stint Hamiltons high degradation was down to him being right behind and having to pass Button, where as Vettel had a completely empty track in front of him… Lewis himself mentioned that in a post race interview I think.
6. 

   Nin13 (@)
   8th May 2011, 21:56

   If you see Michael Schumacher did actually 3 stopper because his 1st stint was 2 laps only. He is only driver on 4 stopper to use soft for 4 stints and hard for 1 (Others, soft-3 and hard-2)
   So in fact he saved tires better than Rosberg.
   Maybe, just maybe if he can qualify better than he could get podium in Barcelona, because race pace wise they are almost equal and Michael is much better with tyres and brakes management though.
   1. 

      wigster (@wigster)
      8th May 2011, 22:59

      But each car only has 3 sets of softs for qualifying the race.

      Therefore he must have used his first set of softs (that were on when he pitted for his new nose) for another stint later in the race, or he didn’t actually change tyres when he made his first pit stop.
      1. 

         Icthyes (@icthyes)
         8th May 2011, 23:06

         Usually the teams will change tyres as a precaution, in case they have a slow puncture. My guess is they saw they were fine and stuck them back on later.
      2. 

         BasCB (@bascb)
         9th May 2011, 7:12

         He came in for damage repair, not sure maybe front wing, after his clash with Petrov there.
7. 

   Toro Stevo (@toro-stevo)
   8th May 2011, 22:36

   Last 10 laps clearly show that 3 stops wasn’t the way to go for Button, massive loss compared to everyone else. He was losing time even in the middle stints.

   Heidfeld really had a go at him as well, probably the fastest guy on track in those last 5 laps.
8. 

   George (@george)
   8th May 2011, 22:39

   Button’s three-stop strategy may not have served him well, but it might have worked better if he’d stayed out longer in his second and third stints.

   His lap times show his tyres had not started to go off when he came in on those two occasions.

   Ted Kravitz brings this up on his after race pitlane whatsit, apparently Jenson was saving his tyres too much and could have gone faster.
   1. 

      BasCB (@bascb)
      9th May 2011, 7:13

      Yeah, shows Jens could be just a bit more agressive on them.

      I guess the teams and drivers are still learning those tyres.
      1. 

         Mr draw
         9th May 2011, 12:45

         He should be a bit more aggressive on them. ;) It seems his “tyre-saving” driving-style is only a pitfall for him, not a strength.
9. 

   DVC
   8th May 2011, 23:28

   I don’t understand why Mercedes didn’t put Schumacher onto the Hard tyre when he came in to replace the nose.

   Because of that early stop he was effectively on a 3 stop strategy. He was also out of step with everyone else, meaning it looked (deceptively) like everyone and their dog was able to pass him – when he was on old tyres at the end of his stint they had much newer ones.

   However, if they had gone with a longer initial stint on the Hard tyre his strategy could have worked like Kobayashi’s. As it was, he wasted a soft tyre set in traffic, when he could have been getting the hard set out of the way.
   1. 

      Oliver
      9th May 2011, 0:21

      True, a fresh set of softs is not worth wasting while running in traffic and carrying a heavy fuel load.
   2. 

      Mike
      9th May 2011, 9:50

      I think the fans are starting to pick up how strategies work nowadays…. quicker perhaps than the teams.
10. 

    Oliver
    9th May 2011, 0:29

    Mclaren just messed up Button’s race. With a smaller time penalty for pitting, going for extended runs are not worth it, as the time lost per lap with degrading tyres, ends up being greater than the length of a pit stop.
    The moment Vettel came back just behind Button, after his stop, I just had a feeling Button would have been lucky to finish in 8th position.
11. 

    hoshi
    9th May 2011, 7:32

    i got the pole posn, first, second and fifth right in my predictions..how many points am i looking to get now?

    very good race though..got to watch the bbc coverage instead of the espn coverage here in india.must say its so much better on BBC..
12. 

    AndrewTanner (@andrewtanner)
    9th May 2011, 8:17

    D’Ambrosio did well on the tyres, though you could argue.he didn’t have much to push for.

    Perez had a pretty poor start!
13. 

    sumedh
    9th May 2011, 9:56

    Why did drivers do two stints on the hards? Won’t the idle way be 4 stints on softs and 1 on hards? Or is it that the drivers ran out of softs to use?
    1. 

       Icthyes (@icthyes)
       9th May 2011, 10:15

       They may have been suffering from massive degradation.
       1. 

          VXR
          9th May 2011, 21:04

          Why did drivers do two stints on the hards? Won’t the idle way be 4 stints on softs and 1 on hards? Or is it that the drivers ran out of softs to use?

          They may have been suffering from massive degradation.

          At the beginning of qualifying you have three sets of prime tyres (hard) and three sets of option tyre (soft). You also have to use these tyres for the race. If you start the race on the soft tyre that you qualified on, then that leaves two sets for the race. So that’s the first two pit stops changing to the soft tyre. If you stop two more times, you then have to use the hard tyre for each of those stops. You have then one set of hard tyres left that were not used in the race, but had probably been used in qualifying.
14. 

    Alex
    10th May 2011, 13:28

    Given the dramatic increase in the number of pitstops per race this season compared to last, it would be useful to see some analysis of average (normal i.e. just tyres) pitstop times for each time. Does anyone have this to hand?
15. 

    Anatoly Nechaev
    10th May 2011, 17:06

    I wonder if Renault would have chosen soft tyres for Petrov after 3rd stop, would he be able to maintain position before Rosberg? He lost 4 seconds in two laps.

    Quite strange to see Renault on S-H-H-H-S strategy. No one else have chosen it. Was there any problems in Quali?

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