1,128 comments on “F1 Fanatic Live: 2017 Italian Grand Prix”
Hello everyone and welcome to F1 Fanatic Live for the Belgian Grand Prix! First practice coming up in just under ten minutes.
Ah, so they are testing the Halo again in FP1 then.
Problems straightaway for Alonso. I’m surprised.
The familiar sound of Alonso complaining about the Honda engine. F1 is back!
The summer break only finish five minutes ago and already Alonso’s car’s broken down…
Massa overdoing it there? Good to see he seems ok, but hi car is not
That just looked like a silly mistake by Massa.
Any close-ups from Massa’s special helmet? What is he celebrating?
Is it just me or are the comments ordered the wrong way around @keithcollantine? – with the oldest comments on top, and the newest down below
nvm its back to normal already
Yeah there was a slight error on the page, once you refresh it, it should look OK again.
I have to admit I’m already growing used to the halo. Pleased to see that you can still distinguish the drivers helmet both close up and at a distance and actually the halo kind of disappears in the long shots.
But i still think it would be great if the Halo’s mirror the driver helmets (colouring) too – although not for Red Bulls all interchangeable helmet designs or the FI all pinks!
Good idea. Unfortunately I think the sponsors will stake their claim as always.
I don’t think that looked like it should have happened. I don’t see how the kerb could make him loose it like that. At leased it is just practice!
It’s curious that so far Massa has only referred to his illness in Hungary as vertigo. This obviously the symptom, but what’s the underlying cause? And is there any chance it could be related to the crash he’s just had on his first push lap after getting back in the cockpit?
Does make you wonder, doesn’t it
I will be surprised if williams retains him for next year.
My guess would be some ear infection that sort of lames the balance organs in one ear?
Top 3 on three different tires. Bodes well for Vettel setting the time on the hardest compound.
Make it top 6.
Now Alonso has a DRS problem too…
Let’S hope he is just gradually ticking off his bucket list of issues during the friday and will than have a solid saturday and we can enjoy a great sunday from him :-)
Well, seems that Alonso might be looking forward to having some fun with the car, good lap from him
RIC sets the fastest lap which is only 10th away from last years Pole Position time set by ROS
1.46.656, last year’s pole position time beaten already, and we are just in practice 1
The King of Spa has turned up. Kimi hundredths away from P1.
looks like Mercedes might be having a bit of a tricky time making their tires last for more than one lap, might make a different strategy from them than the likes of RBR and Ferrari too then.
They also have less of the ultrasofts too, so indeed, probably going a bit differently.
Nearly halfway through first practice and still no radio messages from Grosjean complaining about his brakes. What’s going on? He’s definitely on track, he’s done eight laps.
May be his radio has a problem now :)
That must be it!
Verstappen changed the colouring of his helmet a bit? More coppery instead of the old orange
McLaren having problems with their DRS not closing properly – bit of a worry at a track this quick.
Man, these cars are quick around Spa. Will pole time go below 1:44? Low 1:44’s surely are in the cards.
yeah, unless it does rain, we are probably going to be somewhere around 1:44, either slightly above or a just below IMO
Pretty quiet session so far.
And there’s our first Grosjean complaint!
so they’ve repaired his radio then :-)
Bottas crashes getting out of the way :)
that looked a bit clumsly yeah
So Bottas just beat Lewis’ time using the softs vs SS during Hamilton’s run. It seems Mercs do have quite a bit of pace in hand…
Track improvement. Ocon beat Vettel’s time on softs as well.
oh, and then Lewis shaves another second off… 1:45.555
As mentioned on C4, I’m pro-third car. For the teams that can afford to field an extra car, young drivers could be provided opportunity not presently available to them. McL/Fer/Mer/Ren/Red +1 = 25 cars. Exciting new talent, bolstered grid. Excluded from constructors points, but eligible for drivers championship.
it’s a terribly bad idea. It would enhance the divide between the “bit teams” and the rest even more, hollow out the means of existance for the smaller teams and be an open invite to abuse of drivers to hurt others in races. Please no.
Opinions certainly divided!
just look how third cars brought us 4-6th car “top teams” in the likes of Nascar, Indycar, DTM etc. Are those championships better for it?
Well, I’m open to suggestions to tackle the shrinking field size, manufacturers disappearing to other series, and lack of available seats for young drivers.
I think more collaboration between teams should be allowed. Top teams will always be top teams, but remember when Sauber looked like a last year Ferrari and was actually competitive, allowing the driver talent to shine? I see no harm in customer teams, this also helps with the budgets issue – top team gets some of the development money back, while the client team doesnt have to spend money developing every aspect of the car.
The solution is taking some of the money that now goes to Ferrari, Red Bull and Mercedes just to show up and use it to guarantee a basic budget of about 80-100 million for everyone. That way a smaller team can count on having a budget for engines, chassis and drivers and some development, making it easier to build upon and get partners on board.
I’m not a fan because it will massively increase the huge advantage the wealthy teams already have. I don’t want yet more complicated rules (e.g. defining what a ‘young driver’ is). And it would also allow them to skew the drivers’ championship by bringing in extra cars to hold up their rivals. It would be a step towards mimicking the DTM’s deeply flawed model.
Not necessarily complicated. Designated third car = ineligible for constructors points. I don’t see what’s criminal about that, considering there are far worse candidate regulations deserving of the ‘convoluted’ tag.
What would stop Ferrari putting Vettel, Kimi And Verstappen in? And Mercedes getting Lewis, Bottas and say Alonso as a third. Then Red Bull would have Ricciardo, Sainz and Kvyat? And the first runner up would probably be the only apart from them in the top 10 gaining points for the ‘drivers. Ferrari doesn’t care much about the constructors championship. And a driver is clearly only in it for the drivers’
there are far worse candidate regulations
There certainly are, that’s no justification to create more bad rules though.
Looks very likely that Bottas will be 4th today. On all but 1 occation this year, he’s been 3rd or above. His average qualifying position is actually slightly better than Hamilton due to Hamilton’s slump in Monaco.
His pace just looks a little low at the moment.
Wow, Vandoorne threaded a needle at 190mph between 2 slow cars througth Blanchimont
…and beat Alonso’s time…
Palmer .3s ahead of hulk
Bet Keith is chuffed Ferrari are screwing Kimi over, again
Don’t think you can win a bet against Keith. He own a bet column.
Think Ferrari and Merc will go SS tyres in Q2
looks like they could even use softs and still go through
So that’s why Alonso want to be in Williams. They look like ready to be the backmarker team…
ferrari deciding to save some tyres? memories of past explosions, i guess.
Hello, my fellow hard rockin’ F1 geeks!
Palmer’s broken down again.
Palmers luck is just so bad!
WOW thats impressive
incredible lap
and Vettel, well done when it mattered
Well that was a letdown.
What a time by Ham. I wasn’t expecting the pole time to be in the mid-42s.
Maybe Raikkonen could have nabbed pole if he didn’t screw his lap up.
He didn’t screw his lap.
He did.
got traffic
He did.
How come the renault has gotten so much better then force india? is renault best of the rest by mid season?
I think that since that new floor, they got a lot better. If they don’t break down.
because Renault (instead of team “Lotus/Toleman/whatever” Enstone)?
Palmer’s luck, though. And Kimi’s.
conversely, Seb’s tough.
VET: “Kimi gave me a nice tow to get on to the front row”
Might as well do the intro before Keith comes on xP
Welcome to F1 Fanatic’s (paraphrase my) (not-so) official coverage of the 2017 Belgian Grand Prix, where Vettel wins, Alonso gets plaudits, and Crofty and Brundle make conspiracy theories about Ferrari’s plans to wreck Kimi’s race for Vettel!
Peace lol
LOL.
Good day :)
And I forgot to mention, give their completely unbiased opinion on why Hamilton is the GOAT.
Have to agree with DC on calling it bullocs, Honda not thinking like races on the Alonso’s honda being confused about where he was on track and not giving him the power he needed while in his ultimate quali lap (CH4)
Agreed, I’d expect an engine supplier in F1 to have at least that ounce of sense.
exactly. I still don’t know if Alonso should be a bit reasured about hardware not breaking down, or furious and losing lots of confidence in Honda for being so senseless as to let this happen.
How’s the weather in Spa today?
Looks quite sunny.
So 50% chance of rain then.
LOL
Why can’t they have COTDs from the live updates? Priceless xD
hello from Malaysia
hi :-)
Will both Mclaren’s last the whole race.
Ah, the Dutch…eh Belgian circuit with a majority of Dutchies (80%) in the audience, looking out for MAX.
Hello everyone, it’s almost time for round 12 at Spa – will Mercedes or Ferrari prevail today? Or might Red Bull pull off a shock?
Expect RedBull to use US-SS-US tyres
You think both cars will go with that?
Maybe US-SS-SS for Daniel
It probably is the fastest way to go, so why not.
Hello from India
Don’t count out Bottas yet…biased skysport
Good morning
Mega start by Alonso.
alonso!! woohoo
Nostalgic fight between Ocon, Hulk, Alo.
Those first few laps without DRS were great! Awesome racing.
Hear, hear…
what can you say about Alonso
What can u say other than shame…shame in this honda engine
Woah, that was a big hit Ocon got himself there from Perez, a bit optimistic move, but he somehow squeezed through.
They forgot Baku after summer break. :)
Amazing that the suspension is in one piece
Honda should get out of this embarassement right this minute , someone should call them in japan to tell them to pack their bags right this minute
Cars flying past Honda… They should quit right now
Another failure for Verstappen?
Verstappen :( Who said Palmer was unlucky?
In front of the orange grand stands! This is terrible.
DRS is a joke, Alonso puts his talent up to 7th then DRS blows past his pathetic Honda giving him zero chance to defend
No need of DRS for passing Alonso
what, Verstappen, no! :(
you got to feel sorry for Verstappen
So Alo and Ver might compete for Bottas’s seat at Merc.
For 2019 maybe
I can’t see Bottas leaving Merc anytime soon
He has a 1 year contract
I know but right now I think he has exceeded the expectations
Agree. But still, ALO and VER are major talents.
I kinda see this coming…..feel bad for the Dutch fan
Verstappen 6th dnf…..no comment
Unlucky driver of the day for 6 race now
I apologise to Max Verstappen for including him in my predictions again. Each time I do that with a Red Bull driver this year, they seem to retire by no fault of their own.
Engine builders are in F1 to promote their brand, right? Mercedes OK, Ferrari OK, Renault really?, Honda anit-promotion.
Bottas has earned another year at Mercedes if he wants it, imho.
Unless they can help Verstappen break his contract, and take him, I’d say.
I doubt Mercedes would do that, because that will cause massive stress in the team, ham and ves together? Bottas delivers what they need for the championship and helps ham without saying a word….
redbull should be ashamed by now
What a joke
Well, not sure what it was, but engine not quite Red Bull’s thing?
Really poor from Bottas and Kimi today so far.
That’s what I was thinkinh
Not sure which driver (in front running and middle teams) in recent times has had 6 DNFs even before the European leg was over..
Do Bottas and Kimi have the same parts on their cars as their teammates?
Kimi is probably held up by Bottas at this stage
Kind of wish Ferrari had been a bit more aggressive here, pitted Vettel early to put his new ultra-softs on, tried a two-stopper. At least put Mercedes under a bit more pressure.
I expected them to pit Kimi first now – but that yellow flag investigation for him isn’t good.
BOT pits
Hamilon way faster on softs
VET pits
That was a nice threading the needle from Perez, but then he got off track and will have to give something back, I’d expect
Great move
Now there’s a gamble from Red Bull!
what are they doing?
ah, saw your tweet of rbr radio now, going to supersofts with Ric, interesting.
Hamilton is clearly flying as he s been. This whole weekend
And Kimi dissapoints again. He cant even be a number 2.
Nothing he could have done there with older tyres and DRS.
Bad strategy right there matr
yep
What strategy, hes one pitstop behind in pace after 15laps and cant even defend for 5sec.
Vettel and Hamilton both are already a pitstop ahead of their teammates! Those two are really something else.
Another podium for Bottas
now That will drop Kimi down then.
VET is 1.2 secs faster than HAM that last lap?
Same penalty as the one for Vettel for what he did at Baku. WOW!
Good point there. Goes to show how horribly insufficient that penalty was.
I would rather think that Kimi has got an extremely hardh penalty. This should have been 5 seconds or 10 seconds added to race time.
Wow Sebs coming
Can hear BBC at the moment and they’ve got Raikkonen’s penalty wrong – it’s not a time penalty it’s a stop-go, he has to come into the pits.
Kimi 10 sec stop and go pen when u need one, he is really in big trouble now
why is VET so close to HAM?
Hahahaha ICEMAN
yeah, he certainly didn’t lift there.
I think full throttle under double yellow should be a stop and go. No doubt
Grosjean is a woman
Is this a compliment or sexism?
A compliment, he’s a good looking chap and sounds like my wife sometimes
Eh, what does his (or her if you want) gender have to do with racing? And telling the pitlane about others going off track is something ALL drivers do all the time, because it gives them a direct advantage on track if the other gets penalised.
I almost think Hamilton must have had a small off when Vettel got close to him, since then Lewis has made another 1,5 gap again
yeah, bit odd indeed.
And Perez overtakes by going off the track and get 5 seconds? where is the consistency?
+1, it’s too much.
Where is the consistency between sporting and safety penaltys? There is none and should be none.
Wasn’t everyone complaining about how ridiculous it was that drivers could just ignore yellows? Upping the penalties for it is the direct result.
Safety (yellow flags) infraction does deserve worse penalty than gaining advantage in a fight, but it still is quite harsh.
Dat Droste shot o.O
Alonso s team radio sums up mclaren at the moment….
That speed trap graphic is pretty nice from FOM.
Is Hamilton trying to back up Vettel and hurt is tyres, or their pace is that similar?
From HAM’s radio, I’d say that’s his pace. Vettel might be a bit faster at this stage.
Looks like Hamilton is going as fast as he can, while Vettel might actually have a bit more in reserve.
Don’t know, Bottas is closing on Vettel now
yeah, that is exactly what I meant. Ricciardo is also matching the top 2 now. Vettel cannot go faster because Hamilton is up ahead, getting close to him would ruin his DF and quickly wear his tyres too.
Might be interesting to see whether MErcedes will have to go for a 2 stopper and what will Ferrari do then
Not sure if 2 stopper is faster or not. Ferrari can’t do a 2-stopper as clearing Bottas is not a certainty.
If Hamilton does go for a 2-stopper, he will have the undercut and hence Vettel can’t win after stopping later.
This is very much advantage Hamilton so far.
Especially now that Bottas being faster than hamilton right now. The 2-stopper is definitely not a winning strategy for Ferrari.
I rather meant it not as Mercedes WANTING to do a 2 stopper, but rather feeling forced to go for it if HAmilton keeps being not too happy on the softs.
Even if they are forced to do it, they are still in advantage of winning the race.
I believe that Mclaren with a Renault engine would be ahead of Red Bull…just leave Honda these guys can’t do a thing anymore
Tell that to Max Verstappen – for all we know Max could have been 3rd now. And McLaren with a Honda could have had Alonso camping out there instead of Max.
Im sure Verstappen would trade for a reliable Honda engine.
What’s one of those?
And right on cue….
Anything lasting more than 20% of a racedistance is lucrative to Max ;)
BOT will probably DNF so RIC can get on the podium and people will tel how he is destroying VER this year
Does Verstappen has performance clause as Vettel before breaking contract too?
I have heard that 1) Red Bull has to be in the top 3 as a team (OK), 2) have a winning car (already done too) and 3.) the drivers in the top 5 (or at least one in the top 5 maybe) mean he is locked in.
So basically Daniel lock Max in?
I doubt it, the way he forced himself into F1 his contract is probably on RBs terms.
Before that race win dropped into Ricciardo’s hands, I think he actually might have had a chance of jumping ship.
Doubt it. I read a Horner interview somewhere which said that Vettel got escape clauses in his contract only after winning the 2nd championship in 2011.
Even if he has one where would he go?
Mercedes could still take him, potentially. Would they say no if they had the chance?
Hamilton would.
Max on Dutch tv: you can’t call this bad luck…. this is just bad for a top team.
