By winning the Brazilian Grand Prix Red Bull matched Mercedes’ all-time record of scoring 19 grand prix victories in a single season.
With two rounds left this year, Red Bull will be hot favourites to extend that record even further. But there is a striking difference between how the two teams tallied those 19 wins.Back in 2016, Mercedes’ two drivers took the fight for the championship down to the final race. Nico Rosberg won nine rounds and claimed the crown, while Lewis Hamilton won 10 races but was pipped to the title by five points.
Max Verstappen’s victory on Sunday was his record 17th of the campaign, while team mate Sergio Perez has contributed two wins to Red Bull’s 2023 tally.
It took until round 20, which featured the last of the season’s sprint races, for Red Bull to surpass Mercedes’ record of 765 points. They are now on 782 points with two rounds to go. Rosberg scored 50.3% of Mercedes’ points in 2016, while Verstappen is responsible for 67% of Red Bull’s haul so far this year.
For comparison, if you take away the bonus points earned through sprint races and fastest laps, Red Bull would be on 702 points, which is 20 less than Mercedes had after 20 rounds of 2016.
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Verstappen scored his 52nd grand prix win in F1, meaning he now has one more than Alain Prost and is one away from another four-times champion, Sebastian Vettel. It also earned Verstappen a new record of winning the highest percentage of rounds in a season. He can lose the next two grands prix and will still exceed Alberto Ascari’s win-rate of 75% from 1952.
Verstappen has now led 75 grands prix in his F1 career and currently has double the points of second place in the 2023 standings. No driver to date has ever won the title with twice the points tally of their closest rival.
Lando Norris finished second behind Verstappen and his impressive run of five podiums in the last six grands prix has put him in contention to finish third in the world championship, but he has now gone 102 starts without a win.
The significance of that is the McLaren driver has matched Nick Heidfeld’s record of 13 F1 podiums without winning a grand prix. Only five drivers have ever had a podium count in double figures that has not included a race win, and Norris had 13 podiums to his name just four race weekends after he reached 10.
Heidfeld meanwhile had a wait of 33 races and 1,009 days to add his final three podiums to his CV, and spent over two years sharing the unwanted record with Stefan Johansson before his 13th podium appearance.
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This was the seventh time Norris has finished second, which puts him one away from Heidfeld’s other record of eight runner-up finishes without a win. The last time a McLaren driver went on a podium run like Norris’s that didn’t feature a victory was Denny Hulme across the 1972 and 1973 seasons.
Aston Martin’s Fernando Alonso finished the Brazilian Grand Prix in third to take his 106th podium and to match Prost in fourth place in the all-time list. His team mate Lance Stroll qualified third which was his best starting position for a grand prix since he took pole position for the 2020 Turkish Grand Prix.
All of the sprint action at Interlagos was contained in Saturday, and Norris became the seventh driver to take pole for a F1 sprint race. But Verstappen beat him away from the line for his seventh sprint race win out of a possible 12 since they were introduced in 2021. Mercedes’ Russell took his second sprint race fastest lap.
Several other F1 teams in addition to Red Bull reached statistical landmarks in Brazil. It was Williams’ 800th grand prix start as a constructor (the team having competed part-time in 1977 with a customer March chassis before designing and building their own cars).
Alonso’s result put Aston Martin third outright in F1’s all-time table for most podiums without a win. The brand now have nine trophies but have never got one of their drivers onto the podium’s top step. They could match Toyota’s tally of 13 trophies this season, while BAR hold the record of 15 podiums without a win.
Have you spotted any other interesting stats and facts from the Brazilian Grand Prix? Share them in the comments.
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2023 Brazilian Grand Prix
- Perez’s missed “open goal” in Miami was turning point in title fight – Horner
- F1 drivers insist new rules to prevent impeding in qualifying don’t work
- McLaren surprised by margin over rivals at track Norris thought would be “tough”
- “Follow Fernando’s line” – How Red Bull tried everything to get Perez past Alonso
- Mercedes’ Brazilian GP set-up was “conservative” after US GP disqualification
falken (@falken)
8th November 2023, 8:10
Yeah, the striking difference is that Red Bull’s car is a tainted fruit, designed with money they shouldn’t have spent.
whatadummy
8th November 2023, 11:08
The overspend was for 2021 only, no overspend for 2022.
w0o0dy (@w0o0dy)
8th November 2023, 11:16
Not really a quality comment this.
