Formula 1 is considering the first change to the distribution of points in a grand prix since 2010.
However the adjustment is relatively minor and would leave the value of most finishing positions, including a win, unchanged. So what effect would it have.
The plan is to extend the number of points-paying places from 10 to 12. Those who finish between 13th and 20th places would continue to go unrewarded:
The obvious reason for the change is that so many finishes go unrewarded in F1 today. The reliability of the frozen V6 hybrid turbos can almost be taken for granted, many car parts are required to last for multiple races and they are packed with sensors which allow teams to detect and often manage any emerging problems.
As a result, while only the top 10 finishers score points, at least 14 cars finished every race last year. You have to go back to the 2020 Tuscan Grand Prix crash-fest for the last race with only a dozen finishers. Not since the 2015 Australian Grand Prix has a race had less than that, so there is little chance the new points-scoring places will go unfilled.But for many drivers the effect of the change will be negligible. While F1 points system changes have been measured by how they might have swung the outcomes of earlier championships, this one focuses on midfield positions, so it wouldn’t have changed the destiny of any title fight since wins became worth 25 points in 2010.
That year, Sebastian Vettel beat Fernando Alonso to the title by the narrow margin of four points. Under this scoring system Alonso would have picked up two more points, making his defeat even narrower. It wouldn’t have prevented Alonso losing the 2012 championship to Vettel either (both would have two points more).
So this is unlikely to swing a championship title one way or another. It’s only going to affect the front-runners on those rare days when one suffers a technical problem or damage which leaves them slipping down the running order and wondering whether to park up or not.
This will make the most difference not for the drivers fighting for the top positions but the teams disputing the lower positions – where the differences in prize money matter most. In recent years it would have changed those standings as follows:
| Year | Actual standings | Standings under proposed points |
|---|---|---|
| 2023 | 2. Mercedes 409 3. Ferrari 406 | 2. Ferrari 415 (ahead due to more wins) 3. Mercedes 415 |
| 2023 | 7. Williams 28 8. AlphaTauri 25 | 7. AlphaTauri 53 8. Williams 51 |
| 2022 | 6. Alfa Romeo 55 7. Aston Martin 55 | 6. Aston Martin 97 7. Alfa Romeo 80 |
| 2022 | 8. Haas 37 9. AlphaTauri 35 | 8. AlphaTauri 60 9. Haas 51 |
| 2021 | 8. Williams 23 9. Alfa Romeo 13 | 8. Alfa Romeo 42 9. Williams 36 |
Advert | Become a RaceFans supporter and
Clearly, most of the changes are concentrated in the lower half of the points tables, which is to be expected. Some of these swings are quite pronounced: Aston Martin would not have tied on points with Alfa Romeo in 2022, but beaten them by a healthy 17, as Sebastian Vettel, Lance Stroll and Nico Hulkenberg picked up extra points on 24 occasions combined.
- Nyck de Vries would have scored a point for AlphaTauri, in his first race for the team
- Lando Norris would have achieved his best ever championship finish last year, rising to fifth ahead of Charles Leclerc
- Daniel Ricciardo would fall two places in the 2023 standings, behind Kevin Magnussen and Zhou Guanyu
- Both Haas drivers would have finished two places lower in the 2022 standings
- Nico Hulkenberg would have scored a point for Aston Martin while substituting for Vettel in 2022
- Mick Schumacher would have ended his first F1 season with one point instead of none (Nikita Mazepin still would not have scored)
Advert | Become a RaceFans supporter and
The change will largely act to reduce the effect of a single exceptional result on a team’s performance. It will reward consistent points-scoring more highly. Whether this will have the negative effect of discouraging risk-taking remains to be seen, but F1’s points system is already relatively flat and rewards a conservative, points-collecting approach.
However there will be another knock-on effect of the change which has nothing to do with rewarding the teams’ performance. The FIA will stand to earn more, as both teams’ entry fees and drivers’ superlicence fees are tied to how many points they score.
