Vettel fastest as Alonso hits trouble

82 comments on “Vettel fastest as Alonso hits trouble”

1. 

   reddevilandy10
   5th November 2010, 13:39

   Wow…

   When is that rain expected exactly? Practice 2? The rest of the weekend?
   1. 

      Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
      5th November 2010, 13:43

      Friday night into Saturday.
      1. 

         reddevilandy10
         5th November 2010, 13:57

         Thanks Keith.

         This weekend is shaping up nicely.
2. 

   Mach1
   5th November 2010, 13:40

   Maybe all their remaining engines are prone to expiring early. Oh well… one can only hope….preferably one race early. :)
   1. 

      Steve
      5th November 2010, 13:47

      A whole two laps earlier than expected :P
      1. 

         F1iLike
         5th November 2010, 14:08

         10 laps too early did it for Alonso in Korea ;)
      2. 

         Icthyes (@icthyes)
         5th November 2010, 14:15

         Lap 69, then? ;)
   2. 

      Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys)
      5th November 2010, 13:59

      No, expire in the middle of the race, giving him a DNF. And then force him to take a grid penalty in Abu Dhabi. That’s the way it should happen.
      1. 

         Steve
         5th November 2010, 14:07

         No it shouldn’t.
      2. 

         Jelle van der Meer
         5th November 2010, 14:18

         Better to have it happen during qualifying and the new engine blown during the race
3. 

   M Sakr
   5th November 2010, 13:43

   Alonso has no problems. Ferrari was going to change his engine anyways for practice 2. And will change it yet again for quali
   1. 

      Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys)
      5th November 2010, 14:00

      What does that tell you about them when they have to change engines ahead of every session?
      1. 

         Ady
         5th November 2010, 14:23

         If they are this close on engines, they must be pinning everything on wrapping up the championship this weekend.

         Not going to be many engines left for the next race.
         1. 

            JamesR
            5th November 2010, 16:07

            Don’t they have practically new engine1 being held back till Abu Dhabi, that will run the full weekend if necessary.

            This weekend they’re simply optimising engine use, I suspect the team are quite relaxed about any P1/2 failure and confident with their race engine choice. This situation has been managed since the beginning of the season and no surprise to the team or Alonso, Watch P2 to see them bounce back.
      2. 

         dyslexicbunny
         5th November 2010, 14:26

         It tells me they plan on saving his good engine until it’s needed.
      3. 

         M Sakr
         5th November 2010, 15:06

         Either they’re being very, very cautious, OR they have a biiiig engine problem!!
4. 

   BasCB
   5th November 2010, 13:43

   Interesting about Mercedes testing their diffusor ideas for next year. It might help them for next year to have a pretty well developed car to start with.

   During the session I listenedto the 5Live commentary, where Davidson was pretty much speaking up for Vitaly, with the amount of pressure put on him racing in a top team with a world class teammate.
5. 

   sumedh
   5th November 2010, 13:44

   Alonso will not incur a penalty

   Do you mean he will now take a 9th engine and not get a penalty. Or that he won’t get a penalty if he goes back to one of his used engines.
   1. 

      Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
      5th November 2010, 13:46

      If he uses a ninth engine he will regardless of what happens but Ferrari haven’t said he will. They won’t be using a race-mileage engine on Friday, as they admitted.

      These rules are a bit of a headache, though!
   2. 

      DeadManWoking
      5th November 2010, 13:48

      Because the cars are not under parc ferme conditions Alonso will not incur a penalty for the engine change

      That applies to transmissions not engines. Alonso would get a penalty if were to use a 9th engine at any time .
      1. 

         CarsVsChildren
         5th November 2010, 13:52

         Not if he re-uses an old engine.

         The 8 allowed engines can be used at any time throughout the season, with penalties only dished out if they are changed in parc ferme conditions.

         Therefore if they were using a high mileage older engine this morning, they could change to a lower mileage engine any time before qualifying without any problems.
      2. 

         DeadManWoking
         5th November 2010, 13:53

         and if remember correctly the transmission penalty includes Saturday morning practice as well, not just parc ferme.
      3. 

         Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
         5th November 2010, 14:22

         Good point – I’ve scratched the parc ferme bit.
         1. 

            DeadManWoking
            5th November 2010, 14:48

            There is no penalty for changing an engine for a previously used one under parc ferme conditions except that

            Sporting Regs
            28.4 e) If an engine is changed in accordance with Article 34.1 the engine which was replaced may not be
            used during any future qualifying session or race with the exception of the last Event of the Championship.