If Mercedes had overspent they would have developed an even worse car as they clearly went with a concept that was flawed…. So no, overspending is definitely NOT what caused this. Talent is what caused this. And the competition made errors. Look at McLaren. About a second gain in one year through solid and correct development and Mercedes? They are actually slower than last year on some tracks!!!
slowmo (@slowmo)
8th November 2023, 12:10
But he’s not wrong that it’s fruit of the poisonous tree. All knowledge and experience gained when they originally overspent has been taken forward and they can’t unlearn the advantages they took from that overspend. Therefor all future development and success is tainted by that original breach of the rules.
It’s clear that a couple of million overspend didn’t create a 1 second per lap advantage that they’ve had in many races this year so sure it isn’t the root cause. Unfortunately though by cheating, Red Bull have tainted their success all on their own. If you don’t want to damage your brand then don’t cheat.
Billy Rae Flop
8th November 2023, 12:28
They also didn’t go over by the amount over the cost cap. No team plans to spend to within a dollar of the cost cap.
AlanD
8th November 2023, 17:04
Slowmo “If you don’t want to damage your brand then don’t cheat”
I wish people wouldn’t throw around words like “cheat” so easily, whether it is talking about Red Bull and the budget overspend or Mercedes and plank wear. if Red Bull had deliberately and knowingly spent more than was allowed, and falsified the figures to hide it, that would have been cheating. But they didn’t do that did they? They spent money which they thought they were allowed to spend and were quite open about spending it. They might have been foolish in making an assumption, maybe they should have employed a better accountant, but that isn’t the same as cheating.
SteveP
8th November 2023, 21:27
Does pretending the overspend was actually the catering budget count as trying to hide it?
slowmo (@slowmo)
9th November 2023, 11:07
Some people might want to rewrite history but I’m not happy to see that done. Red Bull did cheat, they were punished for cheating.
cheating
act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage.
Whether they were being dishonest is open to interpretation but it certainly wasn’t acting fairly to spend more than the agreed budget which might I remind you every other team managed to spend below. So yes they cheated. Your interpretation doesn’t change the facts of the matter.
Billy Rae Flop
8th November 2023, 12:29
It doesn’t change the fact that there was an overspend which had it’s benefits. On going through these regs.
w0o0dy (@w0o0dy)
8th November 2023, 13:33
No you just don’t understand. Money doesn’t make the car faster. Building and testing components could… But that was not where the overspend came from. And without the right Ideas, concepts, reasoning and integration extra money brings nothing. So it’s irrelevant.
RedBull prove that by still having the fastest car despite the least amount of windtunnel and cfd hours.. the money is irrelevant and they have punishment. Just didn’t stop them from executing the rules better than all others. That’s just brighter minds, not bigger bucks at work.
AlanD
8th November 2023, 17:18
Woody “But that was not where the overspend came from.”
You cannot argue that the overspend was only on catering and didn’t affect the performance of the car. If that money had been correctly accounted for, as other teams did, then there would have been that much less spent on development of the car. If they had instead decided not to spend the money on catering then that might have affected team morale which would be reflected in willingness to go the extra mile, staff retention, etc, so the argument that it didn’t affect the car pace doesn’t wash. It has been argued that it was only a small insignificant percentage, but the difference in lap time between a Red Bull and a Mercedes was an even smaller percentage. How much of a difference the overspend actuallly made is open to debate, but to dismiss it as an insignificant amount that wasn’t spent on development is incorrect.
w0o0dy (@w0o0dy)
8th November 2023, 18:21
@AlanD: the amounts spent on development are categorised so we DO actually know it wasn’t spent on development. Mercedes spends more money than any team on development OUTSIDE the budget cap… By your reasoning they would be cheats too.