On the question how long he can take this: not long anymore
Would be funny if he went to McLaren to replace Alonso – Team Orange – and suddenly the Honda would come good and he’d be winning there :-)
Wait, so Perez with a 5s penalty ended up ahead of Ocon after his 2nd stop? how did that happen?
Silly FI
Well, I do think FI was asking for that really.
Oh my
BAM Ocon
Good for him to stand up against Perez
Safety car
YEah, that was clearly Perez fault, should have left space for OCON.
Arguably, it was FI switching up the strategy that put Ocon behind who put them there, and Perez who made it work out like that, as could have been expected.
haha again? Perez pressed Ocon to the wall
yeah, I’d think we should run the field through the pitlane actually
Aside from Lewis and Seb, these two have been very entertaining to watch though
RAI for the win?
now that would be cool.
Guess not
but not likely :)
SOFT vs US. Merc vs Ferrari
Wait, did VET have a long pitstop, or was that timing off?
Someone like Ross Brawn to control the two drivers is sorely needed at Force India
To be honest, I think they should tell Perez to sit out a race, that almost looked Schumacher vs Rubens material there.
Perez should feel bad.
This should be like candy from a baby for Vettel
Ferrari for the win? Perez clearly for blame
Bottas has a chance at a good tow on Vettel
Its lucky for Force India that Williams are so atrocious at the moment as they’ve squandered points by failing to get their drivers under control since Canada.
So true.. FI really need to do something.. Given VER’s retirements, they could have been closer to Red Bull by now!
ultras for Vettel, Softs for Hamilton Did Mercedes blown it?
Will be interesting to see how this one goes, doesn’t it.
So now we get another 5 laps of safety car for nothing zzzzz
Hi, Can someone explain why PER has no penalty? For how long? Until someone dies?
They’re normally more relaxed between team mates but this one hasn’t been investigated yet.
Let’s give them at least a bit of time to get a good look into it.
Well, the thing is that it’s been going on for some time, and other drivers have also made this kind of move with no penalty. So it will keep increasing…
HAM and BOT on softs but VET on US.. This is advantage Ferrari now!!! Come on Seb!
Hamilton’s message shows he knows this plays into Ferrari’s hands.
Well in the restart it does but lets see who crosses the finishline first.
It’s more the strategy than that.
Clearly, especially with Vettel right behind AND on softer tyres it will be a tough time to keep ahead on the restart.
Perez should feel bad. Words from Ocon were spot on.
You can make a reasonable argument that Ocon should have backed out. Doesn’t really take away from poor team management at Force India that is the main reason these incidents keep happening, they should have dealt with it after Baku and the team, by failing to do so, have reaped the expected rewards for not doing so
The gap was there until Perez started to close it when Ocon was already there next to his tyres
This is going to be good…Vettel and Hamilton may crash mark my words
I agree, this may be some of the best racing we’ve seen coming up here all year
No. Vettel will just drive past on the first lap
did the mercs ran out of Ultras?
yes
OCO was quite more polite than what I would’ve been.
He knows he has no chance now. Shame the safetycar wasn’t really needed. A VSC there would be fine. It was out of a slow corner and cleared up in seconds.
You must have missed that shot with debris all over the run up through eau rouge timmy. They really needed some room to clean that away.
Ferrari to finish 1-2 ?
Kimi is 5th, needs to first get past Ricciardo before he can get even close to Bottas. And Ricciardo also has new US tyres so that will not be as easy for him
The delta time between different compounds isn’t that big like some of past years, so that’s why I had that feeling, with 2012-2013 tires vettel would easy pass Hamilton even with that amazing power from merc PU
Hamilton having a proper sulk here. He knows what the Safety Car means for Ferrari’s chances.
But I won’t count out HAM yet. Remember Bahrain 2014, he kept Rosberg behind while on a slower set. If someone can win this for Mercedes, it is Hamilton.
Safety car with HAM 1st and SEB 2nd. SEB. stay cool. Don’t do a Baku :)
investigation on OCO/PER collision…
Is Bottas sleeping?
Bottas has damage
I don’t think so
yeah, lost only a small bit of his front wing though, shouldn’t hurt him too much
lovely defence from Hamilton. Bottas got mugged there.
okay, that was pretty good
RIC on P3 after Max’s mechanical failure
Where did we see that before
That’s action between HAM & VET!!
So, BOT was Zonta to Kimi’s Hakkinen?
Well as Raikkonen didn’t get past Ricciardo, I’d say no…
Hamilton flying
Engine mode ;-)
No fuel limitations now.
if HAM keeps it, he has to be my DotW
Yep!
No penalty for PER… as usual
A bit of a classic treat of 2017 – Max, running ahead of Ricciardo drops out from his car (or being punted off) and Daniel gets on the podium
while BOT isn’t quite up to it at a crucial moment for him?
indeed!
… and Ocon, PER have a great fight but Perez loses out in fear of being beaten by his rookie teammate?
And Alonso shows some great moves but has to stop the car before the end of the race. The story of 2017 :-)
Yeah this race has been like a highlights reel.
Exactly Keith!
Oco and Perez no further action probably coz they’re team mates
Like Max `10 seconds penalty in Hungary???
indeed.
Good point Jelle. I saw far more malice in this one from PErez than Max not making his braking point there.
VET’s only chance was that first lap :( He missed it :(
Hard words from Jos Verstappen on Dutch tv They need to go around the table. Max’s motivation on the line. He’s clearly quicker than RIC but the car keeps failing.
Yeah, and again engine – also tough for McLaren – Renault doesn’t seem entirely good choice, even though Honda showed some embarrasing issues.
Doesn’t look like Seb will have anything for Lewis.
Perez 3.5 secs off normal pace, but Palmer is too chicken to take him.
He doesn’t have the straight line speed from his Renault engine to take a low drag FI with a mercedes
I take it back, Perez only 1.7sec off, and that was a gutsy move.
Round the outside at 130mph in Fanges.
So ham and vet is 1sec faster than ric but still kimi cant make an attack.
Not even sure he has the motiavation. Then again, Vettel also can’t get close to Hamilton and has softer tyres to help him a bit too.
I don’t understand! Is this Mercedes or is this Hamilton? They are comfortably keeping Seb behind while on tyres 2 steps harder!!
Both
Mercedes works it’s tyres harder. And Vettel has the disadvantage of dirty air behind Lewis. He would have to be 2 seconds faster to have a chance to catch him and make an attempt at passing.
Well its both. Merc straightline speed for a few hotlaps is in a class of its own and Hamilton is riding that beast flawlessly.
I’d say that too, Hamilton nailed restart, then got temp into those softs. Remember, Merc. took out some wing after seeing Ferrari’s S1,S2 Friday speed to defend against overtakes, that might have helped them in the end.
Has Seb given up or is there still one challenge left?
Think he’s done.
loving the soft tyres beating the ultras..
well done lewis..Dotw
Yawn
Perez’s fault.
If you can’t overtake here on softer tyres with DRS in the sport then what chance is there elsewhere? Ferrari couldn’t pass Merc. Merc couldn’t pass Ferrari. Ferrari couldn’t pass RB.
Yeah, but Daniel did manage to pass Valtteri and Kimi on the restart.
The restarts is a bit different though. Vettel also was really close to making it past, Lewis only just kept ahead
Danny was helped by Kimi being on the other end for Bottas. Else Bottas had the inside line and wouldn’t have had to be too cautious.
Indeed, it meant Bottas couldn’t take the inside of that corner because he still had Kimi there. you could see how even Hulk got right up to Bottas from how he lost momentum there.
Yup. Hulkster was there as well if Bottas had one more cautious corner. Although I guess he would have taken it back in the remaining laps.
yeah, we are back to needing maybe 2,5 seconds speed difference to have a chance to overtake when running on track.
There were a lot of passes, 3 top teams were close, so hard to overtake.
Seems I recall a number 44 going past a number 7 near au rouge
Imagine Raikkonen being concentrated during the early yellow for Verstappen and not having that stop-go, he’d have been on the podium, Ferrari would have made a good indentation in Merc’s WCC lead.
good point.
should’ve, would’ve, could’ve
Seen on Friday that the softs were more than a match for the Ultras. Combine that with the engine mode of Mercedes.
That said, great drive from the top 2. Ricciardo should change his name from Honey badger to the Weasel. Almost every time Max retires, he ends up on the podium.
Kimi should have at least got an attack on Ricciardo. But props to him for doing that move on Bottas.
Happy that the next installment is only a week away.
Did Lewis just tell Seb he never saw that he was close?
Great race from the top 2. Shame Fernando can’t fight with them
Just imagine where Max Verstappen could have been in there too, he might have mixed into the restart to make it even more interesting (although then Kimi would not have had his penalty to drop him down either)
Yeah, would have been interesting; could Max have mixed it in the fight for the win?
Considering that Ferrari seem to have more downforce in the car, I suppose they could go with a very lean wing and yet be able to get the car working on the corners.
Hamilton is great on the brakes but the Ferrari is very comfortable as well. Should be a good race again hopefully.
BOT P5 despite a power and penalty advantage is a disappointment.
The Ferrari looked really good, if they have a good special for Monza, I’d say that could be an interesting fight too.
ok, bye for now everyone. That was quite a good race to kick back into the season, I can only hope that Monza shows us another tight fight between the top 2 (looks like Ferrari could be even closer there!)
Bye and see you for Monza!!
Bye, see you all for Monza indeed.
Thanks very much for joining in everyone, lots more coming up between now and the next race – practice starts in just five days!
Hello everyone and welcome to F1 Fanatic Live for the Italian Grand Prix weekend!
Teams concerned about incoming rain and bringing their run programmes forward.
Very dark clouds around the circuit right now. We’re just walking in near parabolica
Few spots now coming down
Mercedes are already eight-tenths up on the best time from first practice last year. They’re going to be close to that all-time track record if qualifying is dry…
They’re down by around 20kph in the braking zone for turn one compared to last year.
Hamilton now a second up on the best from last year.
OK I’m calling it: I think if qualifying is dry we’ll see the 2004 track record fall. That’ll be a new all-time record for fastest ever F1 lap…
What about top speed record and average speed record? Will they fall too? I want them over ~370 Km/h set by Montoya here!
Is it me or are the supersofts not quite giving a huge chunk of extra time? Seems just about .1-.3s?
Hello everyone and welcome to F1 Fanatic Live for final practice. In theory, at least – heavy rain means we might not see much running…
Start delayed “indefinitely” due to rain.
I guess Vettel wouldn’t mind very much if it kept pouring like this and they had to go by startnumber for the grid :)
McLaren Honda with Van 2 on Pole in Monza, who would have thought
Newbie
Is it just me or does the track look completely driveable? I mean full wets needed for sure, but it’s not looking like a monsoon rain out there.
It’s just you. No way in hell is that anywhere near ready! The Safety Car is going so slow it’s comical.
Looks like it’s wet enough that cars would be aquaplaning on most of the track to me.
I just saw the on-board footage from the safety car. I guess you’re right. That looks extreme!
And Whiting just confirmed that even the SC was aquaplaning at places. But, seems to be easing, so quali will be on a drying track, which might be great.
Track is looking a lot better now.
Anyone know when does the Safety car gets to practice on tracks? Or they just go with the simulator practice itself?
Well, they do laps on Thursdays don’t they? I don’t know if they do more at other times though.
Thank you. It was sliding around lot and looked scary even for a car with all electronic gadgets for help.
The F1 drivers need to use all their experience here.
Must confess I’m surprised they’ve green-lighted this. It doesn’t look massively improved. But perhaps the rain has eased and they’re betting the drainage will have improved the track conditions a lot in ten minutes time. This is an area where they’ve been very conservative in the recent past so perhaps they’ve decided to be a bit bolder.
Ricciardo just demoed how much they will be sliding around :-)
Sainz has been good in his STR when it was wet before, might well be he’s hoping for it to stay damp.
Let ‘s hope wet quali also. Mixed (skilled) grid would be nice.
Kvyat seemed to have his front right not getting any grip as he was breaking for turn 1.
I don’t think Vettel is particularly good in the wet. It’s just, he’s good, so in the wet he can keep it up. With Verstappen, he does shine in the wet, and Hamilton has done so in the past too. Hulkenberg and Sainz too, seem to have something extra they can show in the wet as well.
Bottas has been really good in wet conditions as well. However Verstappen is probably the best of them all.
Quite a pity even the 1st place would still drop him to around 15th.
oh, wait, no Verstappen so far only has 5 for gearbox right? hm, he could get back to 5th then :)
If quali gets cancelled for some reason it will be an interesting grid.
Go away rain! From all the possible seasons why did it have to hit the one that followed technical regulation changes aiming for a significant lap time improvement from circuit the circuit, LOL.
‘circuit to circuit’
So, heavy rain for quali???
The first time I’m ever disappointed to see rain for qualifying…really wanted to see that lap record beaten!
Yeah it’s a bit of a shame. But if it creates some intrigue in the starting order that’s good too.
looks like it is still too wet to give us any record breaking times from Q3, although it will get almost dry, I think it will be a little off that
Looks like that lap time will stand for another year. 😁👌
Work on Raikkonen’s car, I wonder if they are thinking to put him on a wetter setup, to hedge their bets, while Vettel goes with the setup needed to be able to win the race.
I doubt it, unless the forecasts for tomorrow’s race changed. They’ve been saying it’ll definitely be dry for the past few days.
I know, but isn’t Raikkonen there to be sacrificed? If he could get a wet pole, stop HAM from getting it, well …
With how the start is at Monza, they’d have a better shot with Vettel in P2 next to Hamilton if need be
Wet qualifying, and Hulkenberg has a 10-place grid penalty, so there’s no point taking advantage of his good wet ability… He’ll probably start a max of 15th either way (as 6 drivers have penalties, and he won’t get into the top 4 anyway)… Sigh…
Qualify battle Hulk 11 – 0 Palmer….Ouch
Stupid to count Azerbaijan against Palmer.
Hulk would’ve likely outqualified him there anyway. Though it should be 10-1 because of Spa.
I’d say we shouldn’t count Spa against Palmer either, until the car gave up he had been the faster of the two.
Sigh Brundle. Anything money is nonsense, giving the team a penalty instead of the driver/car means nothing for a team not going for the championship either. And what about “negative points” then? Honestly, I think that apart from the Sky team nobody cares as much about the penalties. In effect it just means they start at the back if they take a new engine. I can see how maybe they would want to halt the trend to even less engines when it already is problematic with the current amount. That is the only thing that does make sense to stop having too many penalties.
Yesterday (this morming?) they had a talk w. Horner where they talked about it – said that very clearly too.
VER gets penalized twice in effect for a PU failure. Doesn’t finish a race then starts way down the grid. Not sure how to make that fairer.
It just means the team has to do a better job of making the car not break down, doesn’t it. In the end, if they build 4 engines that last the season, there will be no penalties, regardless of when they blow.
…and Grosjean into the barrier on the front straight.
But he did set 3rd time for now, for all the good that will do him.
… though having said that, if he can start on the grid, 15th (through Q1, no lap in Q2) would maybe with all the penalties, become 9-11th …
Wow, scary looking. His usual attitude over the radio though.
How does Hamilton do this in the rain? 1st lap – 2 seconds (” seconds) ahead of anyone else. Is this guy born with gills and webbed feet or what?
yes, he is yeah :-)
:-) I mean, TWO seconds in these conditions. How does one even stay ‘cool’ and composed?
Hamilton was the 1st to do a decent lap. The conditions quickly became much worse. That is one of the reasons for the time gaps.
Bottas is 4s slower, with a missed 1st chicane, so …
yeah, I thought Bottas was out first, similar cars..but 4 seconds! And according to my F1 live timing Vettel was s2 whilst Hamilton was still going around.
On my timing HAM set that time before VET got his time in, so maybe that was HAM on 2nd lap then? That chicane BOT missed explains quite a bit of the 4s though, but indeed VET 2s slower.
I suspect this will be a pretty long stoppage…
Grosjean probably driving himself out of any top seats with all those comments.
I get it that it is dangerous and maybe the other drivers are thinking that as well. But he seems to be particularly vocal about it and whiny.
Yeah, giving that the session is now stopped, I’d gather they stopped it a bit too late!
It does get old hearing him sometimes
And FOM could easily let us hear less …
And yet he couldn’t be more strident in his criticism of Halo.