Next year’s calendar will feature the same 24 rounds as this year. Assuming it also includes six sprint events, this change will increase the number of points awarded in a season from 2,664 to 2,856, a 7.2% increase, making the FIA the real winners from this change.
How the revised points system would change the current standings
Drivers’ championship
| Position | Driver – current points | Current points | Driver – adjusted points | Adjusted points |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | Max Verstappen | 110 | Max Verstappen | 110 |
| 2 | Sergio Perez | 85 | Sergio Perez | 85 |
| 3 | Charles Leclerc | 76 | Charles Leclerc | 76 |
| 4 | Carlos Sainz Jnr | 69 | Carlos Sainz Jnr | 69 |
| 5 | Lando Norris | 58 | Lando Norris | 59 (+1) |
| 6 | Oscar Piastri | 38 | Oscar Piastri | 41 (+3) |
| 7 | George Russell | 33 | Fernando Alonso | 34 (+3) |
| 8 | Fernando Alonso | 31 | George Russell | 33 |
| 9 | Lewis Hamilton | 19 | Lewis Hamilton | 25 (+6) |
| 10 | Lance Stroll | 9 | Lance Stroll | 12 (+3) |
| 11 | Yuki Tsunoda | 7 | Nico Hulkenberg | 12 (+8) |
| 12 | Oliver Bearman | 6 | Yuki Tsunoda | 9 (+2) |
| 13 | Nico Hulkenberg | 4 | Oliver Bearman | 6 |
| 14 | Kevin Magnussen | 1 | Kevin Magnussen | 5 (+4) |
| 15 | Alexander Albon | 0 | Alexander Albon | 5 (+5) |
| 16 | Esteban Ocon | 0 | Esteban Ocon | 2 (+2) |
| 17 | Zhou Guanyu | 0 | Zhou Guanyu | 2 (+2) |
| 18 | Daniel Ricciardo | 0 | Daniel Ricciardo | 1 (+1) |
| 19 | Pierre Gasly | 0 | Pierre Gasly | 0 |
| 20 | Valtteri Bottas | 0 | Valtteri Bottas | 0 |
| 21 | Logan Sargeant | 0 | Logan Sargeant | 0 |
Advert | Become a RaceFans supporter and
Constructors’ championship
| Position | Team – current points | Current points | Team – adjusted points | Adjusted points |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | Red Bull | 195 | Red Bull | 195 |
| 2 | Ferrari | 151 | Ferrari | 151 |
| 3 | McLaren | 96 | McLaren | 100 (+4) |
| 4 | Mercedes | 52 | Mercedes | 58 (+6) |
| 5 | Aston Martin | 40 | Aston Martin | 46 (+6) |
| 6 | RB | 7 | Haas | 17 (+12) |
| 7 | Haas | 5 | RB | 10 (+3) |
| 8 | Williams | 0 | Williams | 5 (+5) |
| 9 | Alpine | 0 | Alpine | 2 (+2) |
| 10 | Sauber | 0 | Sauber | 2 (+2) |
Become a RaceFans Supporter
RaceFans is run thanks in part to the generous support of its readers. By contributing £1 per month or £12 per year (or the same in whichever currency you use) you can help cover the costs of creating, hosting and developing RaceFans today and in the future.
Become a RaceFans Supporter today and browse the site ad-free. Sign up or find out more via the links below:
Formula 1
- “He fully deserves it” – Rivals united in praise for Norris’s breakthrough win
- “Not a good day again” admits Magnussen after penalty for Sargeant collision
- Verstappen surprised by Norris’s “pretty quick” pace in upgraded McLaren
- Vote for your 2024 Miami Grand Prix Driver of the Weekend
- “A lot of people doubted me” says Norris after ending 110-race wait for win
Dex
24th April 2024, 12:28
Drivers and teams would’ve been aware of the different points structure and would’ve acted accordingly and today we’d be seeing different results. Drivers in 12th place would take less risks, wouldn’t be going for desperate strategies etc., and so on and so on. All comparisons are therefore pointless, imho. Everyone would behave differently under different circumstances, and this would indirectly affect even the drivers in higher positions.