G
8th November 2023, 23:34
RBR went over budget in ’21 but did they actually gain an advantage with overspending? I remember the cost of the Silverstone shunt caused by their direct rival that year pretty much negated the overspend. Not excusing the overspend btw, just pointing out that there might not have been an actual advantage gained, they just weren’t put in as much of a disadvantage by absorbing that shunt and staying within budget.
Spetz
8th November 2023, 15:13
Agreed. Glad to see someone else understands the situation and tells it like it is.
Ludewig
8th November 2023, 21:53
I guess that every season that RB wins from now on, the sore losers will keep bringing this up. Sad.
Nick T.
9th November 2023, 0:10
I am not a fan of Max and RBR, but this is just a classic sour grapes comment. Anyone who is both objective and paid attention to the details over the overspend knows it was a catering rules violation and amounted to just a few hundred thousand. I am sorry, but that amount of money is never going to be the key to success or greatness.
Nick T.
9th November 2023, 0:15
Furthermore, even if we (rightly) say it doesn’t matter that it was catering because it went into performance, once again the amount is so small that it equates to having a wing and sidepod damaged during the season. If you honestly think .05% “extra” budget made any meaningful difference you’re being disingenuous. Yes, you can make the “overspending is overspending” argument, but that’s only a polemical victory.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
9th November 2023, 7:57
Indeed, it’s way too little, and before the budget cap I think ferrari was coming out with 50 extra millions compared to the most direct opponents, yet that didn’t make them win any championship against red bull and merc.
Nick T.
9th November 2023, 12:43
And, if we wanted to be petty and play what about’ism, we could point to Mercedes’ famous illegal (or at least clearly unfair at best) tire test.
MCG (@malrg)
10th November 2023, 3:46
Let’s pause on this for moment “Mercedes and plank wear” or is everyone 100% sure that was not cheating because it’s Mercedes?
I think it was cheating, they were getting progressively faster till they got caught, next race…Rubbish again.
Jere (@jerejj)
8th November 2023, 8:14
For the first time since the 2018 Abu Dhabi GP, BOT attended a race weekend without facial hair, albeit he still had the mullet.
The second consecutive Sao Paulo GP with pole position celebrated in the garage rather than on track.
The first sprint shootout qualifying with both Williams drivers eliminated in Q1.
The first Brazil race since 2014, with both McLarens starting in the top ten & the second consecutive Brazil race with at least one driver not getting to rejoin the lead lap.
Charles Leclerc’s second DNS in F1.
Jere (@jerejj)
8th November 2023, 8:16
Regarding the first note, I forgot to alter BOT to Valtteri Bottas, but oh well, a funny stat anyway.
Ruben
8th November 2023, 13:21
In the light of the given stat it seems justified that you trimmed down Valtteri’s name too ;)
notagrumpyfan
8th November 2023, 13:53
Without the mullet it would be back to VB.
sam
8th November 2023, 17:24
I don’t think the lack of facial hair gave him an advantage.
melanos
8th November 2023, 17:46
Maybe some particular hairstyle can improve your downforce (it was famously said about Nigel Mansell’s moustache although the evidence was, well, circumstancial). But with the helmet on, this is rather doubtful.
F1Statsfan
8th November 2023, 8:35
Max was the first driver to lead 800 laps in a season, he now surpassed 900 laps within 1 season, currently 922 laps of 1,217 = 75.76% which is beating Jim Clark’s record of 71.47% of laps in 1963 (506 / 708).
While Max is leading and well clear in most wins in last 20 (17), 30 (25) and 50 (35) races he is exactly tied with Lewis on most podiums in last 20 (19), 30 (27) and 50 (44) races with no chance to improve still this year.
Despite a good 2022 and tying with Mercedes in 2023 for most wins in a season, Red Bull only just tied for 4th place in most wins by a team in last 100 races. In 2014 when Ricciardo scored his 3rd win in Belgium Red Bull had 49 wins only to drop down to low point 11 before it improved again.