Maybe it’s not the rain Romain, maybe you just can’t drive in the rain. Remember he binned it on the way to the grid last time we had conditions like this.
Is not a rain master that is for sure…
Given that the session was stopped immediately after, I’d say it was hardly driveable or not even that for most cars outside the top 4 cars. Especially with low DF setting for a dry Sunday
when the car aquaplanes in a straight line like that there isn’t much driver skill involved. even the best drivers in the wet have had moments like that.
depending on how long until it stops raining, maybe Haas can still get Grosjean get a shot at it, the car did not look too damaged
Ah, ok, so you aren’t allowed to do that? Shame
on the pits channel with the team radio grosjean was not the only driver coming out with comments like he was.
It fells like Race Control are taking more chances with the conditions today than we’re used to seeing them do in wet conditions. I wonder if part of that is in the hope that the wet weather tyres are better than they were. Grosjean’s crash would suggest not. That wasn’t a driver error, that was aquaplaning in a straight line.
The straight there had quite a bit of water on it too.
Maybe the new pitstraight tarmac is also part of the issue though
How long will they wait before canceling the session (completely)? More than 1 hour?
And yet, the FOM helicopter still flies.
last year we all felt he was too conservative in rain conditions… tough balancing act
hey, thanks-you do a great job getting these excerpts up so fast. Deeplay appreciated :-)
Why aren’t there water vehicles to prep the surface? It’s 2017. Surely sweep the track clear of standing water with a rubber bladed truck is reasonable?
There is nothing more efficient to get the track dry than a couple of F1 cars on wets doing the rounds.
Not when the rain is still falling. And we’re not talking about a mile oval in NASCAR or something, this is almost six kilometres of asphalt.
Standing water is an effect of water not draining away and if it continues to rain a mere sweep of the water will do noting more than a sweep with a drenched towel.
Of course, but a sweep immediately before a session gives the cars a chance to clear a fair amount with their tyres. Don’t want it dry, just driveable
It was driveable and the rain picked up as the session started.
But anyway, handily done by Ericsson for now.
Restart delayed. Next information in 15 minutes.
Conditions don’t look that bad. Are those Pirelli wets that bad?
Its the new tarmac on the pit straight, the water isnt draining off/through it
Well he could have stayed off throttle, I understand he aquaplaned but re applied the throttle.
It sure sounded like he did.
problem is that if you stay off throttle down a straight with poor visibility you could get run over by the car behind. thats what ended didier pironis f1 career at hockenheim in 1982 when prost lifted on the straight & didier couldn’t see him so drive into him. same with brundle & senna at adelaide in 1989.
What’s the forecast for tomorrow? More rain? It may be best to delay qualifying until tomorrow morning then race in the afternoon.
Weather Underground says Clear and Sunny.
Get comfortable guys, this could take a while.
Amateur hour. The track was fine. This is so sad.
It was fine until a crashed car was standing at the runoff area. They have apperently learned from Bianchi.
But no need to delay the session like this now.
Agreed
all the drivers were complaining about aquaplaning on the straight, one car crashed on the straight because of that.
the water isnt draining off the new tarmac on the straight, you cant send cars out under those conditions.
Grosjean reapplied the throttle after his first moment. That’s driver error. It’s stupid to account for driver error.
Ofc. you can a Sauber is top 10 and Grosjean has crashed.
Clearly it wasn’t. Driver after driver on the radio is complaining about aquaplaning.
Just look at Hamiltons lap right there and how many times the best car on the grid, with one of the best wet drivers still struggles over much of the lap, almost lost it on the straight too.
And a struggeling driver is a bad thing because? Verstappen was on a killer lap..
What was being glued on kimi car?
Don’t buy the argument the track was worsening either because there were drivers going faster than Hamilton. It’s all so conservative
Just give them Bridgestones from tyre war era. They would be going easy :D
WHo knows how they would even hold on with the high torque of the current hybrid engines. The power and acceleration is a LOT more than the V8 ever gave into its axles
The engine torque and the torque on the axels aint the same thing. The new refined “power units” are probably more gentle in the wet than the V8s where.
Depends on when, because they did do quite a bit of traction control too in the V8 days. And the ECU was not homologated that long ago either
Well im not talking about tractioncontrol because that is supposed to be illegal. Im talking about smooth powerdelivery when grip is low.
… but part of the V8 they did have it, that’s the point @bascb was making …
yes, but befor they got the homologated ECU all teams WERE using traction control, that covers the time of the tyre wars, doesn’t it? It IS a crucial difference between the cars then and now @rethla
Well if you are talking about driving in the wet being hard without traction control then i agree and its a good thing, it should be hard. That has nothing with the torque of the hybrids or aquaplaining conditions to do however.
It means that the cars used with those tyres we spoke about were a lot easier to drive in the wet @rethla. And tractioncontrol and more freedom in the ECU did help them too with damper settings / ride height.
Maybe so but do you remember any postponed qualis or races due to rain in that time? Either those tyres were a lot better or the race control is more cautios nowadays.
And now, whenever is it wet enough for wet tyres sessions are suspended and SC is deployed. And then they usually go straight to inters:D
I do think the tyres were better. Afterall, both Bridgestone and Michelin had a LOT more testing laps to learn abuot the wet tyres. But also, the current engines and the chassis etc have changed a lot, I think it might well be that the way they are ran currently with very low fronts and high rake has an effect too. Also, traction control. And yes, race control certainly has become more wary too.
track was clearly getting worse, it was starting to rain a lot harder as noted by the commentary team at the track & in the pits.
also drivers were not going faster, sector times were all slower than those of the 1st few cars to finish laps. and the fact one car aquaplaned in a straght line shows conditions were worsening as does radio messages from a bunch of different drivers that have been played on pits channel.
Verstappen was the fastest man on track and faster than Hamilton’s sectors. So that’s patently not true.
verstappen was also on the radio saying conditions were too bad and that he was aquaplaning on the straight.
The track was worsening outside of the racingline where the cars wasnt clearing water.
The track out back of the circuit looks fine. Circuit can’t be perfect everywhere. Drive to the conditions on the straight.
Delayed another 15 minutes.
siesta time duh!..
On the bright side it’s good for haas.
In the 1970s we used to run SCCA nationals in worse conditions.
I think some of the anger at race control is misplaced. I think this is down to the quality of Pirelli’s wet weather tyres. It’s not as if the drivers haven’t highlightewd this problem before:
We have not seen much use of Pirelli’s heavy wet tires lately.
There was an artificial wet session during the pre-season tests and then almost no-one made use of this opportunity to test the Pirelli wet weather tyres. The teams are also to blame I think.
It looked a lot dryer, don’t understand the future delay
Look at the track outside of the pits, then you should understand the delay. There has just been more rain since they red flagged it, so it will be worse. But looks to only be very bad there.
I saw the Safety Car do a little overpower wiggle coming out of the chicane from the helicopter shot
Oh well then, better shut down the circuit and lock the cars in the garage.
Yep but still it looked a lot better
apart from the straight – the exact place where Grosjean aquaplaned off – that looks completely wet, the new tarmac seems not to have been solved too sensibly with regards to wet weather.
Maybe I read the radar wrong, bit it looks like it only gets worse
Safety car looked like he had a pretty good lap going there!
I think those criticizing the red flag/delays would very quickly change there views if they were ever put in a car in these conditions.
Its easy to say that conditions aren’t bad and/or that drivers should slow down. However when you have standing water, especially on a straight then there isn’t much drivers can do & slowing down can actually be far more dangerous not only because it raises the risk of a car behind running into you but also because by backing off you actually increase the chance of aquaplaning as your producing less downforce with a bit less loads in the tyres.
Well Marcus Ericsson loves it.
Yeah, true. I mean, sure, at this moment, it looks pretty good on track, but, they have to get everything ready, definitely including the marshals for the cars running. I don’t know if there’s a better way.
Wrong. I’ve raced formula fords in far worse. Heck, I’ve raced in super karts in far worse.
yeah, exactly what Grosjean just mentioned in the interviews. No visibility and standing water on the straight.
Sure the wets aren’t great but I think the frustration on the fans part is that EVERY time it rains either during the race or qualifying, the race is usually either stopped, or a session is delayed over and over again.
Yes It used to set F1 apart in the US for example, driving in the rain
The sport is under an intense microscope for safety right now which brought about the halo. It wants to be seen in a positive light in regards to driver safety after the Bianchi accident and pending lawsuit.
I cant remember the last time it was wet in Monza- any ideas?
I saw a lot of standing water on the front straight at start/finish line.
Are you there Keith?
people often look back & say ‘they used to race in these conditions’ which is true, however go back and watch those races and we used to get most the grid spinning/crashing out with races turning into battle of luck & survival rather than an actual race.
races like adelaide in 1989 and 1991 were started but looking back really shouldnt have been, neither were that great to watch from a racing perspective and having cars spinning and running into each other blind on the straghts was really not that great to watch.
I was at both of those races in Adelaide – I was 13 & 15- even Senna couldn’t keep it on track.
May be liberty can revive Bernies Monsoon tyres
Someone would have to actually test them …
FURTHER INFORMATION WILL BE ISSUED AT 15:00
Are they joking??? Come on!!
and then they wonder why tv audience falls. omg just get going
Would be fun if they actually were: JUST KIDDING, SESSION RESTART AT 15.00
my god.
Formula One is jumping the shark.
Hahahahahaha
Some people who watch this really seem a little bit grumpy! :D If you don’t like what is happening, just stop watching it. How easy would that be?
But there is nothing to watch, thats the problem! We want them to get going, the conditions are fine!
+1
The problem is not that we dont wanna watch this its that we DO wanna watch the qualification.
Why are you grumpy about people who have every reason to be grumpy? If you don’t like what people are saying, just log off the chat. How easy would that be?
well done bro, well done.
I think it’s like your Dreamgirl undressed every 15 minutes, only to put her clothes back on, saying: “more info in 15 minutes”
I reckon it’ll be canceled.
Why does F1 still have full wets? Either only race when it is intermediate weather or actually use the bleeding things. Maybe should just become Nascar and never race in the wet
The problem is that the full wets rarely are faster than intermediates they are just safer and noone cares about that. They need do make better tyres, simple as that.
Charlie is waiting for Herbie to rock up for a Sav Blanc lol….. in his new Porsche haha
If it doesn’t start by 3PM, I bet they will delay qualifying until tomorrow.
Jeez, absolute joke.
They need to be cautious after Jules
I’m off for now, not going to wait around. Either I miss qualifying or not, but meh. Its raining
And now it is raining again hahahaha
Quoting Vettel: “Fork off, Charlie!”
Iiieeeeewwwww Flavio on rtl Thinking about stopping watching
Just got a text from somebody at the track who said the problem isn’t the conditions in terms of how much its raining.
The problem is that the resurfaced track on the straight not only isn’t draining but also has a residue of oils or something coming through it that is creating additional problems.
90% of the track is fine, Its not too wet & there aren’t many puddles….. However on some of the straights that have been resurfaced its just not raceable. Had there been no resurfacing it would be fine however the newly laid tarmac is causing problems that are preventing them going out.
Seriously how can a world class track get this wrong?
But that residue is an issue with all new surface, isn’t it? I mean, does that mean that Monza left it too late to resurface, wasn’t FIA alert enough to note that? And yes, it gets worse with water of course, but still, not unexpected is it?
Anyway, thanks for giving that bit of info from the horse’s mouth @gt-racer.
Tracks need to be set up so that they drain water away from the track. No excuse for standing water on track.
This has been handled so amazingly badly. Outside of being overly safe, they’re just plain incompetent.
They’re completely incapable of reacting. Session started under questionable circumstances but between 14:15 and a few minutes ago it was fine. But because they check every 15 minutes rather than constantly they can’t respond to changes or windows.
Remember when F1 fans used to talk about who is the best driver on a wet track? If they are going to stop racing every time it rains, that unique experience of F1 on standing water would be gone.
Charlie, stop being paranoid and let the cars loose.
Whilst we have Pirelli supplying the tyres, this is how things will continue to work I think.
Charlie cant now- after Jules they risk backlash if they get it wrong- so they be over cautious
I still think too many people don’t seem to respect the decision not to continue with qualifying. They will have their reasons. Grosjean crashed and that was a lucky escape. The track on the part he crashed has hardly improved and it is still raining. There is a possibility that something much worse could happen and the reason why it will have been red flagged will very likely to prevent this happening! If something terrible did happen, the drivers and many fans possibly will say they were mad to let them continue. I think there is far too much critisism towards these decisions.
The only reason the session is not restarted is the fact that those Pirelli wets are rubbish
Can we please enjoy our moment of rage without these clever and logical posts, ok? Thank you! /s
I don’t understand how you can enjoy being angry…. :D
FURTHER INFORMATION WILL BE ISSUED AT 15:15
Ha ha)) I’ll go make some coffee…
Prediction: The session will restart, drivers will quickly go onto intermediates, and everyone will assume this means the session was started too late, rather than being that the wet weather tyres aren’t up to the job.
This full wet thing is a little crusade of yours but it’s just not proven by anything. Under Pirelli they have worked plenty. Aquaplaning is virtually impossible to engineer into a tire.
I wouldn’t have brought it up if the complaints about the quality of the wet weather tyres didn’t come straight from the only people whose opinion about this matters – the drivers:
It’s been a consistent source of complaint from them in the Pirelli era. And that’s despite F1 going to lengths to prevent them speaking publicly about the shortcomings of the tyres. Remember Spa 2015.
@keithcollantine, did you see the post by @gt-racer below, talking about how the oily residue from the new surface is the biggest issue, not the water?
In Keith’s defence the drivers in particular Vettel. Have voiced concerns about the wet tires for a few years now. However, Martin just said it best, throttle works both ways, drive to the conditions.
15 more minutes
Is this the result of
A. Pirelli B. Charlie whiting C. Fundamental errors in track chemical composition
B Charlie. Send the cars out and redflag it again when someone crash. If they want more consistent action during wet then make better tyres and racetracks in the future.
The old banked track looks like it’s draining nicely…
Get them out there then !!!
Evil Horner, if they’re being cautious because of Jules they should just make sure no tractors are on the track. It’s sprinkling right now.
I agree Josh – I think they should be qualifying right now – but that’s not the case !
Just on the tyres, The full wets aren’t as good as they could be (Neither are the intermediates really) but today I don’t believe that is the biggest problem.
Yes its probably a factor but i’m not sure the best wet tyres would work all that well on the new tarmac thats causing the concerns.
And it depends who is driving on those tyres. A qualified, experienced F1 driver or a rich kid.
So what happens in the event that we can’t restart this thing ? Do they use this as the grid ?
They can still run qualifying tomorrow, when it’s supposed to be dry. Failing that they’d use Q1 times – as I recall USA 2015 was a precedent for that.
Thanks Keith. I didn’t know if they could still postpone it til tomorrow once they’d started the session.
I won’t moan about the decision to keep the cars off the track… but I’m definitely not happy about the decisions being made in 15 minute intervals. Why can’t they just have the safety car circulating the track until the track appears to be suitable?
I’d agree with that. They seem to miss good windows by waiting 15 mins.
I think Charlie is the biggest problem despite other possible factors related to oils from new track asphalt.
Charlie doesn’t make these decisions alone, He takes advice from not only others in race control but also with feedback from teams, drivers, Track workers & the safety car drivers.
But do you know why they have to do it in 15 min intervals only? It almost seems like asking for missed opportunities.
Why is Charlie the problem? He does need to keep all drivers safe. Love to see Herbie- great man
Yes, I also don’t quite understand that. And then, if they decide ‘go’ will it be ‘go in 10mins’ to give it time to start raining again?
It has to be planned ahead a few minutes with all the people people watching and working with this. They cant just go by the minute with an operation like this.
So far this is a perfect birthdaygift for Ericsson.
It’s only 3:10 pm in Italy, at what point do they call this? I assume there are support races to be run?
I think they call the support races before they call the F1 qualification.
5pm (ish)- plenty of time
Hopefully my television doesn’t switch to tennis!
See, it’s incredibly difficult to clear the water when the cars aren’t out and the Safety Car’s just going out once every 15 mins…
At least Nascar would have dryers and street vehicles out on track driving around pushing the water off.