In any case, I wish the system would remain the same (I doubt it will). I don’t like rewarding participation and I don’t think we’ll see better fights with this change, but more drivers playing it safe and defensive (because consistently scoring 12th place sounds better than risking it for 11th or 10th, in the backmarker land where each point matters).
Btw why is this article disappearing and coming back?
Tristan
24th April 2024, 13:08
I don’t think it’s pointless to compare, it shows that the drivers most affected by the change is the midfield.
I disagree it would make racing worse or any different at all really. Every driver is pushing for their best result every race, I don’t really follow the logic that drivers will take less chances because they’ve secured a points position. They’ll still be looking to gain positions and have to defend against those who want theirs.
stefano (@alfa145)
24th April 2024, 18:26
you can reach the same conclusion simply by looking at the points structure and seeing that it starts changing only from 8th place downwards, hence only the midfield is affected by definition
Tristan
24th April 2024, 18:41
You’d think so, 8-12th you’d think would only affect the midfield as you say by definition. Yet Alpine and Sauber would have both scored at least some points and added to the competition. Despite only 2 additional point scoring places.
I thought it was worthwhile anyway.
JackL
24th April 2024, 21:38
I disagree, it would definitely help drivers in the midfield. Its a bit sad to see teams at the bottom of the standings every year with 0 points. To spend $140m and come away with nothing is not a good look. At least this way, they have something.
I think they should close the points gap between P1 and P2 to 3 or 4 points. Itll keep it closer at the front, and can increase points for the midfield, closing the whole pack up.
Bullfrog (@bullfrog)
24th April 2024, 12:42
The paragraph beginning “however” should probably be bold…
Agree with Dex, everybody around 10th to 13th would have driven differently. Except Mazepin…
It might bring the return of wrecks and late retirements being awarded points…when was the last time fewer than 12 cars crossed the finish line?
I’ve always struggled to get excited about somebody coming 10th, never mind even further back. It was nice for Tsunoda and his crew to celebrate at Suzuka after their good work in the pits, but it still looks daft with a P10 board!
Tommy Scragend
24th April 2024, 15:07
It’s literally in the article:
“You have to go back to the 2020 Tuscan Grand Prix crash-fest for the last race with only a dozen finishers. Not since the 2015 Australian Grand Prix has a race had less than that“
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
24th April 2024, 19:53
Bring back the old days, monaco 1996 had something like 4 who finished the race!
SteveP
24th April 2024, 20:41
Wasn’t that actually 3 that crossed the finish line but more classified for the points?
Dig in the F1 site stats….
https://www.formula1.com/en/results.html/1996/races/643/monaco/race-result.html
Tristan
24th April 2024, 12:54
Wow, that would put Haas above the Visa abomination.
Who would have picked Haas as the best of the bottom half of the field? I know it’s early in the season but people were bashing their modest goal of 8th pre-season. Good for them.
I’m all for this, if not more despite the purists grumblings, the bottom half of the championships are focused too much luck and not enough consistency for my tastes.
MurasamaRA300 (@murasamara300)
24th April 2024, 13:11
Just dish out points down to 20th place and be done with it.
Mark (@blueruck)
24th April 2024, 13:51
I was under the impression, the 2030 Proposed Changes by the FIA were still under lock & key.
An Sionnach
24th April 2024, 17:49
Reverse grids… and points. 10,000 for last place and decreasing up to first, with a special zero points for anyone called Max Verstappen!
notagrumpyfan
25th April 2024, 9:30
Where does the zero go, before or after the original points value?
‘After’ would’ve finished this season in Japan :P
S
24th April 2024, 13:42
I can’t understand why anybody wouldn’t want the championship points table to accurately reflect actual racing results. All finishers should be getting points at every event, with zero only for failing to be classified.
It makes absolutely no difference what the number of points for positions are, the only thing that matters is how many each competitor has relative to the others.
If having a points system reflect actual results sounds like handing out participation awards to anyone, then F1 might as well only award trophies and no points at all.