1st: Mercedes 75
2nd: Ferrari 63
3rd: Williams 55
4th: Red Bull/McLaren 52
Max needs 2 more points to break record of highest % point scoring of all available points (all races) currently held by Schumacher with 84.71% (144/170). Max currently scored 524 of 568 = 92.25% if all points are counted, excluding Sprint/Flap points Max is at 94.20% (471/500) and will break the record even without any extra points with minimal 85.64% (471/550).
Matti quartararo
9th November 2023, 0:01
At this point it’s that rb19 breaking the records max is just making sure it accelerates and breaks when necessary.
No one has ever had the combination of 1 second a lap faster car with such a below average teammate performance as Perez this year. Not to mention that rb19 broke the 12 consecutive wins record and will probably break the most wins in a season record
XM
9th November 2023, 23:51
Salty
MCG (@malrg)
10th November 2023, 3:52
I think you are wrong, I believe the RB is extremely good, but it is even better in Max’s hands. Peres is proof of that. I don’t believe the car is as far ahead as all the non RB and Max fans would like to believe in defence of their own favourite. It’s your Bromance with other drivers that is causing your bias.
Nick T.
9th November 2023, 0:18
And I am pretty sure Michael had zero DNFs that season.
Jonathan Parkin
8th November 2023, 9:18
Nico Hulkenberg is now eight race starts away from beating Andrea DeCesaris’ record of most starts without a win
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
9th November 2023, 8:34
Plus he takes it to the next level and won’t get a podium either!
GeeMac (@geemac)
8th November 2023, 11:03
That would have been 6 had Martin Brundle not been disqualified from the Detroit GP in 1984.
Nick T.
9th November 2023, 0:25
Brundle is sort of a “what could have been story.” Senna’s fiercest competitor in F3 (if I remember correctly) that were tied on points or something similarly crazy. And then he got bad injuries. It’s funny, because Brundle never “looked” like someone would who be a fast driver. I mean this is the most intangible thing ever, but Max, Fernando, Lewis, Kimi, MSC, Senna, Leclerc all look like guys who would be fast. The Hulk does too for that matter. Stroll, Rubens, doesn’t. Prost and Mansell didn’t, but were (their eyes looked fast though).
frood19 (@frood19)
9th November 2023, 7:16
I reckon a whole bunch of drivers over the years have had the potential of being “fast” or at least more or less as fast as the best. What counts is being able to put it all together for a whole weekend and a whole season at the highest level. There are so many variables other than “being fast”.
Basically, there are no slow F1 drivers. And to suggest Prost didn’t look fast is just weird!
w0o0dy (@w0o0dy)
8th November 2023, 11:08
Specifically for all the people crying about RedBull being more dominant than Mercedes ever was: ”For comparison, if you take away the bonus points earned through sprint races and fastest laps, Red Bull would be on 702 points, which is 20 less than Mercedes had after 20 rounds of 2016.”
This is also excluding the gap Merced had over the years to the competition that was as much as 0,6 s Average over the whole season where RedBull can only put 0,3s between them and the competition (not using Perez for the average, just Max).
So we can put that Myth to bed. Yes Max is dominating like few have ever done, but it’s not just a superior car and easy wins. It’s a superb car, a superb driver and superb Strategy and pitstop-work making this record breaking season for Max possible.
Max just doesn’t seem to have any bad performances all season where Rosberg, Hamilton and Bottas usually had a couple of “off” weekends each year.
slowmo (@slowmo)
8th November 2023, 12:12
Plus Max doesn’t have a teammate that can beat him in that dominating car. So the only driver who would have a chance to win most races other than Max is a teammate who is terrible, hence so many easy wins this year.
5
8th November 2023, 12:23
Well it is mainly down to Perez having awful season. Which actually makes it even more dominant for a driver because it is just Max who cruises around in the front and everyone else fighting for scraps, while in the Merc years the battle went on usually for more than just 4 rounds. The only time comparable is 2020 season but even then Merc managed to fumble 4 wins away.