On the 15 minute windows, How long they wait is usually taken based on circumstances at the time.
If its a track that dries quickly with little standing water & no rain then they will look at things on a shorter interval. If there is a lot of standing water, A lot of continuous rain or something like with the new surface today they will look at things at longer intervals.
They also can’t make a call to restart a session immediately as F1 engines need to be prepared, brought upto temperature etc…. before they can be run so teams need prep time before sending cars out.
FURTHER INFORMATION AT 15:30. 10 MINUTES WARNING WILL BE GIVEN BEFORE ANY RE-START
Great, just great)
The earliest the session could restart is in 26 minutes time. Put the kettle on. Hell, you could knock up a batch of scones.
Its 11pm here Keith- a glass of port and some beef jerky ok :)
It is not restarting today. The first corner seems to have a puddle now. Don’t think it is clearing unless the sun shines.
Pre-quali best food always banana’s – same for every sport.
Food I believe😂😂 Sorry, couldn’t resist that one😂
The closest I can think of to something like this (Track surface causing issues) would be the Indycar race at Sao Paulo in 2010 where whatever was used on the surface down the main straight was causing lots of problems with cars sliding around in the dry let alone the wet.
Practice was stopped early, Qualifying canceled & a lot of work done overnight/early morning to make it drivable for race day.
Is there actually a problem with the tracksurface, i have heard nothing official about it?
Its not a problem as such, Just that the freshly laid tarmac on the straight isn’t draining so water is just sitting on it. Also some of the oils that are used in the mix are coming up & not helping things.
Yeh i understand that its draining poorly and its oily but i have heard nothing from FIA, teams or Charlie about it. Is it actually true that the new asphalt is worse than the old?
It’s 9:19 here Kieth, I’m gonna crack a bottle of white and shock the pool.
Keith could you do an article on f1 driver diet and f1 driver fitness?
test
I wonder if Red Bull and Ferrari would push for the restart. There’s little chance that they can outqualify the Mercs on a dry track, so if qualy gets moved to tomorrow, they (Ferrari) can kiss pole goodbye.
I never get the popular belief that Ferrari makes the rule in F1. Most recent rules and verdicts have been neutral or against them.
lol on Helmut Marko’s comment on Grosjean
“We all know that Grosjean often crashes in the wet” Something like that. A bit harsh!
Lol awesome
Helmut Marko firing shots at Grosjean lmao. He kinda has a point, Grosjean did crash on the way to the grid at Brazil last year…
That was hilarious lol Grojean is gonna Grojean.
And Verstappen, Vettel & Somebody else (Alonso maybe?) aquaplaned & spun at around the same place in the race with Raikkonen aquaplaning/crashing a bit further along.
Have been using my time productively: I think I now know what order to apply all the grid penalties in. Now we just need a grid…
Helmut Marko speaking the truth. We stopped running because of Grosjean. Who does this more often.
One of Helmut’s own drivers (Verstappen) was also on the radio saying conditions were too dangerous just prior to Romain going off & I gather that all drivers on track at that point were coming back with the same comments.
And Grosjean was 3rd before he aquaplaned. I do think Marco has somewhat of a point about the missed opportunity of a period w/o rain before 15h, but he’s as self serving as Lauda saying it needs to go to tomorrow (bc. that’s when he has best chance of 1-2 on gird).
Lauda saying he’d prefer to do it in the dry tomorrow because Mercedes have less downforce. I do like Niki, he always says it how it is. Very refreshing compared to half-answers we often get.
They have the fastest lap however.
At this rate, the only qualifying session I may see will be Indycars at Watkins Glen
Cars have to start race on suspension and aero settings from qualifying even on wet weather sessions?
While its dry today there’s talk of very heavy rain at Watkins Glen tomorrow.
Storms from Hurricane Harvey?
Just the remnants. Half an inch of rain.
Last weekend, COTA canceled their F1 watch party for Spa because of the rain but opened its RV park for evacuees from Rockport.
First time I have ever laughed at one of Marko’s comments
Surprised that ‘Further information in 15 minutes’ isn’t trending on twitter. I guess some people are saying info, some saying mins, etc.
Bernadette Collins has an inspirational career path ! Makes me feel happy for her yet sad I can’t do even 1/10 as much.
Weird. The driver with the highest speed trap is also the driver who crashed.
Because he can’t drive in rain. Funny enough Robert Doornbos expected several drivers having problems and Haas were two of them. He should have lifted on the straight but he kept his foot down.
I just emailed Charlie and said we should be ok to go- for some reason haven’t heard back yet
In 15 minutes….
Charlie is probably calling his mommy to see if she thinks it’s safe yet.
The rain delay I can tolerate, it’s all these crappy rain .gifs the teams are posting which get on my nerves. It’s like they’ve each hired the same moronic 10-year-old to run their Twitter accounts.
Yeh those youngsters are always annoying
It’s often the older blokes, who haven’t yet been worn out in the novelty of .gifs etc.
At least you don’t have to watch NBCSN’s crappy coverage.
Should have had 25 cars out there the whole time under the delay
True- but we only have 20 cars- but they should be out there
Get the F2 cars out there, their race is cancelled any way ;)
Toto, Helmut. Two down for Grosjean. I am sure Gunther Steiner has had a few words as well. He is running out of TP’s to irritate.
I want some of those carrot cakes!!!
Well another 2 minutes and fate awaits
nah, another 15 minutes
And when they make a decision, they have to give a 10 minute notice to the teams.
The heli-cam is what is doing the SC justice. The normal cameras show them to be very slow whereas he is flying!
We need some cars on the track. Why don’t they send the two-seater around a couple of times to clear some of the standing water on the home straight?
Or at least keep the SC going around.
I doubt they ever run the twoseater in anything but dry conditions.
Move the damn thing to tomorrow already!
no tomorrow, please! I presonally have already wasted 2 hours of my life on waiting for them to get to the track. I’d prefer them do that today, so that I don’t feel that this time was wasted completely and for no reason.
+1 buddy
Some of the different paddock coverage is neat to see though, in Montreal I’ve only sat in grandstands, not the VIP treatment
Is nigel mansell racing in place of massa this weekend?
What’s the weather forecast for tomorrow race time?
Dry tomorrow and sunny for most of the day.
We all would like it to be reversed, wouldn’t we..
Should be dry.
almost time for our next 15 minute extension…
guessed it. Wasnt hard
FURTHER INFORMATION AT 16:15
I’m out. I’ll be back for the race tomorrow morning.
16:30 – Practice 3, IndyCar at Watkins Glen
One question. Is there any purpose on this wet tires?
Yes, they use them for one lap to ensure it’s OK to put on the intermediates or even slicks.
And they use them to roll the cars on Thursday too, I think.
They do about as much use as the guy stood on track trying to brush the water away with a wicker broom!
If bits of the track had not been resurfaced the wets would have been fine as conditions on the older bits of tarmac were by all accounts perfectly drivable, It was only the new tarmac that was causing problems.
Anyone think stoffel looks like Jean Claude van dam?
Arghhhh!!
FURTHER INFORMATION AT 16:30
Any further justification for charlie’s decisions?
Two minutes of Danny Cam. My head is spinning.
Ted Kravitz still wearing shorts. Oh Teddy, never change.
it’s not like it’s getting cold all of a sudden. If I were to choose what wet garment to wear, it would rather be shorts than lets say jeans)))
Imagine if you’d spent $1,800 for an “F1 Experience” at Monza
They have gone to cricket highlights in India. For heaven’s sake, please know what is happening on the track. Just don’t do the default programming.
Info from the track…… If conditions stay as they are the session may well be restarted in the next half hour.
Jay! People hard at work blow-drying and sweeping the worst puddles away.
It would take a single F1 car to go over it 200km/h and blow it away.
Is Charlie being too conservative ?
Update : in 15 mins there will be another update about the update in 15 mins which will be followed by an update in 15 mins
I’m torn between wanting to see some action and knowing that if they qualify in the dry tomorrow we might see a new all-time record…
I’m 100% in favour of wet qualifying. Could make the race exciting, something that track record won’t have any effect on.
I love Sunday qualifying but I’d rather see a battle in the wet as opposed to Mercedes Mercedes Ferrari Ferrari as we’ll see tomorrow. The spectators have been sat in the rain waiting for hours – it’s good for the sport to do it today.
Seriously contemplating going to bed now. How long till it’s dark in monza?
Four hours, seven minutes.
Saw a tweet saying rain is due to stop at 18:00 local time, and sunset is at 19:57… Sooo there would be time, but just for the F1.
Put the cars out there and let them blow off the track!!!
I just got an email back from Charlie (I am not joking, I do know him) and he says they are keen to get going pretty soon! lets go boys!
Lol and Lewis Hamilton is my Uncle.
Here we go – session restarts in ten minutes.
Finally!! Hurray!
Glad I didn’t give up and go to get a haircut now! :D
As I said, Within half hour.
Let’s hope there’s no red-flag-producing crash!!! Drivers, please FOCUS.
I wonder if Haas fixed Romain’s car…
What are the rules on that?
if they did fix it, there is nothing stopping him from going again and causing another red flag)
Maylander is surely having some fun out there.
Roman’s car didn’t seem to have damage that would be unfixable in the time available, Ivan B.
Are there rules though, that if you retire from a session you can’t continue? It’s not like the old days when you could hop in the spare car in this situation
there is, and he cannot join
Coffee cup refueled and ready to go!!!! :~)
The f1 telecast stopped in India when the cars are about to start
NBC commentators suppose Grosjean might to be allowed to participate in the session. This due to regulations after you retire on the track.
might not*
Because your car didn’t make it back to the pits under it’s own power.
1 crash will likely end this 3 hour deal
….and cause a gigantic, mass face-palm.
Palmer and Ericsson in the wet… Uh oh
Stroll……
Is it just me, or does it look close to inters?
If it has stopped raining its always close to inters.
All cars on track except for Grosjean.
Corking first lap by Hamilton.
Yay!!!! :)
How many sets of full wets? Enough for new ones in Q3, 2 and 1?
3.
Dont be silly. The FIA dont believe in wets.
Q3 will be slicks at this rat3
Stroll and Massa pretty handy so far in that williams.
Vettel to inters???
Inters already. Shambles.
Stroll P4?
Waited way too long to go out. This is the problem with F1 in the wet atm, Most of the time, as they get the session started, it’s basically time for inters.
Alonso on inters – no grip, no power…
VET purple S1
That shot of the Ferrari brake on fire whilst they had the tyre off was amazing.
FIA graphics in denial over everyone switching to inters…
Great reaction time by Kimi!
The radar is nasty looking
Another reason why Verstappen might be right to go out on wets in Q2.
Ya the weather looks close
I know Massa doesn’t like the rain but that’s very good from Stroll in difficult conditions.
Vettel needs to find something or he’ll end up at worse a P3 which will be tough tomorrow
It will dry a bit though
Stroll P5… Must be used to driving in the wet, being Canadian. Like how British drivers are generally quite handy in the wet.
I think Stroll is Billionairese, not Canadian
I think living in a rainy country only makes you more aware of the dangers and driving more cautiously, rather than helping to learn driving fast and at the limit.
Even more impressive is that Williams is usually really bad in the wet. Stolll is also too often concidered really poor. Williams has also been dreadful in recent races. That must have been quite some lap by him.
Stroll was the fastest by 2 secs in last year wet Spa race. He s always fast on wet condition
The good news for Red Bull is they should be able to get into Q3 on intermediate tyres, meaning they can still have a free tyre choice tomorrow after their penalties, when they would otherwise have had to use old slick rubber.
Really hoping they manage to squeeze F2 in! Should be a nutty race.
Interesting tyre choices
STR, Red Bull, Hulkenberg, and at least one FI on full wets.
Think both FI’s were. Will be an interesting session.
Drift-master Vandoorne.
Bahahahahahha!!!!
Inters
stroll really is looking good here
Just noticed Vettel has the italian flag on the helmet today. Any pics for any chance Keith?
RAI 2sec down. Now Kimi fans will come to defense with car issues
Ricci on wets at the end in 8th. Surely a mistake.
I take it back. 7th.
I was gonna ask about Alonso but he’s out
Why do Fernando stay in so long
Vandoorne did well just a Stroll again
Any reason for strolls performance ?
Well, Massa is also up there, so Williams seems to not have their usual wet troubles, and also I guess he’s genuinely doing a good job. Good to see!
2 thousands between the FI rivals. All the difference made.
Rip Hulkenberg then… has a 10-place grid penalty anyway so doesn’t matter.
Both Mercs used new inters. Why are Ferrari saving inters for dry race?
Saving the engine most likely than actually saving the tyre
No they kept circulating
Saving them for Q3 rahter, I’d say.
Gonna be interesting Q3!!!!
Got a cheeky £1 on a Stroll Pole Position. Here’s to fingers crossed ;)
who s out in Q2?
Perez, Hulkenberg, Kvyat, Sainz and Alonso
Was his last private test wet?
Sorry was about Stroll
Ocon in Q3, Pérez out in Q2: Mexico is on fire!
Stroll for pole !
Whom did you put as your sole non-Merc/Ferrari 5th guy in the PREDICTION championship guys?? I put Ocon and it look fine for me for now :D
Rain increases.
Not sure about doing inters… rain’s a-coming, they’ll need to get on with it.
Looks like full wets.
that was a blunder for both Vet and Ham with inters…. might cost them dearly
Ferrari look really bad, not great
Um… Ferrari?
something unexplainable is happening there
Maybe they have set up a beast for dry race
I’m pretty sure the Mercs did the same, frankly. So not so plausible
Yeah, my thoughts exactly.
I’m guessing Red Bull strategically chose to take penalties at this race because theoretically this is their weakest circuit…
Nice slides by Max.
Interesting that Mclaren is nowhere with their supposedly top chassis.
Stroll on the front row after penalties!!!
Hamilton sets pole record.
Immense qualifying from him.
Shout outs to Stroll and Ocon, and to the Red Bulls drivers despite the penalties.
Yeah mate, top job from everyone. Poor job from Ferrari though.
It’s a great qualy… but I am in shock with Ferrari Q3 performance… what a let down
So HAM, STR 1st row, with OCO, BOT 2nd.
Dang! I was joking about Stroll on Pole, but I wasn’t far off :D :D
Haha, excellent work!
First time Stroll impresses. Great and unexpected.
Bottas has a poor middle sector. Stroll 2nd, Ocon 3rd on the grid. Well.
Thumbs up for Stroll, Ocon!
Ferrari not working on wets
They were the only ones not changing them at the end. Typical weird ferrari decisions
What a lap from Hamilton !
Ok now……… I wasn’t suppose to watch this quali for 4 hours…
they say that conditions like that show the drivers with talent….. so are those that say lance stroll has no talent & isn’t very good going to shut up now?
They also show who uses a full wet setup and who not…
He showed good stuff today but 1 good performance in more than half a season aint gonna win over all the doubters.
Massive credit to Hamilton, Stroll, Ocon and Verstappen! Great efforts in terrible positions :)
yeah, all of them really did well today. Great driving
And Daniel
*Conditions
is this the first time this season Ferrari start from 3rd row? At home race… pathetic
They are so lucky red bull have penalties !
Most exciting Q3 of the season!
I’d rather see the Force India in P2, but top job, Stroll!
Ferrari should be thankful that RB have the penalties. Not sure how much wing they have on their cars but they were slower than Williams pair in the mid sector.
Tomorrow should be interesting. Gotta take the FI and Williams away quickly if they are to have a chance.
Stroll to divebomb Hamilton into turn 1 just because
Top drawer performances from all in the top 5. Shame the Red Bull won’t get to reap the reward of that.
Really poor from Ferrari. They at least inherit some places from Red Bull, but in Ocon and Stroll they have two of the fastest cars in a straight line starting ahead. It’ll be hard to get past them…
Mind you, not sure if I’d want to be on pole with two audacious youngsters with everything to prove and nothing to lose immediately behind me. Should be an interesting start tomorrow!
Now let’s see if we can get Formula 2 going!
Well, I’d gather Ocon will want to show maturity, and match his teammate’s podium from Monza, so that might be okay …
This turn out to be worth a wait….
I don’t think anyone can match the highs and lows that Stroll seems to be having this year. Starting second after failing Q1 in 4 of 5 of the previous races!