I can’t see that providing any further motivation for competitors to do better, if that’s the thinking behind keeping points exclusive. I expect the opposite would be true, actually, and there would simply be more teams approaching F1 the way Haas does. They enter F1 for money, not for trophies.
Red Andy (@red-andy)
24th April 2024, 14:54
Points are already too easy to come by, handing out points to half the field is ridiculous for the supposed pinnacle of motorsport. Participation trophies are for children, not professional sports. For midfield and backmarker teams, points should be a challenge to score and something to celebrate.
It is worth remembering that the present points system was introduced for the 2010 season when it was expected that we would have a field of 26 cars. With the reduction to 20 (and no prospect of expansion any time soon) the points should have been reduced years ago. The top eight feels about right to me, taking into account improved reliability.
Tristan
24th April 2024, 17:37
It’s not about rewarding participation… It’s about rewarding performance. Why should “points” be something to celebrate?
Maybe it worked when there was qualification back in the day and there was punishment beyond finishing last, but for the last 3 teams, you might as well go to the casino and play roulette to determine their order.
Alianora La Canta (@alianora-la-canta)
24th April 2024, 18:32
Points were something to celebrate back in the days when there were some teams much bigger than others.
Aucra (@craigs)
24th April 2024, 23:40
I agree with you, but I’d like to modify what you said: It’s not about rewarding participation, it’s about ranking performance.
I intensely dislike the stats that occasionally get vomited up about number of points in career etc, because they are meaningless. Points relate only to the season they were achieved in and the context of that.
By having the ranking go down further, we are better able to see consistent good performance translate to monetary reward at the end of the season rather than that reward being due to a fluke, as others have noted.
If anything it might make the fighting in the midfield more intense as those places have more meaning, rather than hoping for the scraps of the top 10 and depending on a crash or retirement at the front of the field.
Whilst I don’t think scoring down to 20th is a good idea, I would be happy scoring down to 15th, for classified finishers.
GongTong (@gongtong)
24th April 2024, 18:40
@red-andy I’ve always hated the “participation trophies” complaint. Also @alianora-la-canta’s “Points were something to celebrate” argument. Which is the other that always springs up.
Trophies aren’t handed out for participating, they’re handed out for podiums. Podiums should be, and are, something to celebrate. Points shouldn’t be. Points are a metric for calculating who has performed best across an entire season of racing, and when you don’t give them out to the entire field (My argument has always been to pay them down to the theoretical last place of a full grid) they do this less effectively. As the article touches on.
Lets say we have a terrible team, who’ve made a dog of a car that’s 1s/lap off the next place.
Driver A finishes every single race 11th by wrestling impossible performances out of it. For 0 points.
Driver B finishes last in every round. Except Monaco where everyone is in a huge pile up and he lucks into 10th. 1 point.
Clearly the points don’t paint an accurate picture of which driver performed best. And that is ALL they exist for. They shouldn’t be special. Having more than everyone else at the end of the season should be.
David
24th April 2024, 20:02
@gonggong, I second that, and there’s also a recent example where it happened more or less in reality: Kubica (all due respect to him ofc, just reality of his form after his accident) outscored Russel in their season together at Williams
Sham (@sham)
24th April 2024, 15:28
They just can’t stop messing with things that aren’t broken, can they?
Asd
24th April 2024, 17:17
The points system IS broken. It’s terrible, awful, downright unacceptable.
You better start thinking more.
Alianora La Canta (@alianora-la-canta)
24th April 2024, 18:30
@sham The income stream for the FIA is broken, in the FIA’s opinion. That’s what’s being fixed here.
S
25th April 2024, 3:00
The change in payment is negligible, on F1’s scale.
If the FIA only wanted more money, they’d change the regs and raise all fees. And do as I said in my other post – award points to all finishers.
GT Racer (@gt-racer)
24th April 2024, 15:39
I’m not a fan of extending them further as i’m of the view that points should be earned and not just handed out to more than half the field.