So yes, the most dominant season for a driver ever.
w0o0dy (@w0o0dy)
8th November 2023, 13:20
For a driver… Yes, but it’s not just a fast car destroying the other teams. The difference between cars is less but Max’s (and the team’s) performance made that happen. Not the ridiculous speed advantage Mercedes had all those years.
Nick T.
9th November 2023, 0:27
Perez has only had terrible seasons. He’s P2 cause the car is more dominant than ever while the competition stagnated, especially early on.
Billy Rae Flop
8th November 2023, 12:33
That’s a pretty fragile fact to base your argument on. Sure redbull have scored 20 Les points buts thats due to Perez’s lack of competitivness. It would be a bunch more points if the two redbull drivers were as competitive as the Mercedes drivers.
w0o0dy (@w0o0dy)
8th November 2023, 13:21
Go ahead and take the bad results for Hamilton and Rosberg or Bottas and compare them to Perez… The difference isn’t a big as you might think.
Edvaldo
8th November 2023, 16:27
Now you’re straight making stuff up.
Mercedes’s drivers worst season from 2014 to 2019 was Bottas in 2018. Not counting 2020 as that one had far fewer races.
In all of those seasons, this was the one Mercedes looked the weakest, as Ferrari was already running illegal engines and was the fastest car for as long as they were.
In 21 races Bottas scored 247 points.
This season with an all conquering car that won all but one race and 20 races in, Perez has 258 points.
So how in the heavens the difference isn’t as big?
Perez might be the worst driver with a top car since Frentzen in 1997. His first season was weak but he gained some points with the team holding Hamilton in Turkey and Abu Dhabi. The 2nd one was better with the win in Monaco but losing the 2nd place to Leclerc felt as a disappointment. And this one is a complete disaster. And half the time it isn’t because he isn’t fast, but because he make rookie mistakes like going too fast on the pit lane and endless track limits violations.
w0o0dy (@w0o0dy)
8th November 2023, 19:00
Look at individual races where Hamilton, Bottas and Rosberg failed to score a good result. The performance of Checo is not hugely worse.
Edvaldo
8th November 2023, 20:02
Individual races don’t make up for an entire season. Perez would not be at risk of losing his seat cuz of a couple of bad races. But he’s been bad in most of them. And this, not Hamilton, nor Rosberg and not even Bottas ever did.
G
8th November 2023, 23:42
It’s Max’ consistency which is enabling him to break so many records.
There may well be other drivers as quick as him for ultimate pace but his consistency seems pretty much unrivalled in my opinion.
Perez is broken, he can’t even count on Max having a bad day to sneak a win.
Matti quartararo
9th November 2023, 0:16
Couldn’t have said it better than that. Perez is below average this season. I like how many people compare him to bottas de spüre the fact that bottas never failed to reach Q3 4 or 5 races in a row. Perez this year is not even confident in the car that in the hands of any decent driver would at least get a podium every race. Bottas got more podiums when Ferrari were fighting Mercedes for the title. Perez can’t even stay more than 50 points ahead of the next best car that is at least a second slower on race pace. I agree Perez is statistically worse but that’s exactly why redbull got him in the first place… To be nothing but verstappen’s obedient wingman they would never admit it but you’ll never see them put a competitive Alonso or Charles in that car
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
9th November 2023, 8:45
Definitely agree, the 2018 season was the most competitive of the mercedes era, with a ferrari that was every bit as good as the merc, generally it’s vettel throwing that title away with his constant spins, so the fact bottas in such a season got more points than perez who now also had access to fastest lap points and sprint points (and 6 sprints is something that never happened before) is embarrassing for perez.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
9th November 2023, 8:46
Well, perez has slightly more points, but same point applies, one was a joint-best car and the other one is massively ahead of the competition.
Robert (@rob8k)
8th November 2023, 14:26
I’m sorry but you can’t ever put this myth to bed. The difference to the two dominating periods is too great. Different cars, different drivers, different tyre compounds, even a different rulebook.