How long will Stroll and Ocon be able to keep Bottas and the Ferrari-drivers behind, and will Both Mclaren’s and Verstappen’s car last the entire race distance?
It’s HAMMERTIME!
hello everybody from Malaysia..Go Hammer!
This looks like a good oppertunity for the Saubers. Ericsson starts in the top 10 and his team mate just behind. They both got moved forward 8 places! That is a bigger advantage than lots of the penalties actually peanalised lots of the other drivers. See how long they can last this high up on the grid.
Hello everyone and welcome to F1 Fanatic Live for today’s Italian Grand Prix.
The race will get going once the stewards are done giving everyone penalties.
You are awarded a 116 grid spot penalty for complaining about the stewards!
Oh, wow, I did see penalty for Grosjean yesterday, but Vandoorne and Perez too? Did Vandoorne have trouble or did McLaren think 10th wasn’t enough to get points? Man.
Very interested to see what goes on at Ferrari today is Vettel doesn’t get ahead of Raikkonen at the start.
Well, after the pitstop, he’s most likely past anyway, isn’t he?
I’m looking forward to what Bottas can do too.
Well while signing contract they must have informed RAI what he needs to do rest of this season
Pretty sure that if the first lap doesn’t get Seb ahead, the pitstops will defenitely do it.
Who of Bottas, Vettel, or Stroll will be first out of corner 2?
Bottas.
Lewis must be delighted to have Stroll and Ocon next to him of the start. Good thing noone ever gets overexcited and goes in too hot to the first chicane at Monza.
I think they’ll behave themselves. They’ve generally been pretty good this year (even Ocon despite all the hype around the Perez incidents).
Since Perez is nowhere near Ocon, I think he will be fine :-) And Stroll has really been doing his best to avoid being hit in the last races
I just discovered that F1 is no longer behind the paywall in my country. Glory!
:-) great news!
Thank you, I could sing!
That’s something to celebrate indeed. Enjoy the race!
Result! Which country?
what feed are they giving?
F1 Live Timing doesn’t have South Africa as an option, so for today I’m Botswanan.
When the tweenagers running the teams’ Twitter feeds realise the front row of the grid is HAM STR we’re going to get a lot of .gifs of hamsters.
LOL, ugh. yeah.
It wont be as good as BUT GRO PER
kakakakaka i’d love to see that
Magnussen out of Q1 but start 9th..Wow
Good morning all.
Good day :)
For Sainz, Verstappen, at least Kvyat is well ahead of them so won’t come and torpedo them :-p
Verstappen’s engine will give up anyway as soon as he gets close to the top 5-6.
Enjoy the race everyone! This is going to be an intense start…
So, a glum or happy Ferrari garage today?
Lance’s sister is hot.
Ooh that’s not what Vettel wanted.
He is still running. That’s better.
Hehe the Finns at it again.
Omg Kimi…..
Valtteri has Kimi.
…and Lance!!!
Max not being able to bully people. Karma.
Typical Massa, can never bring himself to leave room for another car. That was completely avoidable.
A shame
VER makes a mess himself this time
Great Verstappen is out. Massa is slamming into everything he sees in that chicane. First Perez and then verstappen.
“I can’t stand F1 anymore, it won’t let us fans see Verstappen’s true potential”
Seems Massa caused quite a bit of mayhem already in that 1st chicane.
Vettel having a wobble there into the last corner.
Who said Vettel needed a pitstop or teamorder to pass Kimi?
Vettel’s cruised into third easily, shows the huge gulf between the big three teams and the rest.
Will be interesting to see how long Ocon can stay near him now.
I dont see Riccardo or Kimi cruising easily into third.
Ocon can’t stay with Vettel, but looks like both Stroll and Ocon can maintain position ahead of RAI, MAS, so Ricciardo will have trouble getting higher than 5th I think.
Ricciardo’s overtaken seven cars since lap one. Raikkonen has a handling problem.
But Massa might be more difficult, he’s a strong defender with good straightline pace.
Really nice work from Vettel so far, now for the big test
Stroll well able to keep Ocon’s DRS isn’t he?
Kimi has to finish 4th. Would be a shame otherwise.
I’d rather see Ocon or Stroll in 4th!
He’s getting them in the pits one way or the other.
Raikkonen was told to get close to Ocon and Stroll before pitting, he;s pretty much done that, so let’s see if we get an early stop from him.
There we go.
Palmer cut the chicken…
Good for Palmer, I’d say.
Stroll needs to get Ocon
Important for Vettel to be close to Bottas. In case the softs given an advantage to the Red Team.
Surely Ocon pits now to cover Raikkonen if possible and undercut Stroll?
And that’s two out of two :-)
Vettel falling behind Bottas.
Ricciardo on the brink of Perez’ DRS
Nice moves, well done again Ricciardo
That move from Ricciardo was incredible. Pulled a 2014 once again.
Ricciardo, once again keeping his nose clean and on for a good result.
Post-race interviewer bracing himself for a shoey.
Williams fail their record pitstop under real pressure. >4sec for Stroll.
ah, man, the one pitstop where it counts and Williams have a slow pitstop.
When are we going to get rid of this DRS. I’m waiting years and years for something to happen to watch cars go side by side at Monza again without one of them having a huge overspeed advantage.
I sit and watch this race and this is all I can think about. The tradegy of DRS. That and Kvyat being on fire.
I think considering, those 5s for Palmer are a bit harsh. I do understand Alonso being disappointed, but still.
My goodness Vandoorne can’t compete
I dislike the 5s penalty so much.
Think it’s only a matter of time until Raikkonen gets Ocon. The Force India’s not so great on its tyres, later in the stint he’l be vulnerable. May be wise to avoid fighting Raikkonen and use his DRS to keep Stroll behind.
Ocon has grown on me since Canada, love that kid
Why can’t Vettel keep up with the Mercs? Engine? Aero? Tyres?
Ocon has no DRS. Kimi has. He has to get him now. Come on Kimi!
I don’t think I’ve ever mentioned this before but I’m not that fond of DRS.
I am in favor of DRS now :-)
So Hamilton is now about a pitstops worth ahead of Vettel, right? And no issues on tyres, not quite the excitement I’d have hoped for!
Ricciardo on softs faster than Vettel on Supersofts. What the heck went on with Ferrari this weekend?
RIC 1/2 sec faster. 30 laps to go. Could catch up 15 secs. is 16 secs behind. In with a chance of 3rd.
We can only hope!!!!
Fernando is so miserable this year, sad to see
He was happy in May
Ya i hope he does it again next year
He should take a year out, drive a couple of Indy races, and position himself as best he can for 2019 for one last go at the elusive 3 titles.
I love how fast this race is. 39 minutes in and it’s half-distance!
Good, I’m yawning right now…
Finally! This will give Ferrari some data.
That’s such an F1 fan thing to say :-)
Ferrari in an island now. Merc too far, rest too far behind as well. Searching for optimism.
Interesting stint coming up with Ricciardo going to the SS and Vettel on to the Softs.
1.3 faster and he was behind for 10 laps or so? SMH!
And there is a ripple of applause as Kimi presses a button and drives around Ocon. Ok, I’ll shut up now!
What tyres is Perez on actually?
Vet faster than Ricciardo. Relieved sigh!
Just as I post this, Ric does a PB.
Want to see Ric and Vet slug it out for the last couple of laps!!!
No TV coverage of Mercs. I’m sure they don’t mind too much.
Why is F1 so dull?
Not everyone is finding it dull. Maybe you could tell us why you think it’s dull and then there might be some discussion?
Minimal excitement and average racing. I just watched an incredible GP3 race and F1 hasn’t even touched that excitement.
If Stroll would only have some bal*s to brake slightly later….
Ham pits
Stroll is a bit too cautious I feel.
BOT going purple
Ric and Kimi post identical times.
Nice gap for Vettel, no, they had to bc. of Perez I’d say.
OMG honda..
So that’s what an actual ‘no power’ looks right. Okies!
here comes alonso: emberassing gp2 engine comments :)
Max clumsy today.
impatient i d say as usual
ah VAN came first with no power comment
Ricciardo going very long, but his pace is still good. Must be aiming to have a massive final sprint to chase Vettel.
Who can complain the most this race. Grosjean or Alonso?
Alonso wins the moaning race… just, but Grosjean wins the the championship by a country mile.
BOT lead a lap during pit stops, right?
Lap chart shows Bottas leading a lap.
Mclaren Renault with full orange livery…
they should change the tone of that car to more brownish :) hue
Hahahahhahahaha Alonso
karma..haha
Genuinely laughed out loud at that Alonso Palmer radio message.
What did alonso say?
See the Tweets on the right
Where is Alonso now? P15 Karma :D
FOM have shown more shots of the tv camera helicopter than the Mercs! :)
Only the helicopter is faster than Mercedes.
Ricciardo might just run out of laps to get a shot at Vettel.
what are the chances of mercs lapping one ferrari?
Not happening. Gap too big.
Vettel had an off? 1.27 last time.
probably a backmarker at a bad moment
yeah. Had a 1:25 next time.
Alonso is P15 Karma!
I suspect no podium for RIC. But RIC performance in race versus his more highly rated teammate VER must cause some to rethink. I’d want VER in my sprint car, not sure about F1
Why would anyone rethink. This is exactly like all the previous races. The only difference is that Verstappens car is actually running so Ric can finally get some laps ahead of his teammate.
I’m a Ricciardo fan, but with Verstappen dropping right to the rear, and the damage he suffered early, I wouldn’t regard this race as too significant.
It might well be a good learning experience for Verstappen on dealing with adversity mentally, absolutely.
Wow! Daniel on Kimi!!!1
go Ric!
man, that was quick! Ricciardo definitely candidate for DotD,DotW
of the day maybe. But he did get beaten by Max on saturday earlier in the weekend
okay, I’ll give you that :)
This feels like one of those races where a last-lap engine blow-up changes everything…
Lewis is down on power
Was it here or hockenheim where Kima ended up crying in the woods?
mika*
Lol
Stroll will have a good fight, Perez is on the way too
Don’t jinx it!
But seriously, Merc apparently haven’t been using full power for much of the race.
wow! RB car catching a ferrari in a power circuit with a lemon engine!
This is such a messy race for Ferrari.
If McLaren Renault isn’t competitive with RBR sparks are going to fly. Alonso will turn his radio wrath on McLaren chassis: “this McLaren pig, it’s like driving a truck!”
Renault ain’t supplying McLaren in the first place.
You think not, eh. Wait until this week and you’ll learn.
They have told they can’t do a 4th team now.
Torro Rosso out (honda), McLaren in…. 3 teams
So boring
Some good drives though, a boring F1 race is better than anything else on tv
hear hear
The Red Bull really is very good on the breaks, isn’t it (or both drivers good on them?)
both of those
The SS tires.
That too, I guess!
I’m confused, I thought Ferrari was a better car than Mercedes. That’s what Toto and Lewis said.
Ever since Canada, Mercedes have enjoyed a 2011 Red Bull advantage over the field.
Back to 2016 again for Mercedes…They untouchable right now….
Watch Mercedes destroy Ferrari in Singapore
If not for grid penalties Ferrari wouldn’t even have a possible podium today I think!
Indeed. Both Red Bulls would be far ahead fighting for P2 with Bottas or something
Why haven’t Williams tried a switch with Massa and Stroll.
Same thing as with Perez not listening to requests to look into let Ocon by – look who pays the bills
FI and Williams trying to be worse than each other :-)
At least the Williams aren’t banging wheels with eachother over those spots. I guess Massa with all his experience is more apt to play wingman though than a driver like Ocon with all still to prove
$45 million
Engine failure for Ricciardo please! …and I’ve got a maximum race score in the prediction champ’ship.
It would be nice to see LeClerc in a Haas next season, wonder how his moaning is?
He wasnt that happy today.
Damn is Winter coming to Italy?
I’d say Williams award Stroll for the qualifying, evered7.
True. But if they can get more points than FI, it helps the overall picture doesn’t it?
Nice to see Kevin and Verstappen batteling. Some action.
I think Williams had better keep Massa behind Stroll, to defend them both.
exactly, makes sense.
And also rewards Stroll for that great qualifying too.
A race with good atmosphere, but a boring race…
Ferrari 22 seconds behind Mercedes after 36 laps. Nice.
there goes alonso..double honda failures….again
Isn’t it funny how they always have a problem on the penultimate lap?
They are just saving the engine a bit, calling off an effort that wouldn’t bring them anything anyway. That engine can probably go another race or even two (although it is never going to be a great powerfull engine!)
Might be, in 14th, there is very little to gain I guess.
huh finaly, alonso retired :)
So, that’s both 3.7 spec engines retired then?
Alonso aint running 3.7?
hm, no you are right, they kept that to have it retire from Singapore. Well that’s something to look to then!
Double McHonda retirement. Doh. Wonder if there’s a contractual number they’re trying to reach!
Williams in a FI sandwich. Would be pretty fun if Perez gets both Williams.
That a quick Ok, sound he really want to get out of that car….
Morning all, just joining. What’s the order?
Vet just turned up engine I guess
Oh, Massa having a go! Nice one Felipe
nice battle of W and FI
Ferrari nowhere this weekend, expect them to bounce back at Singapore.
indeed. They must be really happy that Red Bull took the engine penalties. Oh, and Vettel DID go off that one lap he was really slow!
That was Kimi
Nope @nin13, Vettel mentioned that he probably damaged the car a bit and turned down the engine after he had a small off. Said that on the radio to the team after finishing.
Over 30 sec behind the Mercedes…Ouch
Verstappan will never win title with that kind of driving. Collided with 3 cars. Ricciardo on other hand consistent and makes decisive moves. I think top teams will look at RIC before VER.
Driver of the day: Fernando Alonso.
For sure, his best race ever.
Karma…
Good race, but the F2 race was so much better.
What’s the big ‘si’ banner that some people have opened up? A referendum or something?
There is a referendum in Lombardia region to convert it in Autonomous Region like Aosta
Very good race from Bottas too. Quickly got into 2nd and then kept a solid distance to Hamilton to the end. Shame about Strolls slow pitstop, I think that had he kept ahead we could have had a bit more action between Ocon and him.
great session as always, thanks keith and mods..see you guys in 2 weeks
Ferrari need to calm down and get to maximize the advantage in Singapore. If they can give some extra ice creams to Kimi to get him make some moves in the race, that will help as well.
I don’t think we can expect anything fancy from Kimi the Vettel understudy @evered7. Maybe if he can really race he might give it all his energy.
I get it that he doesn’t fight Vettel much. But he never took Ocon and Stroll today. Which was in the end a disaster as he was easily caught by Ric and passed for 4th.
The real driver of the day: Daniel Ricciardo.
Thanks as always for joining in guys, more coming up on F1 Fanatic soon, give your verdict in Rate the Race here:
Hello everyone and welcome to F1 Fanatic Live for the Belgian Grand Prix! First practice coming up in just under ten minutes.
Ah, so they are testing the Halo again in FP1 then.
Problems straightaway for Alonso. I’m surprised.
The familiar sound of Alonso complaining about the Honda engine. F1 is back!
The summer break only finish five minutes ago and already Alonso’s car’s broken down…
Massa overdoing it there? Good to see he seems ok, but hi car is not
That just looked like a silly mistake by Massa.
Any close-ups from Massa’s special helmet? What is he celebrating?
Is it just me or are the comments ordered the wrong way around @keithcollantine? – with the oldest comments on top, and the newest down below
nvm its back to normal already
Yeah there was a slight error on the page, once you refresh it, it should look OK again.
I have to admit I’m already growing used to the halo. Pleased to see that you can still distinguish the drivers helmet both close up and at a distance and actually the halo kind of disappears in the long shots.
But i still think it would be great if the Halo’s mirror the driver helmets (colouring) too – although not for Red Bulls all interchangeable helmet designs or the FI all pinks!
Good idea. Unfortunately I think the sponsors will stake their claim as always.
I don’t think that looked like it should have happened. I don’t see how the kerb could make him loose it like that. At leased it is just practice!
It’s curious that so far Massa has only referred to his illness in Hungary as vertigo. This obviously the symptom, but what’s the underlying cause? And is there any chance it could be related to the crash he’s just had on his first push lap after getting back in the cockpit?