Expanding points down to 10th already made the achievement of scoring feel like that bit less of an achievement and extending them to further positions will just make it feel even less of an achievement.
You already sort of see today that a driver scoring points on debut just isn’t celebrated as much as it was in the past because scoring has become far easier and so feels a lot less of a big deal. Like would Mark Webber scoring 2 points for finishing 11th be remembered as fondly as it is when he scored 2 points on debut for finishing 5th?
It just sort of feels like a further dumbing down of the sport.
Mark Zastrow (@markzastrow)
24th April 2024, 18:49
I’m somewhat sympathetic to this view in that the change, by definition, dilutes the value of points, and makes points less useful as a proxy for a staggeringly memorable result.
But I’m less certain that it will make said results less memorable. I think Webber’s debut P5 at his home race would be memorable simply for being a top-5 finish and his late-race duel with Mika Salo, even if he scored no points.
And I don’t see it as dumbing down the sport — given the way it has evolved, a P12 finish today could often be a greater accomplishment than a P6 in the past. Webber’s P5, as memorable as it was, was more a reflection of the rarity of the circumstances rather than performance. That was a race with 8 finishers, where Webber finished 2 laps down, ahead of 3 cars, one of which was Pedro de la Rosa’s Jaguar 5 laps down with engine problems and another of which was Alex Yoong. To put the worst car on the grid in P11 on debut today would arguably be a greater achievement for a driver than Webber’s P5. As exciting or as rare? Surely not, but that is more a reflection of the sport rather than the points system.
John Beak (@johnbeak)
24th April 2024, 16:13
Does Esteban Gutiérrez still have a superlicense?
Alianora La Canta (@alianora-la-canta)
24th April 2024, 18:31
No
Osnola
24th April 2024, 16:52
Nice plan. A option to level the field by extending the paiment/point ratio. So even the lesser teams receive points, and thus money to build the team.
For the toppers nothing really changes. They will receive a lesser sum for the same amount of points.
Bullfrog (@bullfrog)
24th April 2024, 17:35
Will this mean a load of other series will change their points again, or be expected to change? F2, WEC, rallies etc
Nulla Pax (@nullapax)
24th April 2024, 18:11
At the end of a race you get 1 point more than the guy behind you.
It’s that easy.
Nulla Pax (@nullapax)
24th April 2024, 18:13
Whoops – should have pointed out that the person who comes last gets 1 point ;)
GongTong (@gongtong)
24th April 2024, 18:45
I don’t hate this idea.
The thing I hate the most is how they are STILL fiddling with this, over and over again. So we continually have to refer back to all the different systems.
Every time I make a moaning post like this saying how, if we must change it, change it one last time by awarding all the way to last place.
Anticipate a theoretical maximum grid of 40 cars (safely never going to happen). Start at 50 points for first and have some gaps in the top 3 or 5. Then 1 point less each place. AND NEVER TOUCH IT AGAIN!
Imre (@f1mre)
24th April 2024, 19:17
In your points system, two 11th places is worth as much as a win and a DNF.
Nulla Pax (@nullapax)
24th April 2024, 19:32
That’s fine with me – though I can imagine there might be physical violence if an inept driver takes out another driver by not paying attention or something.
That would be for the stewards to rule on.
Nulla Pax (@nullapax)
24th April 2024, 19:27
I have spent the last hour or so working on this as I am a bit bored …. I am between games.
Using my system the standings would look like this (I think … I’m a bit drunk as well)
Perez = 79 points
Verstappen = 72
Norris = 69
Sainz = 62
Alonso = 58
Leclerc = 56
Russell = 52
Piastri = 51
Hamilton = 42
Hulkenberg = 37
Stroll = 31
Magnussen = 30
Tsunoda = 29
Albon = 26
Ocon = 21
Zhou = 17
Ricciardo = 16
Gasly = 14
Bearman = 12
Bottas = 11
Sargeant = 8
My system creates more interest in the lead for WDC – even though we all know Max will get it again.