You talk about the average gap to the rest but you don’t know how hard Red Bull are currently pushing, like why would they push flat out when they have the race under control. Mercedes also had “party mode” during there domination that is now outlawed.
Personally I think it’s stupid to try to determine which period of domination is greater. It’s great what Red Bull have achieved this season just as it was great what Mercedes achieved during the turbo hybrid era and Ferriari in 02 and 04, etc etc. People that want to see a close championship though, won’t see it that way.
Michael (@freelittlebirds)
8th November 2023, 16:59
@w0o0dy yeah, but 2016 was a super-season while 2023 was at the bottom of the pack.
Nick T.
9th November 2023, 0:33
There were multiple great seasons during the Mercedes domination period (I.E., lots of great races with drama and wheel-to-wheel battle). A lot of that is down to the fact they were running the narrow chassis rules spec and were much shorter and lighter too. These new cars are so side (and heavy) that two cars now fill up almost as much space side-by-side as three in the previous generation. One of the reasons the racing and the tires seem so utterly pathetic now.
sam
8th November 2023, 17:28
I think we can all agree that supreme reliability and setup should be accounted as well.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
9th November 2023, 8:46
You might want to look more at race pace than quali, there’s absolutely no way the race advantage is 3 tenths!
Facts&Stats
8th November 2023, 11:46
He already has more points by himself than any competing team can achieve this season, with two races to spare.
Also Hamilton, Vettel, Schumacher, and Mansell beat the next best team by themselves before the season was over, but at for them at the penultimate round.
Ascari officially never beat the next best team in the standing; there was no WCC.
But due to the weird points system (4 best results) and teams racing with more than two cars, it was per definition not possible to win with 2 races to spare.
w0o0dy (@w0o0dy)
8th November 2023, 13:27
The years Mercedes ruled the competition was focussed on less teams.. one team challenging for some time but never equal and the 3rd best team was already without hope after a couple of races. This year we have had drivers from 6 teams on the podium.. that’s rare!
melanos
8th November 2023, 17:40
Not exactly true.
In 1952, with 2 races to go, Alberto Ascari had already 4 wins + flap, meaning he could not improve his final score. He might as well have gone fishing but instead he won also the last two and got the flap in both (as the measurements were not very precise back then he shared the last flap with José Froilán González). So in the last 6 races he made 53.5 of 54 possible points (over 99%!!). However, as only the best 4 count his final count was 36 (the absolute maximum) which he already had with two races left.
Meanwhile, with two races to go, Giuseppe Farina had 3 P2 and one P6 and no flaps (only the first five positions counted) so he had only 18 points. Even winning the last two races with flap (unshared), GF would have got a final score of 30. So AA was crowned WDC at the Nürburgring Nordschleife, with 2 races left. In fact GF made another P2 and a P4 (no flaps), with a final score of 24 points.
Generally, if even winning the last two races with flap no one could get ahead of the driver on top, he (sorry but it was always a male), had already won the WDC. There was no WCC back then, so the fact that could be more than 2 drivers in a team is not relevant.
Facts&Stats
8th November 2023, 19:45
I am comparing the points scored by a single driver, with the total points of a competing team.
Ascari was stuck at 36 points (the max).
A team with 3 cars could still score two triple podiums and a FLAP and would be at 37.
Axel
8th November 2023, 13:48
I think it is also interesting to look at the record for most podiums before the first GP win. In case Norris does score his win. At the moment that record is held by 4 drivers; Alesi, Häkkinen, Irvine and Depailler. All with 15 podiums before their first win.
If Norris were to win before scoring another podium he would be in shared 5th place with Button and Ginther on 13 podiums before their first win.
melanos
8th November 2023, 17:42
And with 3 more (winless) podiums and then (or later) a win, Lando will be topping this particular (but not particularly wanted) stat.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
9th November 2023, 8:58
Alesi shouldn’t have won a race in the first place, schumacher was dominating canada 1995 and had a gearbox issue that made him lose 70 sec.