Does make you wonder, doesn’t it
I will be surprised if williams retains him for next year.
My guess would be some ear infection that sort of lames the balance organs in one ear?
Top 3 on three different tires. Bodes well for Vettel setting the time on the hardest compound.
Make it top 6.
Now Alonso has a DRS problem too…
Let’S hope he is just gradually ticking off his bucket list of issues during the friday and will than have a solid saturday and we can enjoy a great sunday from him :-)
Well, seems that Alonso might be looking forward to having some fun with the car, good lap from him
RIC sets the fastest lap which is only 10th away from last years Pole Position time set by ROS
1.46.656, last year’s pole position time beaten already, and we are just in practice 1
The King of Spa has turned up. Kimi hundredths away from P1.
looks like Mercedes might be having a bit of a tricky time making their tires last for more than one lap, might make a different strategy from them than the likes of RBR and Ferrari too then.
They also have less of the ultrasofts too, so indeed, probably going a bit differently.
Nearly halfway through first practice and still no radio messages from Grosjean complaining about his brakes. What’s going on? He’s definitely on track, he’s done eight laps.
May be his radio has a problem now :)
That must be it!
Verstappen changed the colouring of his helmet a bit? More coppery instead of the old orange
McLaren having problems with their DRS not closing properly – bit of a worry at a track this quick.
Man, these cars are quick around Spa. Will pole time go below 1:44? Low 1:44’s surely are in the cards.
yeah, unless it does rain, we are probably going to be somewhere around 1:44, either slightly above or a just below IMO
Pretty quiet session so far.
And there’s our first Grosjean complaint!
so they’ve repaired his radio then :-)
Bottas crashes getting out of the way :)
that looked a bit clumsly yeah
So Bottas just beat Lewis’ time using the softs vs SS during Hamilton’s run. It seems Mercs do have quite a bit of pace in hand…
Track improvement. Ocon beat Vettel’s time on softs as well.
oh, and then Lewis shaves another second off… 1:45.555
As mentioned on C4, I’m pro-third car. For the teams that can afford to field an extra car, young drivers could be provided opportunity not presently available to them. McL/Fer/Mer/Ren/Red +1 = 25 cars. Exciting new talent, bolstered grid. Excluded from constructors points, but eligible for drivers championship.
it’s a terribly bad idea. It would enhance the divide between the “bit teams” and the rest even more, hollow out the means of existance for the smaller teams and be an open invite to abuse of drivers to hurt others in races. Please no.
Opinions certainly divided!
just look how third cars brought us 4-6th car “top teams” in the likes of Nascar, Indycar, DTM etc. Are those championships better for it?
Well, I’m open to suggestions to tackle the shrinking field size, manufacturers disappearing to other series, and lack of available seats for young drivers.
I think more collaboration between teams should be allowed. Top teams will always be top teams, but remember when Sauber looked like a last year Ferrari and was actually competitive, allowing the driver talent to shine? I see no harm in customer teams, this also helps with the budgets issue – top team gets some of the development money back, while the client team doesnt have to spend money developing every aspect of the car.
The solution is taking some of the money that now goes to Ferrari, Red Bull and Mercedes just to show up and use it to guarantee a basic budget of about 80-100 million for everyone. That way a smaller team can count on having a budget for engines, chassis and drivers and some development, making it easier to build upon and get partners on board.
I’m not a fan because it will massively increase the huge advantage the wealthy teams already have. I don’t want yet more complicated rules (e.g. defining what a ‘young driver’ is). And it would also allow them to skew the drivers’ championship by bringing in extra cars to hold up their rivals. It would be a step towards mimicking the DTM’s deeply flawed model.
Not necessarily complicated. Designated third car = ineligible for constructors points. I don’t see what’s criminal about that, considering there are far worse candidate regulations deserving of the ‘convoluted’ tag.
What would stop Ferrari putting Vettel, Kimi And Verstappen in? And Mercedes getting Lewis, Bottas and say Alonso as a third. Then Red Bull would have Ricciardo, Sainz and Kvyat? And the first runner up would probably be the only apart from them in the top 10 gaining points for the ‘drivers. Ferrari doesn’t care much about the constructors championship. And a driver is clearly only in it for the drivers’
There certainly are, that’s no justification to create more bad rules though.
First practice is done, here’s the report including each driver’s best time by tyre type: https://www.racefans.net/2017/08/25/2017-belgian-grand-prix-first-practice-result-fp1/
Second practice is coming up in five minutes. Will Raikkonen be on top again?
Grosjean’s DRS is stuck open, LOL.
And Magnussen’s, bizarrely. And McLaren had problems with it in first practice too.
Radio interference or problem with the FIA transmitter that enables it?
Chassis change for Massa?
Chandhok mentioned that they were wheeling in a new one to build up at the end of FP1 this morning, so almost certainly that is the case
Yes they have.
Looked like a harmless crash with a bit of carbon fibre damage. They were mentioning lot of G’s though. Tough for Massa and the crew.
Looks like the Mercedes is really liking those soft tyres a lot more than the softer tyres
Or maybe it is just that Hamilton is on it
These cars are beautiful at this track.
And Hamilton is flying
A bit dirty driving from K-Mag again. He just brake-checked Perez on a straight-line without any apparent reason.
Fair play to Palmer, that’s a decent lap compared to Hulkenberg. In fact he was fractionally quicker through the middle sector.
2 tenths in a tight midfield on one of the longest tracks is pretty decent yeah.
Vettel or Kimi cannot get caught behind the RBs in the race. Either stay ahead of them or clear them quickly on the basis on what is going on in FP2.
Mercedes, Ferrari and Red Bull are miles ahead of the rest
Is Ericsson missing the T-wing? I can see the stalk, but not the top bit on his car
This reminds me: I must re-read the regulations on wet weather standing start procedure and try to understand them this time!
The cars already look much better without their T wings!
Thanks for joining in guys – here’s the second practice report:
https://www.racefans.net/2017/08/25/hamilton-top-rain-halts-second-practice/
And remember to get your predictions in before qualifying. This weekend’s best prediction wins a copy of F1 2017 which is out today!
https://www.racefans.net/2017/08/25/win-codemasters-f1-2017-by-making-your-belgian-gp-predictions/
Hello everyone and welcome to F1 Fanatic Live for the final practice session for this weekend’s Belgian Grand Prix.
Was there a gap that (the cockpit wraparound) that anyone noticed when Ham got into the car?
I already miss Massa’s normal helmet!
judging by sector times, looks like Vettel went for a low drag setup, while kimi got a bit more downforce
Looks like Kimi is really on it this weekend. Looking good!
Palmer is on fire today
No wonder, he got Kubica breathing down his neck
– But you said Kubica will be on the track today?
– He is. He’s in Palmer’s head.
What are the chances that today Palmer will outqualify Hulkenberg?
Certainly looks on the card. He was running well yesterday too.
True. Would be great to see him do it really. Overdue, but still great.
I predict the pole time will be 1:43.031 (should qualifying stay dry throughout). Either in the low 43s or high 42s.
I went for a high 42, but that 150 mph average being broken seems indeed very likely
Does Kimi have a chance? The betting companies do not agree so! Hamilton is certainly a massive favourite. Why?
<<<< Oh dear. Massa really did leave his glasses at home…
There are 6 tracks that really matter in F1. Spa, Monza, Silverstone, Monaco and Brasil.
What’s the 6th?
The one where you win the championship
Suzuka?
You win!
Monaco?! It’s a joke GP. Silverstone – nah. Suzuka – yes.
Don’t mess with Monaco!
No! Something wrong with Kimi’s car!
That would be typical, but sad
Looks very likely that Bottas will be 4th today. On all but 1 occation this year, he’s been 3rd or above. His average qualifying position is actually slightly better than Hamilton due to Hamilton’s slump in Monaco.
His pace just looks a little low at the moment.
Wow, Vandoorne threaded a needle at 190mph between 2 slow cars througth Blanchimont
…and beat Alonso’s time…
Palmer .3s ahead of hulk
Bet Keith is chuffed Ferrari are screwing Kimi over, again
Don’t think you can win a bet against Keith. He own a bet column.
Think Ferrari and Merc will go SS tyres in Q2
looks like they could even use softs and still go through
So that’s why Alonso want to be in Williams. They look like ready to be the backmarker team…
ferrari deciding to save some tyres? memories of past explosions, i guess.
Hello, my fellow hard rockin’ F1 geeks!
Palmer’s broken down again.
Palmers luck is just so bad!
WOW thats impressive
incredible lap
and Vettel, well done when it mattered
Well that was a letdown.
What a time by Ham. I wasn’t expecting the pole time to be in the mid-42s.
Maybe Raikkonen could have nabbed pole if he didn’t screw his lap up.
He didn’t screw his lap.
He did.
got traffic
He did.
How come the renault has gotten so much better then force india? is renault best of the rest by mid season?
I think that since that new floor, they got a lot better. If they don’t break down.
because Renault (instead of team “Lotus/Toleman/whatever” Enstone)?
Palmer’s luck, though. And Kimi’s.
conversely, Seb’s tough.
VET: “Kimi gave me a nice tow to get on to the front row”
Might as well do the intro before Keith comes on xP
Welcome to F1 Fanatic’s (paraphrase my) (not-so) official coverage of the 2017 Belgian Grand Prix, where Vettel wins, Alonso gets plaudits, and Crofty and Brundle make conspiracy theories about Ferrari’s plans to wreck Kimi’s race for Vettel!
Peace lol
LOL.
Good day :)
And I forgot to mention, give their completely unbiased opinion on why Hamilton is the GOAT.
Have to agree with DC on calling it bullocs, Honda not thinking like races on the Alonso’s honda being confused about where he was on track and not giving him the power he needed while in his ultimate quali lap (CH4)
Agreed, I’d expect an engine supplier in F1 to have at least that ounce of sense.
exactly. I still don’t know if Alonso should be a bit reasured about hardware not breaking down, or furious and losing lots of confidence in Honda for being so senseless as to let this happen.
How’s the weather in Spa today?
Looks quite sunny.
So 50% chance of rain then.
LOL
Why can’t they have COTDs from the live updates? Priceless xD
hello from Malaysia
hi :-)
Will both Mclaren’s last the whole race.
Ah, the Dutch…eh Belgian circuit with a majority of Dutchies (80%) in the audience, looking out for MAX.
Hello everyone, it’s almost time for round 12 at Spa – will Mercedes or Ferrari prevail today? Or might Red Bull pull off a shock?
Expect RedBull to use US-SS-US tyres
You think both cars will go with that?
Maybe US-SS-SS for Daniel
It probably is the fastest way to go, so why not.
Hello from India
Don’t count out Bottas yet…biased skysport
Good morning
Mega start by Alonso.
alonso!! woohoo
Nostalgic fight between Ocon, Hulk, Alo.
Those first few laps without DRS were great! Awesome racing.
Hear, hear…
what can you say about Alonso
What can u say other than shame…shame in this honda engine
Woah, that was a big hit Ocon got himself there from Perez, a bit optimistic move, but he somehow squeezed through.
They forgot Baku after summer break. :)
Amazing that the suspension is in one piece
Honda should get out of this embarassement right this minute , someone should call them in japan to tell them to pack their bags right this minute
Cars flying past Honda… They should quit right now
Another failure for Verstappen?
Verstappen :(
Who said Palmer was unlucky?
In front of the orange grand stands! This is terrible.
DRS is a joke, Alonso puts his talent up to 7th then DRS blows past his pathetic Honda giving him zero chance to defend
No need of DRS for passing Alonso
what, Verstappen, no! :(
you got to feel sorry for Verstappen
So Alo and Ver might compete for Bottas’s seat at Merc.
For 2019 maybe
I can’t see Bottas leaving Merc anytime soon
He has a 1 year contract
I know but right now I think he has exceeded the expectations
Agree. But still, ALO and VER are major talents.
I kinda see this coming…..feel bad for the Dutch fan
Verstappen 6th dnf…..no comment
Unlucky driver of the day for 6 race now
I apologise to Max Verstappen for including him in my predictions again. Each time I do that with a Red Bull driver this year, they seem to retire by no fault of their own.
Engine builders are in F1 to promote their brand, right? Mercedes OK, Ferrari OK, Renault really?, Honda anit-promotion.
Bottas has earned another year at Mercedes if he wants it, imho.
Unless they can help Verstappen break his contract, and take him, I’d say.
I doubt Mercedes would do that, because that will cause massive stress in the team, ham and ves together? Bottas delivers what they need for the championship and helps ham without saying a word….
redbull should be ashamed by now
What a joke
Well, not sure what it was, but engine not quite Red Bull’s thing?
Really poor from Bottas and Kimi today so far.
That’s what I was thinkinh
Not sure which driver (in front running and middle teams) in recent times has had 6 DNFs even before the European leg was over..
Do Bottas and Kimi have the same parts on their cars as their teammates?
Kimi is probably held up by Bottas at this stage
Kind of wish Ferrari had been a bit more aggressive here, pitted Vettel early to put his new ultra-softs on, tried a two-stopper. At least put Mercedes under a bit more pressure.
I expected them to pit Kimi first now – but that yellow flag investigation for him isn’t good.
BOT pits
Hamilon way faster on softs
VET pits
That was a nice threading the needle from Perez, but then he got off track and will have to give something back, I’d expect
Great move
Now there’s a gamble from Red Bull!
what are they doing?
ah, saw your tweet of rbr radio now, going to supersofts with Ric, interesting.
Hamilton is clearly flying as he s been. This whole weekend
And Kimi dissapoints again. He cant even be a number 2.
Nothing he could have done there with older tyres and DRS.
Bad strategy right there matr
yep
What strategy, hes one pitstop behind in pace after 15laps and cant even defend for 5sec.
Vettel and Hamilton both are already a pitstop ahead of their teammates! Those two are really something else.
Another podium for Bottas
now That will drop Kimi down then.
VET is 1.2 secs faster than HAM that last lap?
Same penalty as the one for Vettel for what he did at Baku. WOW!
Good point there. Goes to show how horribly insufficient that penalty was.
I would rather think that Kimi has got an extremely hardh penalty. This should have been 5 seconds or 10 seconds added to race time.
Wow Sebs coming
Can hear BBC at the moment and they’ve got Raikkonen’s penalty wrong – it’s not a time penalty it’s a stop-go, he has to come into the pits.
Kimi 10 sec stop and go pen when u need one, he is really in big trouble now
why is VET so close to HAM?
Hahahaha ICEMAN
yeah, he certainly didn’t lift there.
I think full throttle under double yellow should be a stop and go. No doubt
Grosjean is a woman
Is this a compliment or sexism?
A compliment, he’s a good looking chap and sounds like my wife sometimes
Eh, what does his (or her if you want) gender have to do with racing?
And telling the pitlane about others going off track is something ALL drivers do all the time, because it gives them a direct advantage on track if the other gets penalised.
I almost think Hamilton must have had a small off when Vettel got close to him, since then Lewis has made another 1,5 gap again
yeah, bit odd indeed.
And Perez overtakes by going off the track and get 5 seconds? where is the consistency?
+1, it’s too much.
Where is the consistency between sporting and safety penaltys? There is none and should be none.
Wasn’t everyone complaining about how ridiculous it was that drivers could just ignore yellows? Upping the penalties for it is the direct result.
Safety (yellow flags) infraction does deserve worse penalty than gaining advantage in a fight, but it still is quite harsh.
Dat Droste shot o.O
Alonso s team radio sums up mclaren at the moment….
That speed trap graphic is pretty nice from FOM.
Is Hamilton trying to back up Vettel and hurt is tyres, or their pace is that similar?
From HAM’s radio, I’d say that’s his pace. Vettel might be a bit faster at this stage.
Looks like Hamilton is going as fast as he can, while Vettel might actually have a bit more in reserve.
Don’t know, Bottas is closing on Vettel now
yeah, that is exactly what I meant. Ricciardo is also matching the top 2 now. Vettel cannot go faster because Hamilton is up ahead, getting close to him would ruin his DF and quickly wear his tyres too.
Might be interesting to see whether MErcedes will have to go for a 2 stopper and what will Ferrari do then
Not sure if 2 stopper is faster or not. Ferrari can’t do a 2-stopper as clearing Bottas is not a certainty.