It also stops one hit wonders like Bearman (don’t get me wrong – I loved his performance) from stealing glory from the workers by driving a top car for one race.
Keith Campbell (@keithedin)
24th April 2024, 21:18
@nullapax It also means that if one team dominates a championship, and even in some circumstances where it isn’t one team, reliability will be a far more important factor than outright performance. So, it would take Max 20 dominant wins over Checo in second to make up for his one DNF. I would find that ridiculous.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
25th April 2024, 0:09
Yes, agree, reliability is too much of a factor with such a points system, and that’s also the reason why the 10-8-6, system was scrapped, nowadays a win has a bit more margin over a 2nd place but not as much as the 10-6-4 system 22+ years ago.
Nerrticus (@nerrticus)
24th April 2024, 18:58
It should get extended to 15 places while closing the gap between 1st to 2nd (extending the title chase), but 12 places is a good start.
It’s going to bring more consequential action to the racetrack while bringing more fairness to the constructors battle from P6-P10. At the same time (for the ‘participation trophy’ complainers) there’s still plenty of room to penalize a poor performance or strategy with 8 non-scoring places.
It a win-win all around. Do it.
Lewisham Milton
24th April 2024, 19:49
I would give out points from 2nd to 11th so Max doesn’t get any.
MichaelN
24th April 2024, 20:16
Seems like an odd move after announcing that new entries need to be competitive for podiums to be allowed in.
A better approach would be to stop giving points from 4th on down. Those teams don’t belong in F1, according to the FOM standards.
Crawliin-from-the-wreckage (@davedai)
25th April 2024, 2:41
It’s a YES from me.
7-3-1 and that’s it.
There’s a reason why driver’s are in lower ranked cars/teams, and why some teams are lower ranked.
If fans want to acknowledge the others, a polite round of applause or each could have a “subscribe” and “buy me a coffee” button.
Jon
24th April 2024, 21:02
I grew with points to 6th place and i would watch all cars finish. One year lotus gor 5th and 6th at imola it was like they had won. They changed to current system and it opposite effect for me. I watch top 3 finish and rest i don’t car about now. Fia changed it from points being high value to low value. Way to go
Keith Campbell (@keithedin)
24th April 2024, 21:13
Strongly in favour of this change given how F1 has evolved over the years and how it has become increasingly difficult to score even a single point. This should lead to fiercer and fairer competition in the already tightly packed midfield, which currently is too heavily weighted in favour of the one-off strong result, where putting in consistent performances can often reward nothing. You just need to look at the points swings from the examples in the articles to see this. You can hardly brand this a ‘participation trophy’ as some are calling it, when the stats show that drivers will almost always have to beat at least 5 other rivals to score any points even under the revised system.
Neil (@neilosjames)
24th April 2024, 22:26
Half the field scoring points seems about right, or perhaps half or less. But I’m in agreement with those above who’ve said more than half is a bit too far.
So partly because I dislike odd numbers and the idea of a ‘Top 11 finish’ being special fills me with dread, I’d only extend to Top 12 if we have 24 cars on the grid at some point in the future. If there are 10 or 11 teams, keep it as Top 10.
(I wouldn’t care if it flipped and flopped season-by-season as/when new entrants appeared or vanished either, as comparing points now/past is already… pointless).
Frame
25th April 2024, 4:38
It will be good if they extend till 15th plc. Otherwise there’s no motivation for those behind to race among their own “tier”.
Apexor
25th April 2024, 5:11
How about rewarding everybody points except when the drivers get dnf or get dq will get no points.
mark toghill (@mt2201)
25th April 2024, 11:44
i think giving points to lower places is a good idea do people forget these are race car drivers, who try their hardest to get the best result, giving them points gives them value and hope,
also giving points for all apart form dnf’s is the best way , as then everybody gets value for trying their hardest
Points are not like they used to be or valued like they used to be so let just get over that and progress
Euro Brun (@eurobrun)
25th April 2024, 22:13
If they extend points by 2 places, they should get another team, to increase the field by 2 places to balance this out.