            34.1…
            Any work not listed above may only be undertaken with the approval of the FIA technical delegate following a written request from the team concerned. It must be clear that any replacement part a team wishes to fit is similar in mass, inertia and function to the original. Any parts removed will be retained by the FIA.
            However, if a team wishes to change a part during the qualifying session and/or on the grid before the start of the race, this may be done without first seeking the permission of the technical delegate, provided it is reasonable for the relevant team to believe permission would be given if there was time to ask and the broken or damaged part remains in full view of the scrutineer assigned to the car at all times.

            Liuzzi at Monza and Kovaleinen at Korea were able to change their engines after Qualifying for previously used ones without penalty. However PDLR at Spa and Massa at Singapore changed theirs after Qualifying and received 10 place grid drops because they both changed to their 9th engines.
            1. 

               DeadManWoking
               5th November 2010, 16:58

               There is no penalty for changing an engine for a previously used one under parc ferme conditions except that

               On reflection I should have said that there is no penalty for changing to any of their allotment of 8 engines even under Parc Ferme. Remember that Ferrari changed both Alonso’s and Massa’s engines for new ones after Qualifying for Bahrain without incurring any grid penalty.
6. 

   Johnny86
   5th November 2010, 13:44

   Yes, thats the best you can hope for, when he is driving so much better than others.
   1. 

      Lluis
      5th November 2010, 13:50

      He deserves some bad luck as the others also.
      1. 

         Steve
         5th November 2010, 14:09

         He has had his fair share of bad luck mate. More than most. Only recently has things been going his way.
         1. 

            djdaveyp
            5th November 2010, 14:44

            Bad luck….Alonso? He is the luckiest barsteward on the grid! He is the most scandalous driver in existance. Even more than Schumacher.
            1. 

               S1d
               5th November 2010, 15:04

               My 2 cents…I think Alonso is in for some bad karma come Sunday and today’s FP1 incident is just the beginning…considering what the team did to Massa in Germany…for Goodness sake a win there would have meant so much to Massa in terms of his confidence…you don’t take that away from someone and expect smooth sailing. I’d love the championship to go down to the wire in Abu Dhabi. Some bad luck for Alonso at Interlagos would equalize everything then its every driver for himself come next weekend.
7. 

   Hitcher
   5th November 2010, 13:46

   The engine that broke was the last engine? And now Alonso can use the leftover engines from the previous races?
   1. 

      Mach1
      5th November 2010, 13:55

      I think they were using one of the older engines from earlier in the season just to test the set-up. It was an engine they were expecting to die quickly and it did, just a bit quicker that they expected.
      1. 

         RobertG
         5th November 2010, 14:53

         Mach1 right. Butr how many of them can still work?
8. 

   Dan Newton
   5th November 2010, 13:47

   If its true that Mercedes were trying out a 2011 style defuser that’s a very clever way round the limited testing/testing ban. Some good thinking there I’d say..
   1. 

      Derek
      5th November 2010, 14:07

      That the Ross Brawn, Michael Schumacher teamwork for you.
   2. 

      Eggry (@eggry)
      5th November 2010, 14:44

      but double deck diffuser will be banned in 2011! if they’re testing ordinary diffuser, it would be great! theoretically it should produce lower down force than double one but if they don’t lose performance much, it means they’re making great car for the next year.
9. 

   Johnny86
   5th November 2010, 13:49

   Yes,this was probably on of the high mileage ones. He’ll be using the monza engine for quali and race.
   1. 

      Derek
      5th November 2010, 14:01

      The Monza engine should be well worn out as it is a high revving circuit….hopefully!
      1. 

         Steve
         5th November 2010, 14:10

         Dont they recondition the engines between races?
         1. 

            DeadManWoking
            5th November 2010, 15:13

            Not Allowed, if they could rebuild them there would be no point to limiting them to only 8 for the season.
      2. 

         Soumya Banerjee
         5th November 2010, 15:02

         Why the word “hopefully”?
      3. 

         M Sakr
         5th November 2010, 15:11

         But still, the engine he used in Monza ran for 300+ km only out of a possible 2000-2400km (average engine life).

         Whether this will be the right choice or not, we’ll have to wait and see!! Others are using the engines used in Monaco and Singapore (Webber among them I think) which are the lowest 2 circuits to use full throttle in.
   2. 