If Hamilton does go for a 2-stopper, he will have the undercut and hence Vettel can’t win after stopping later.
This is very much advantage Hamilton so far.
Especially now that Bottas being faster than hamilton right now. The 2-stopper is definitely not a winning strategy for Ferrari.
I rather meant it not as Mercedes WANTING to do a 2 stopper, but rather feeling forced to go for it if HAmilton keeps being not too happy on the softs.
Even if they are forced to do it, they are still in advantage of winning the race.
I believe that Mclaren with a Renault engine would be ahead of Red Bull…just leave Honda these guys can’t do a thing anymore
Tell that to Max Verstappen – for all we know Max could have been 3rd now. And McLaren with a Honda could have had Alonso camping out there instead of Max.
Im sure Verstappen would trade for a reliable Honda engine.
What’s one of those?
And right on cue….
Anything lasting more than 20% of a racedistance is lucrative to Max ;)
BOT will probably DNF so RIC can get on the podium and people will tel how he is destroying VER this year
Does Verstappen has performance clause as Vettel before breaking contract too?
I have heard that 1) Red Bull has to be in the top 3 as a team (OK), 2) have a winning car (already done too) and 3.) the drivers in the top 5 (or at least one in the top 5 maybe) mean he is locked in.
So basically Daniel lock Max in?
I doubt it, the way he forced himself into F1 his contract is probably on RBs terms.
Before that race win dropped into Ricciardo’s hands, I think he actually might have had a chance of jumping ship.
Doubt it. I read a Horner interview somewhere which said that Vettel got escape clauses in his contract only after winning the 2nd championship in 2011.
Even if he has one where would he go?
Mercedes could still take him, potentially. Would they say no if they had the chance?
Hamilton would.
Max on Dutch tv: you can’t call this bad luck…. this is just bad for a top team.
On the question how long he can take this: not long anymore
Would be funny if he went to McLaren to replace Alonso – Team Orange – and suddenly the Honda would come good and he’d be winning there :-)
Wait, so Perez with a 5s penalty ended up ahead of Ocon after his 2nd stop? how did that happen?
Silly FI
Well, I do think FI was asking for that really.
Oh my
BAM Ocon
Good for him to stand up against Perez
Safety car
YEah, that was clearly Perez fault, should have left space for OCON.
Arguably, it was FI switching up the strategy that put Ocon behind who put them there, and Perez who made it work out like that, as could have been expected.
haha again?
Perez pressed Ocon to the wall
yeah, I’d think we should run the field through the pitlane actually
Aside from Lewis and Seb, these two have been very entertaining to watch though
RAI for the win?
now that would be cool.
Guess not
but not likely :)
SOFT vs US. Merc vs Ferrari
Wait, did VET have a long pitstop, or was that timing off?
Someone like Ross Brawn to control the two drivers is sorely needed at Force India
To be honest, I think they should tell Perez to sit out a race, that almost looked Schumacher vs Rubens material there.
Perez should feel bad.
This should be like candy from a baby for Vettel
Ferrari for the win? Perez clearly for blame
Bottas has a chance at a good tow on Vettel
Its lucky for Force India that Williams are so atrocious at the moment as they’ve squandered points by failing to get their drivers under control since Canada.
So true..
FI really need to do something.. Given VER’s retirements, they could have been closer to Red Bull by now!
ultras for Vettel, Softs for Hamilton
Did Mercedes blown it?
Will be interesting to see how this one goes, doesn’t it.
So now we get another 5 laps of safety car for nothing zzzzz
Hi,
Can someone explain why PER has no penalty?
For how long? Until someone dies?
They’re normally more relaxed between team mates but this one hasn’t been investigated yet.
Let’s give them at least a bit of time to get a good look into it.
Well, the thing is that it’s been going on for some time, and other drivers have also made this kind of move with no penalty. So it will keep increasing…
HAM and BOT on softs but VET on US.. This is advantage Ferrari now!!! Come on Seb!
Hamilton’s message shows he knows this plays into Ferrari’s hands.
Well in the restart it does but lets see who crosses the finishline first.
It’s more the strategy than that.
Clearly, especially with Vettel right behind AND on softer tyres it will be a tough time to keep ahead on the restart.
Perez should feel bad. Words from Ocon were spot on.
You can make a reasonable argument that Ocon should have backed out. Doesn’t really take away from poor team management at Force India that is the main reason these incidents keep happening, they should have dealt with it after Baku and the team, by failing to do so, have reaped the expected rewards for not doing so
The gap was there until Perez started to close it when Ocon was already there next to his tyres
This is going to be good…Vettel and Hamilton may crash mark my words
I agree, this may be some of the best racing we’ve seen coming up here all year
No. Vettel will just drive past on the first lap
did the mercs ran out of Ultras?
yes
OCO was quite more polite than what I would’ve been.
He knows he has no chance now. Shame the safetycar wasn’t really needed. A VSC there would be fine. It was out of a slow corner and cleared up in seconds.
You must have missed that shot with debris all over the run up through eau rouge timmy. They really needed some room to clean that away.
Ferrari to finish 1-2 ?
Kimi is 5th, needs to first get past Ricciardo before he can get even close to Bottas. And Ricciardo also has new US tyres so that will not be as easy for him
The delta time between different compounds isn’t that big like some of past years, so that’s why I had that feeling, with 2012-2013 tires vettel would easy pass Hamilton even with that amazing power from merc PU
Hamilton having a proper sulk here. He knows what the Safety Car means for Ferrari’s chances.
But I won’t count out HAM yet. Remember Bahrain 2014, he kept Rosberg behind while on a slower set. If someone can win this for Mercedes, it is Hamilton.
Safety car with HAM 1st and SEB 2nd. SEB. stay cool. Don’t do a Baku :)
investigation on OCO/PER collision…
Is Bottas sleeping?
Bottas has damage
I don’t think so
yeah, lost only a small bit of his front wing though, shouldn’t hurt him too much
lovely defence from Hamilton. Bottas got mugged there.
okay, that was pretty good
RIC on P3 after Max’s mechanical failure
Where did we see that before
That’s action between HAM & VET!!
So, BOT was Zonta to Kimi’s Hakkinen?
Well as Raikkonen didn’t get past Ricciardo, I’d say no…
Hamilton flying
Engine mode ;-)
No fuel limitations now.
if HAM keeps it, he has to be my DotW
Yep!
No penalty for PER… as usual
A bit of a classic treat of 2017 – Max, running ahead of Ricciardo drops out from his car (or being punted off) and Daniel gets on the podium
while BOT isn’t quite up to it at a crucial moment for him?
indeed!
… and Ocon, PER have a great fight but Perez loses out in fear of being beaten by his rookie teammate?
And Alonso shows some great moves but has to stop the car before the end of the race. The story of 2017 :-)
Yeah this race has been like a highlights reel.
Exactly Keith!
Oco and Perez no further action probably coz they’re team mates
Like Max `10 seconds penalty in Hungary???
indeed.
Good point Jelle. I saw far more malice in this one from PErez than Max not making his braking point there.
VET’s only chance was that first lap :( He missed it :(
Hard words from Jos Verstappen on Dutch tv They need to go around the table. Max’s motivation on the line. He’s clearly quicker than RIC but the car keeps failing.
Yeah, and again engine – also tough for McLaren – Renault doesn’t seem entirely good choice, even though Honda showed some embarrasing issues.
Doesn’t look like Seb will have anything for Lewis.
Perez 3.5 secs off normal pace, but Palmer is too chicken to take him.
He doesn’t have the straight line speed from his Renault engine to take a low drag FI with a mercedes
I take it back, Perez only 1.7sec off, and that was a gutsy move.
Round the outside at 130mph in Fanges.
So ham and vet is 1sec faster than ric but still kimi cant make an attack.
Not even sure he has the motiavation. Then again, Vettel also can’t get close to Hamilton and has softer tyres to help him a bit too.
I don’t understand! Is this Mercedes or is this Hamilton? They are comfortably keeping Seb behind while on tyres 2 steps harder!!
Both
Mercedes works it’s tyres harder. And Vettel has the disadvantage of dirty air behind Lewis. He would have to be 2 seconds faster to have a chance to catch him and make an attempt at passing.
Well its both. Merc straightline speed for a few hotlaps is in a class of its own and Hamilton is riding that beast flawlessly.
I’d say that too, Hamilton nailed restart, then got temp into those softs. Remember, Merc. took out some wing after seeing Ferrari’s S1,S2 Friday speed to defend against overtakes, that might have helped them in the end.
Has Seb given up or is there still one challenge left?
Think he’s done.
loving the soft tyres beating the ultras..
well done lewis..Dotw
Yawn
Perez’s fault.
If you can’t overtake here on softer tyres with DRS in the sport then what chance is there elsewhere?
Ferrari couldn’t pass Merc. Merc couldn’t pass Ferrari. Ferrari couldn’t pass RB.
Yeah, but Daniel did manage to pass Valtteri and Kimi on the restart.
The restarts is a bit different though. Vettel also was really close to making it past, Lewis only just kept ahead
Danny was helped by Kimi being on the other end for Bottas. Else Bottas had the inside line and wouldn’t have had to be too cautious.
Indeed, it meant Bottas couldn’t take the inside of that corner because he still had Kimi there. you could see how even Hulk got right up to Bottas from how he lost momentum there.
Yup. Hulkster was there as well if Bottas had one more cautious corner. Although I guess he would have taken it back in the remaining laps.
yeah, we are back to needing maybe 2,5 seconds speed difference to have a chance to overtake when running on track.
There were a lot of passes, 3 top teams were close, so hard to overtake.
Seems I recall a number 44 going past a number 7 near au rouge
Imagine Raikkonen being concentrated during the early yellow for Verstappen and not having that stop-go, he’d have been on the podium, Ferrari would have made a good indentation in Merc’s WCC lead.
good point.
should’ve, would’ve, could’ve
Seen on Friday that the softs were more than a match for the Ultras. Combine that with the engine mode of Mercedes.
That said, great drive from the top 2. Ricciardo should change his name from Honey badger to the Weasel. Almost every time Max retires, he ends up on the podium.
Kimi should have at least got an attack on Ricciardo. But props to him for doing that move on Bottas.
Happy that the next installment is only a week away.
Did Lewis just tell Seb he never saw that he was close?
Great race from the top 2. Shame Fernando can’t fight with them
Just imagine where Max Verstappen could have been in there too, he might have mixed into the restart to make it even more interesting (although then Kimi would not have had his penalty to drop him down either)
Yeah, would have been interesting; could Max have mixed it in the fight for the win?
Considering that Ferrari seem to have more downforce in the car, I suppose they could go with a very lean wing and yet be able to get the car working on the corners.
Hamilton is great on the brakes but the Ferrari is very comfortable as well. Should be a good race again hopefully.
BOT P5 despite a power and penalty advantage is a disappointment.
The Ferrari looked really good, if they have a good special for Monza, I’d say that could be an interesting fight too.
ok, bye for now everyone. That was quite a good race to kick back into the season, I can only hope that Monza shows us another tight fight between the top 2 (looks like Ferrari could be even closer there!)
Bye and see you for Monza!!
Bye, see you all for Monza indeed.
Thanks very much for joining in everyone, lots more coming up between now and the next race – practice starts in just five days!
Hello everyone and welcome to F1 Fanatic Live for the Italian Grand Prix weekend!
Teams concerned about incoming rain and bringing their run programmes forward.
I don’t see rain coming at the moment: here’s the real time map http://www.centrometeolombardo.com/radar/
And Monza is that MB point
…it’s obviously getting worse fast…
Very dark clouds around the circuit right now. We’re just walking in near parabolica
Few spots now coming down
Mercedes are already eight-tenths up on the best time from first practice last year. They’re going to be close to that all-time track record if qualifying is dry…
They’re down by around 20kph in the braking zone for turn one compared to last year.
Hamilton now a second up on the best from last year.
OK I’m calling it: I think if qualifying is dry we’ll see the 2004 track record fall. That’ll be a new all-time record for fastest ever F1 lap…
What about top speed record and average speed record? Will they fall too? I want them over ~370 Km/h set by Montoya here!
Is it me or are the supersofts not quite giving a huge chunk of extra time? Seems just about .1-.3s?
Hamilton now 1.422s up on the best time from first practice last year. They need to be 1.61s quicker in Q3 to set a new all-time fastest F1 lap. With the extra engine performance Mercedes have in qualifying that should be possible, providing the rain stays away.
McLaren practising their slipstreaming for qualifying.
Kimi on supersofts on a wet track?
Well, he’s saying it is basically dry anyway :)
Thanks for joining in guys, here’s the first practice report:
https://www.racefans.net/2017/09/01/2017-italian-grand-prix-first-practice-result-fp1/
Hello everyone and welcome back to F1 Fanatic Live, second practice is coming up.
That 1’21.406 for Bottas is 1.39s faster than the same in this session last year. Still looking close for a new all-time record lap in qualifying.
Best sector times:
1: 26.976 Raikkonen
2: 27.347 Hamilton
3: 26.854 Vettel
Well, I guess Sainz jr. can join others at the back then.
Would Torro Rosso perhaps think that maybe Honda isn’t too bad, since Renault isn’t making much progress in pace and reliability either?
Kvyat’s problem? related to what happened w. Sainz, or independent Renault failure? guess we’ll hear.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vj-huEG_RDI ; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USkarVwcCEk&t=2s
Sorry for the RB Drivers
Hello everyone and welcome to F1 Fanatic Live for final practice. In theory, at least – heavy rain means we might not see much running…
Start delayed “indefinitely” due to rain.
I guess Vettel wouldn’t mind very much if it kept pouring like this and they had to go by startnumber for the grid :)
McLaren Honda with Van 2 on Pole in Monza, who would have thought
Newbie
Is it just me or does the track look completely driveable? I mean full wets needed for sure, but it’s not looking like a monsoon rain out there.
It’s just you. No way in hell is that anywhere near ready! The Safety Car is going so slow it’s comical.
Looks like it’s wet enough that cars would be aquaplaning on most of the track to me.
I just saw the on-board footage from the safety car. I guess you’re right. That looks extreme!
And Whiting just confirmed that even the SC was aquaplaning at places. But, seems to be easing, so quali will be on a drying track, which might be great.
Track is looking a lot better now.
Anyone know when does the Safety car gets to practice on tracks? Or they just go with the simulator practice itself?
Well, they do laps on Thursdays don’t they? I don’t know if they do more at other times though.
Thank you. It was sliding around lot and looked scary even for a car with all electronic gadgets for help.
The F1 drivers need to use all their experience here.
Must confess I’m surprised they’ve green-lighted this. It doesn’t look massively improved. But perhaps the rain has eased and they’re betting the drainage will have improved the track conditions a lot in ten minutes time. This is an area where they’ve been very conservative in the recent past so perhaps they’ve decided to be a bit bolder.
Ricciardo just demoed how much they will be sliding around :-)
Sainz has been good in his STR when it was wet before, might well be he’s hoping for it to stay damp.
Let ‘s hope wet quali also. Mixed (skilled) grid would be nice.
Kvyat seemed to have his front right not getting any grip as he was breaking for turn 1.
I don’t think Vettel is particularly good in the wet. It’s just, he’s good, so in the wet he can keep it up. With Verstappen, he does shine in the wet, and Hamilton has done so in the past too. Hulkenberg and Sainz too, seem to have something extra they can show in the wet as well.
Bottas has been really good in wet conditions as well. However Verstappen is probably the best of them all.
Quite a pity even the 1st place would still drop him to around 15th.
oh, wait, no Verstappen so far only has 5 for gearbox right? hm, he could get back to 5th then :)
nope, Verstappen DOES have 15 (or was it 10?)
Well that was odd! Here’s the final practice times: https://www.racefans.net/2017/09/02/2017-italian-grand-prix-third-practice-result-fp3/
If quali gets cancelled for some reason it will be an interesting grid.
Go away rain! From all the possible seasons why did it have to hit the one that followed technical regulation changes aiming for a significant lap time improvement from circuit the circuit, LOL.
‘circuit to circuit’
So, heavy rain for quali???
The first time I’m ever disappointed to see rain for qualifying…really wanted to see that lap record beaten!