Surprised hakkinen had already got 15 podiums with relatively uncompetitive mclarens before 1997, when he won at jerez, and pretty much it took him a similar amount of time as irvine, while I don’t remember about depailler.
It’s not so surprising with such a strong red bull that one of the best drivers around without a win yet doesn’t manage a breakthrough, so far the only realistic chance was russia 2021, but mclaren’s weather forecast wasn’t up to par, they didn’t expect the rain would intensify that much, if it had stayed intermediate norris seemed to be able to handle, but was basically full wet when he (and others) lost the car on the straight on slicks; mercedes had the right forecast.
SteveR (@stever)
8th November 2023, 15:38
All these statistics make F1 sound like American baseball.
Clay (@clayt)
8th November 2023, 18:18
I was thinking the same thing as I read down through the comments @stever.
And, just like in baseball, comparing stats from different eras is mostly folly.
Nick T.
9th November 2023, 0:40
Couldn’t agree more. They’re most helpful to understand chassis dominance and even then imperfect. For example, Vettel is a guy who produced amazing stats that, IMO, don’t represent his place in the pantheon of drivers.
The most reliable stats are teammate stats and even then they can badly lie, unless you look through exactly what happened in almost every session that led to each result and provide asteriks and explanations right there.
So, yeah, while stats are useful and can be really fun (just like baseball stats), they’re overly obsessed over and not particularly comparative due to way more than just scoring and reliability differences.
Edvaldo
8th November 2023, 16:11
I have 3 seasons that i consider the absolute worst since i begin watching this stuff a long time ago.
2004, 2015 and this one.
Can’t remember most of the races of any of these seasons, even if some were mere months ago, they were so uneventful.
2022 was actually a pretty entertaining year for a season of domination, but this one has been difficult. The other teams are just too bad.
Unicron (@unicron2002)
8th November 2023, 19:10
I concur, you nailed it. I would also add 2002 which was even worse than 2004 in my opinion. 02, 04, 15 and 23 have been the biggest tests for my love of F1.
Dishonourable mentions also to 18, 19 and the last halves of 13 and 22.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
9th November 2023, 9:01
2018 was really competitive, ferrari was every bit a match for the merc, that’s a surprising comment.
Nick T.
9th November 2023, 0:46
Agreed, but I know that I didn’t rate one of the 2014 or 2015 seasons nearly as badly. I can’t remember off hand which of the two it was though. 2002, 2004, probably 2015 and 2023 have all been painful. Worse yet, due to the inherent obesity of these cars, the fact no one is going to catch RBR before the rules change and the timid, over abundance of caution in both rain and in never allowing for a car to be allowed to be recovered under yellow or just left there and stay green when in a safe place, I don’t see it getting hugely better.
The Skeptic
9th November 2023, 5:04
Worst ever seasons? In terms of boredom:
– 1988-9 (Mclaren unchallenged)
– 1996 (Williams unchallenged)
– 2002, 2004 (Ferrari & Schumacher unchallenged)
– 2013 (Vettel unchallenged)
– 2014-16 (Mercedes unchallenged, although Rosberg / Hamilton duel provided theatre)
– 2020 (Hamilton unchallenged)
– 2022-23 (Red Bull & Verstappen unchallenged)
2017-19 were fun. Ferrari really did have a shot at the title, and they…. Ferrari’d it.
The rest of the 1980’s, 90’s and 2005-10 and 2021 were bloody awesome.
Todfod (@todfod)
9th November 2023, 8:19
In 2013, the first half wasn’t that bad, as there we had Ferrari, Lotus and Mercedes putting up a strong fight. It was the 2nd half of the season was a complete washout by Vettel and Red Bull. I would replace 2013 with 2011, that was a whole lot more predictable and boring. Vettel was the title favourite and points leader from the first race up until he wrapped up the title at the Indian GP.
5
9th November 2023, 9:09
from the time i have watched (1995) i’d say the top 3 is 2002, 2004 and 2023
All the other years there have been at least some competition and 2020 was just weird with covid and double races.