      Steinegal
      5th November 2010, 16:01

      If I understand the rules correctly, they can use any of the previous engines in the FPs, but need to use the current engine in Q and Race except for the last race where they can use any engine.
      1. 

         DeadManWoking
         5th November 2010, 16:20

         They can use any of their allotment of 8 engines without penalty in Qualy and the Race except as I eplain in my reply on the next page:

         https://www.racefans.net/2010/11/05/vettel-fastest-as-alonso-hits-trouble/comment-page-2/#comment-468298
10. 

    CarsVsChildren
    5th November 2010, 13:49

    Surely that is the end of Petrov’s time at Renault…

    Why don’t they ship him off to Air Asia X (formerly known as Lotus) let him get his bearings, while maintaining the Renault link to the Russian market.

    If he does well they could bring him back in time for the Russian GP…
11. 

    Icthyes (@icthyes)
    5th November 2010, 13:55

    Maybe I’m reading this wrong, but I wasn’t impressed at all at the reaction of the Renault mechanics when Petrov went off. It was like “what a stupid plonker” as if he was a figure of fun or a rival driver. I suppose all you can do with Petrov is laugh, though.
    1. 

       BasCB
       5th November 2010, 14:26

       And afterwards Kobayashi did pretty much exactly the same mistake at the same place, showing it is probably more to do with a lack of experience with the corner taking it a bit wrong.
       1. 

          djdaveyp
          5th November 2010, 14:45

          Kobayashi’s tyre blew on turn in. Not his fault.
          1. 

             M Sakr
             5th November 2010, 15:13

             And now they’re saying Petrov’s incident is due to an F-duct failure.
    2. 

       Adam Smith
       5th November 2010, 15:02

       The funny thing about Petrov, is my girlfriend normally sits with me whilst im watching the F1, and whenever she sees a car go off, she asks is it Petrov?! She doesn’t even like F1 but still knows its likely to be him in the gravel!
       1. 

          S1d
          5th November 2010, 15:09

          Funny…when Petrov went off in FP1 I instantly thought of the similarly error prone Nakajima flying into the wall at the same track last year..I think the 2010 season is the last we’ll be seeing of Vitaly…sad especially since I believe he has soo much potential.
          1. 

             M Sakr
             5th November 2010, 15:15

             You know what the problem is?? The more Russian sponsors appear on that Renault, the more accidents we see from Petrov!! :D
       2. 

          Hairpin
          5th November 2010, 19:40

          Sounds like you need a new girlfriend. !!
          1. 

             Aussie Fan
             6th November 2010, 2:10

             Why, the one he has sits & watches F1 with him. That’s a pretty good start right there!
12. 

    Brian T
    5th November 2010, 13:55

    Yes.. Looking forward to the race. Hope Alonso’s engine blows on Lap 1.. Haha. Massa is useless, and so that leaves Webber and Vettel who will take each off at the first corner.

    Viva Lewis!!!
    1. 

       Keamo
       5th November 2010, 14:00

       That’s what i’m hoping for too.

       Go Lewis
13. 

    Derek
    5th November 2010, 13:56

    If Hamilton does not win the Championship I hope Webber does, then he leaves to join Renault & Kubica as WDC. Renault would be happy, afer all he would have won the championship using their engines.
    1. 

       Kirby
       5th November 2010, 14:11

       And if this was to happen who would you want to pair up with Vettel at RBR? Petrov? lol I joke.. I joke..

       But maybe someone like Kimi? despite ruling himself out?
       1. 

          Derek
          5th November 2010, 14:20

          I think Kimi would jump at the chance of a competitive car for his return.
       2. 

          Aussie Fan
          6th November 2010, 2:12

          Schumacher! Ultimate comparision for the boy whom so desperately wants everyone to think of him as the new Wunderkind!
14. 

    Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys)
    5th November 2010, 13:57

    Alonso?

    In trouble?

    Oh, be still my heart!
    1. 

       RobertG
       5th November 2010, 14:52

       it could mean battle for WDC is like 50/50 to Web and Alo now :)
15. 

    roser
    5th November 2010, 14:00

    Ferrari anticipated somehow engine problems. They were using an old engine wich already had high mileage and they were going to replace it in FP2 anyway
    1. 

       M Sakr
       5th November 2010, 15:17

       That’s breaking news!
    2. 

       RobertG
       5th November 2010, 16:05

       thanks. interesting news
16. 

    Rob
    5th November 2010, 14:08

    Ferrari.
    Smoke, Mirrors, Sandbagging.
    Hope not. We need a failure.
17. 

    Derek
    5th November 2010, 14:16

    Hay everyone, I’m looking forward to seeing the F1 qualifying tomorrow on BBC One HD, It will be upscaled to 1080i. Berni is too mean to buy HD Cameras for F1 as it will reduce his profit margin. I read somewhere that he intends to replace one camera per year for HD, as the old ones wear out!
    1. 

       Ady
       5th November 2010, 14:28

       Up-scaling means nothing. It’s just a waste of pixels & bandwidth.

       My TV up-scales an SD signal to my 1080 screen already, absolutely no benefit whatsoever.
18. 

    frank
    5th November 2010, 14:32

    Why did vettel have intermediate on in the end?
    1. 

       Invoke
       5th November 2010, 15:02

       Sometimes the mechanics use wet weather tyres when they do practise pit stops, I think that was the case here.
       1. 

          M Sakr
          5th November 2010, 15:19

          Yea that was the case for every race this year.. Saw Mclarens doing the same too
19. 

    Invoke
    5th November 2010, 15:01

    Does anyone understand the clause in the rules regarding engine usage in the final race of the season? Not sure if I have that correct but I have seen it mentioned before and I have never fully understood what it meant.
    1. 

       DeadManWoking
       5th November 2010, 15:22

       If an engine is changed under parc ferme conditions (after they leave the pits for the 1st time in qualtfying until the start of the race) the one that has been replaced cannot be used again in Qualifying or a Race (it can be used in FP1, FP2 or FP3) until the last Qualy and Race of the year.
       1. 

          Invoke
          5th November 2010, 15:58

          Thanks for that DeadMan. So this would only occur if a team has decided to swap a working engine for another working engine under parc ferme conditions, with the engine they took out frozen from use until the final round.

          Has anyone actually done this, seems like an odd thing to do when you are facing a grid penalty for the swap?
          1. 

             DeadManWoking
             5th November 2010, 16:15

             There is no grid penalty for the swap as long as you stay within your allotment of 8 engines. See my reply on the previous page:

             https://www.racefans.net/2010/11/05/vettel-fastest-as-alonso-hits-trouble/comment-page-1/#comment-468267
20. 

    Oracle
    5th November 2010, 15:09

    All teams use an old engine for FP1 and 2.FP 1 and 2 are not classed as part of the event.
    For FP3 they use the race engine and it is only if they replace that engine with a new one they receive a penalty.
21. 

    samuel
    5th November 2010, 15:44

    can somebody enlighten me a bit on how the FIA polices the engine to see if anybody cheats on it i.e. dis-assemble the engine to change the inside stuffs then re-seal it using the same engine cover? can it be done without being detected?
    1. 

       DeadManWoking
       5th November 2010, 15:56

       http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.nsf/65EE8F15945D0941C12576C7005308AE/$FILE/1-2010%20SPORTING%20REGULATIONS%2023-06-2010.pdf

       FIA Sporting regulations
       28.4 c) After consultation with the relevant engine supplier the FIA will attach seals to each engine prior to it being used for the first time at an Event in order to ensure that no significant moving parts can be rebuilt or replaced.
       Within two hours of the end of the post race parc fermé exhaust blanking plates (with one 10mm diameter inspection hole per cylinder) and further seals will be applied to all used engines in order to ensure that these engines cannot be run between Events. Upon request to the FIA these additional seals will be removed after the start of initial scrutineering at the next Event at which the engines are required. All such engines must remain within the team’s designated garage area when not fitted to a car and may not be started at any time during an Event other than when fitted to a car eligible to participate in the Event.
       d) If any of the FIA seals are damaged or removed from an engine after it has been used for the first time that engine may not be used again unless they were removed under FIA supervision.
       1. 

          samuel
          5th November 2010, 16:23

          this is great…thanks mate
       2. 

          Hairpin
          5th November 2010, 19:59

          I really got to take my hat off to you, keep trying to educate people about the rules, it seems a large majority on here can’t read or understand the regulations, and run off at the mouth at what they think it should be.

          Best of luck with it, I gave up some time ago.
          1. 

             DeadManWoking
             6th November 2010, 0:47

             Wellll, they have more important things on their minds like Vettel’s Finger or Alonso’s Eyebrows. :D
22. 

    itern
    5th November 2010, 15:52

    christein destroyed senna there with less laps

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