I’d actually rate this year as the worst of them cause with Ferrari, Barrichello was at least given pity wins after Schumacher had secured the title. This year Perez is uncapable of this and Verstappen seems to just not care.
MichaelN
8th November 2023, 17:30
While their numerous wins this year are impressive to a degree, we all know how many titles the Red Bull team won when F1 teams were able to develop their engines. You know, since this is supposed to be the pinnacle of motorsport and an open formula and all, and the one where the FIA wants manufacturers to be involved. Engine manufacturers, that is.
Seasons like these can be entertaining (although this one is not), but it’s not in the same category as other seasons where F1 was doing more to live up to its stated purpose.
Nick T.
9th November 2023, 0:48
I’d rather have a chassis dependent than power dependent series any day. I’d be comfortable with a big more wiggle room in the power department though.
SteveP
8th November 2023, 22:03
While mathematically possible, it would require Norris to outscore Hamilton by an average 16 points per race.
So, assuming zero points for LH in both remaining races, LN has to finish 3rd (plus fastest lap) in both races or better.
Note the gap forward from LN to LH is slightly larger than the gap from LH to SP
paulgilb (@paulgilb)
8th November 2023, 22:44
First time Stroll has got past Q1 in Brazil.
0.497s between 1st and 16th in Q1 – smallest since 3-part qualifying was introduced in 2006.
Russell has managed three 4th-places and three 8th-places in this year’s Sprints.
All 10 teams have managed at least 1 point in a Sprint (not necessarily in 2023).
Verstappen is the first driver to manage 19 podiums in one season (although he cannot equal M Schumacher’s 100% rate in 2002).
Alonso’s 9th Interlagos podium without a victory there – a record.
14 classified finishers – fewest since Singapore 2022.
Second consecutive race, and the third this season (after Australia) to have been red-flagged following a crash involving Magnussen. A similar thing happened with Verstappen in 2021 (Azerbaijan, Britain and Hungary, although the latter did not eliminate him from the race).
Both Ferrari drivers have scored points in each of the last 7 F1 weekends, despite having 2 DNSs and a DSQ between them in that time.
Thanks to statsf1 and the official F1 site for some of these.
Vettel4life
9th November 2023, 0:06
The key difference is obvious… Mercedes had 2 competitive drivers. Redbull has 1 competitive driver and 1 obedient below average wingman desperately trying to do anything to keep his seat at redbull. but not everyone likes to say it because it makes max look less heroic and invalidates the whole “mAx uNbeAtAbLe” laughable narrative
Moi
9th November 2023, 17:03
Yeah Valterri ‘it’s James’ Bottas was a real star in that partymode Merc…
michael
9th November 2023, 0:52
Norris matched Alesi’s Bennetton record of most podiums without a win at a constructor of 13. Alesi set his record in 2 seasons.
Norris is 1 2nd place finish away from equalling Bottas’s record of 7 second places in a season without a win from 2018.
If Alonso gets two 2nd or 3rd places in the last two races he would equal the current record of 10 podiums in as season without a win held by Barrichello in 2002 and Button in 2004.
As mentioned by Sky it was his 9th “podium” in Brazil without a win beating Raikkonen’s 8 in Bahrain. No other driver has more than 5 winless podiums at a Grand Prix! Technically this wasn’t the Brazilian grand Prix so it was his first at the Sao Paulo Grand Prix. An argument to keep politics out of sport…
Verstappen has won 15 more races than his teammate in this season. The current record is 13 (Verstappen 15 – Perez 2 in 2022 & Vettel 13 – Webber 0 in 2013). Verstappen is guaranteed to beat or match this record.
Main source was GP Racing Stats
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
9th November 2023, 9:08
And bottas had to give away a win that season, norris didn’t get any win chance this year.
Esploratore (@esploratore1)
9th November 2023, 9:11
Also very curious how the record of demolishing team mates win-wise always belongs to red bull drivers, almost like there’s some truth in them focusing only on 1 driver, more so than other teams would.