Yeah it’s a bit of a shame. But if it creates some intrigue in the starting order that’s good too.
looks like it is still too wet to give us any record breaking times from Q3, although it will get almost dry, I think it will be a little off that
Looks like that lap time will stand for another year. 😁👌
Work on Raikkonen’s car, I wonder if they are thinking to put him on a wetter setup, to hedge their bets, while Vettel goes with the setup needed to be able to win the race.
I doubt it, unless the forecasts for tomorrow’s race changed. They’ve been saying it’ll definitely be dry for the past few days.
I know, but isn’t Raikkonen there to be sacrificed? If he could get a wet pole, stop HAM from getting it, well …
With how the start is at Monza, they’d have a better shot with Vettel in P2 next to Hamilton if need be
Wet qualifying, and Hulkenberg has a 10-place grid penalty, so there’s no point taking advantage of his good wet ability… He’ll probably start a max of 15th either way (as 6 drivers have penalties, and he won’t get into the top 4 anyway)… Sigh…
Qualify battle Hulk 11 – 0 Palmer….Ouch
Stupid to count Azerbaijan against Palmer.
Hulk would’ve likely outqualified him there anyway. Though it should be 10-1 because of Spa.
I’d say we shouldn’t count Spa against Palmer either, until the car gave up he had been the faster of the two.
Sigh Brundle. Anything money is nonsense, giving the team a penalty instead of the driver/car means nothing for a team not going for the championship either. And what about “negative points” then? Honestly, I think that apart from the Sky team nobody cares as much about the penalties. In effect it just means they start at the back if they take a new engine. I can see how maybe they would want to halt the trend to even less engines when it already is problematic with the current amount. That is the only thing that does make sense to stop having too many penalties.
Yesterday (this morming?) they had a talk w. Horner where they talked about it – said that very clearly too.
VER gets penalized twice in effect for a PU failure. Doesn’t finish a race then starts way down the grid. Not sure how to make that fairer.
It just means the team has to do a better job of making the car not break down, doesn’t it. In the end, if they build 4 engines that last the season, there will be no penalties, regardless of when they blow.
…and Grosjean into the barrier on the front straight.
But he did set 3rd time for now, for all the good that will do him.
… though having said that, if he can start on the grid, 15th (through Q1, no lap in Q2) would maybe with all the penalties, become 9-11th …
Wow, scary looking. His usual attitude over the radio though.
How does Hamilton do this in the rain? 1st lap – 2 seconds (” seconds) ahead of anyone else. Is this guy born with gills and webbed feet or what?
yes, he is yeah :-)
:-) I mean, TWO seconds in these conditions. How does one even stay ‘cool’ and composed?
Hamilton was the 1st to do a decent lap. The conditions quickly became much worse. That is one of the reasons for the time gaps.
Bottas is 4s slower, with a missed 1st chicane, so …
yeah, I thought Bottas was out first, similar cars..but 4 seconds! And according to my F1 live timing Vettel was s2 whilst Hamilton was still going around.
On my timing HAM set that time before VET got his time in, so maybe that was HAM on 2nd lap then? That chicane BOT missed explains quite a bit of the 4s though, but indeed VET 2s slower.
I suspect this will be a pretty long stoppage…
Grosjean probably driving himself out of any top seats with all those comments.
I get it that it is dangerous and maybe the other drivers are thinking that as well. But he seems to be particularly vocal about it and whiny.
Yeah, giving that the session is now stopped, I’d gather they stopped it a bit too late!
It does get old hearing him sometimes
And FOM could easily let us hear less …
And yet he couldn’t be more strident in his criticism of Halo.
Maybe it’s not the rain Romain, maybe you just can’t drive in the rain. Remember he binned it on the way to the grid last time we had conditions like this.
Is not a rain master that is for sure…
Given that the session was stopped immediately after, I’d say it was hardly driveable or not even that for most cars outside the top 4 cars. Especially with low DF setting for a dry Sunday
when the car aquaplanes in a straight line like that there isn’t much driver skill involved. even the best drivers in the wet have had moments like that.
depending on how long until it stops raining, maybe Haas can still get Grosjean get a shot at it, the car did not look too damaged
Ah, ok, so you aren’t allowed to do that? Shame
on the pits channel with the team radio grosjean was not the only driver coming out with comments like he was.
It fells like Race Control are taking more chances with the conditions today than we’re used to seeing them do in wet conditions. I wonder if part of that is in the hope that the wet weather tyres are better than they were. Grosjean’s crash would suggest not. That wasn’t a driver error, that was aquaplaning in a straight line.
The straight there had quite a bit of water on it too.
Maybe the new pitstraight tarmac is also part of the issue though
How long will they wait before canceling the session (completely)? More than 1 hour?
And yet, the FOM helicopter still flies.
last year we all felt he was too conservative in rain conditions… tough balancing act
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1eY-PuIgSw&feature=youtu.be
hey, thanks-you do a great job getting these excerpts up so fast. Deeplay appreciated :-)
Why aren’t there water vehicles to prep the surface? It’s 2017. Surely sweep the track clear of standing water with a rubber bladed truck is reasonable?
There is nothing more efficient to get the track dry than a couple of F1 cars on wets doing the rounds.
Not when the rain is still falling. And we’re not talking about a mile oval in NASCAR or something, this is almost six kilometres of asphalt.
Standing water is an effect of water not draining away and if it continues to rain a mere sweep of the water will do noting more than a sweep with a drenched towel.
Of course, but a sweep immediately before a session gives the cars a chance to clear a fair amount with their tyres. Don’t want it dry, just driveable
It was driveable and the rain picked up as the session started.
But anyway, handily done by Ericsson for now.
Restart delayed. Next information in 15 minutes.
Conditions don’t look that bad. Are those Pirelli wets that bad?
Its the new tarmac on the pit straight, the water isnt draining off/through it
Well he could have stayed off throttle, I understand he aquaplaned but re applied the throttle.
It sure sounded like he did.
problem is that if you stay off throttle down a straight with poor visibility you could get run over by the car behind. thats what ended didier pironis f1 career at hockenheim in 1982 when prost lifted on the straight & didier couldn’t see him so drive into him. same with brundle & senna at adelaide in 1989.
What’s the forecast for tomorrow? More rain? It may be best to delay qualifying until tomorrow morning then race in the afternoon.
Weather Underground says Clear and Sunny.
Get comfortable guys, this could take a while.
Amateur hour. The track was fine. This is so sad.
It was fine until a crashed car was standing at the runoff area. They have apperently learned from Bianchi.
But no need to delay the session like this now.
Agreed
all the drivers were complaining about aquaplaning on the straight, one car crashed on the straight because of that.
the water isnt draining off the new tarmac on the straight, you cant send cars out under those conditions.
Grosjean reapplied the throttle after his first moment. That’s driver error. It’s stupid to account for driver error.
Ofc. you can a Sauber is top 10 and Grosjean has crashed.
Clearly it wasn’t. Driver after driver on the radio is complaining about aquaplaning.
Just look at Hamiltons lap right there and how many times the best car on the grid, with one of the best wet drivers still struggles over much of the lap, almost lost it on the straight too.
And a struggeling driver is a bad thing because?
Verstappen was on a killer lap..
What was being glued on kimi car?
Don’t buy the argument the track was worsening either because there were drivers going faster than Hamilton. It’s all so conservative
Just give them Bridgestones from tyre war era. They would be going easy :D
WHo knows how they would even hold on with the high torque of the current hybrid engines. The power and acceleration is a LOT more than the V8 ever gave into its axles
The engine torque and the torque on the axels aint the same thing. The new refined “power units” are probably more gentle in the wet than the V8s where.
Depends on when, because they did do quite a bit of traction control too in the V8 days. And the ECU was not homologated that long ago either
Well im not talking about tractioncontrol because that is supposed to be illegal. Im talking about smooth powerdelivery when grip is low.
… but part of the V8 they did have it, that’s the point @bascb was making …
yes, but befor they got the homologated ECU all teams WERE using traction control, that covers the time of the tyre wars, doesn’t it? It IS a crucial difference between the cars then and now @rethla
Well if you are talking about driving in the wet being hard without traction control then i agree and its a good thing, it should be hard.
That has nothing with the torque of the hybrids or aquaplaining conditions to do however.
It means that the cars used with those tyres we spoke about were a lot easier to drive in the wet @rethla. And tractioncontrol and more freedom in the ECU did help them too with damper settings / ride height.
Maybe so but do you remember any postponed qualis or races due to rain in that time?
Either those tyres were a lot better or the race control is more cautios nowadays.
And now, whenever is it wet enough for wet tyres sessions are suspended and SC is deployed.
And then they usually go straight to inters:D
I do think the tyres were better. Afterall, both Bridgestone and Michelin had a LOT more testing laps to learn abuot the wet tyres. But also, the current engines and the chassis etc have changed a lot, I think it might well be that the way they are ran currently with very low fronts and high rake has an effect too. Also, traction control. And yes, race control certainly has become more wary too.
track was clearly getting worse, it was starting to rain a lot harder as noted by the commentary team at the track & in the pits.
also drivers were not going faster, sector times were all slower than those of the 1st few cars to finish laps. and the fact one car aquaplaned in a straght line shows conditions were worsening as does radio messages from a bunch of different drivers that have been played on pits channel.
Verstappen was the fastest man on track and faster than Hamilton’s sectors. So that’s patently not true.
verstappen was also on the radio saying conditions were too bad and that he was aquaplaning on the straight.
The track was worsening outside of the racingline where the cars wasnt clearing water.
The track out back of the circuit looks fine. Circuit can’t be perfect everywhere. Drive to the conditions on the straight.
Delayed another 15 minutes.
siesta time duh!..
On the bright side it’s good for haas.
In the 1970s we used to run SCCA nationals in worse conditions.
I think some of the anger at race control is misplaced. I think this is down to the quality of Pirelli’s wet weather tyres. It’s not as if the drivers haven’t highlightewd this problem before:
https://www.racefans.net/2016/11/17/two-years-after-bianchis-crash-drivers-are-still-unhappy-with-pirellis-wet-tyres/
We have not seen much use of Pirelli’s heavy wet tires lately.
There was an artificial wet session during the pre-season tests and then almost no-one made use of this opportunity to test the Pirelli wet weather tyres. The teams are also to blame I think.
It looked a lot dryer, don’t understand the future delay
Look at the track outside of the pits, then you should understand the delay. There has just been more rain since they red flagged it, so it will be worse. But looks to only be very bad there.
I saw the Safety Car do a little overpower wiggle coming out of the chicane from the helicopter shot
Oh well then, better shut down the circuit and lock the cars in the garage.
Yep but still it looked a lot better
apart from the straight – the exact place where Grosjean aquaplaned off – that looks completely wet, the new tarmac seems not to have been solved too sensibly with regards to wet weather.
Maybe I read the radar wrong, bit it looks like it only gets worse
Safety car looked like he had a pretty good lap going there!
I think those criticizing the red flag/delays would very quickly change there views if they were ever put in a car in these conditions.
Its easy to say that conditions aren’t bad and/or that drivers should slow down. However when you have standing water, especially on a straight then there isn’t much drivers can do & slowing down can actually be far more dangerous not only because it raises the risk of a car behind running into you but also because by backing off you actually increase the chance of aquaplaning as your producing less downforce with a bit less loads in the tyres.
Well Marcus Ericsson loves it.
Yeah, true. I mean, sure, at this moment, it looks pretty good on track, but, they have to get everything ready, definitely including the marshals for the cars running. I don’t know if there’s a better way.
Wrong. I’ve raced formula fords in far worse. Heck, I’ve raced in super karts in far worse.
yeah, exactly what Grosjean just mentioned in the interviews. No visibility and standing water on the straight.
Sure the wets aren’t great but I think the frustration on the fans part is that EVERY time it rains either during the race or qualifying, the race is usually either stopped, or a session is delayed over and over again.
Yes
It used to set F1 apart in the US for example, driving in the rain
The sport is under an intense microscope for safety right now which brought about the halo. It wants to be seen in a positive light in regards to driver safety after the Bianchi accident and pending lawsuit.
I cant remember the last time it was wet in Monza- any ideas?
08 ?
ummm…. yesterday? =)))
Apart from yesterday :)
2008 !
2008
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gs08Ib1CMrw&feature=youtu.be
RoGro interview
for me that seems removed now …
Tracks looking quite a bit better now.
indeed, we might still get Quali going!
so straight to inters now?:D
That would be fun ;)
I saw a lot of standing water on the front straight at start/finish line.
Are you there Keith?
people often look back & say ‘they used to race in these conditions’ which is true, however go back and watch those races and we used to get most the grid spinning/crashing out with races turning into battle of luck & survival rather than an actual race.
races like adelaide in 1989 and 1991 were started but looking back really shouldnt have been, neither were that great to watch from a racing perspective and having cars spinning and running into each other blind on the straghts was really not that great to watch.
I was at both of those races in Adelaide – I was 13 & 15- even Senna couldn’t keep it on track.
May be liberty can revive Bernies Monsoon tyres
Someone would have to actually test them …
FURTHER INFORMATION WILL BE ISSUED AT 15:00
Are they joking??? Come on!!
and then they wonder why tv audience falls. omg just get going
Would be fun if they actually were:
JUST KIDDING, SESSION RESTART AT 15.00
my god.
Formula One is jumping the shark.
Hahahahahaha
Some people who watch this really seem a little bit grumpy! :D If you don’t like what is happening, just stop watching it. How easy would that be?
But there is nothing to watch, thats the problem! We want them to get going, the conditions are fine!
+1
The problem is not that we dont wanna watch this its that we DO wanna watch the qualification.
Why are you grumpy about people who have every reason to be grumpy? If you don’t like what people are saying, just log off the chat. How easy would that be?
well done bro, well done.
I think it’s like your Dreamgirl undressed every 15 minutes, only to put her clothes back on, saying: “more info in 15 minutes”
I reckon it’ll be canceled.
Why does F1 still have full wets? Either only race when it is intermediate weather or actually use the bleeding things. Maybe should just become Nascar and never race in the wet
The problem is that the full wets rarely are faster than intermediates they are just safer and noone cares about that. They need do make better tyres, simple as that.
Charlie is waiting for Herbie to rock up for a Sav Blanc lol….. in his new Porsche haha
If it doesn’t start by 3PM, I bet they will delay qualifying until tomorrow.
Jeez, absolute joke.
They need to be cautious after Jules
I’m off for now, not going to wait around. Either I miss qualifying or not, but meh. Its raining
And now it is raining again hahahaha
Quoting Vettel: “Fork off, Charlie!”
Iiieeeeewwwww
Flavio on rtl
Thinking about stopping watching
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlL6M477P4g&feature=youtu.be
F1 2017- Italian GP Interview with Charlie Whiting about track conditions
Just got a text from somebody at the track who said the problem isn’t the conditions in terms of how much its raining.
The problem is that the resurfaced track on the straight not only isn’t draining but also has a residue of oils or something coming through it that is creating additional problems.
90% of the track is fine, Its not too wet & there aren’t many puddles….. However on some of the straights that have been resurfaced its just not raceable. Had there been no resurfacing it would be fine however the newly laid tarmac is causing problems that are preventing them going out.
Seriously how can a world class track get this wrong?
But that residue is an issue with all new surface, isn’t it? I mean, does that mean that Monza left it too late to resurface, wasn’t FIA alert enough to note that? And yes, it gets worse with water of course, but still, not unexpected is it?
Anyway, thanks for giving that bit of info from the horse’s mouth @gt-racer.
Tracks need to be set up so that they drain water away from the track. No excuse for standing water on track.
This has been handled so amazingly badly. Outside of being overly safe, they’re just plain incompetent.
They’re completely incapable of reacting. Session started under questionable circumstances but between 14:15 and a few minutes ago it was fine. But because they check every 15 minutes rather than constantly they can’t respond to changes or windows.
Remember when F1 fans used to talk about who is the best driver on a wet track? If they are going to stop racing every time it rains, that unique experience of F1 on standing water would be gone.
Charlie, stop being paranoid and let the cars loose.
Whilst we have Pirelli supplying the tyres, this is how things will continue to work I think.
Charlie cant now- after Jules they risk backlash if they get it wrong- so they be over cautious
I still think too many people don’t seem to respect the decision not to continue with qualifying. They will have their reasons. Grosjean crashed and that was a lucky escape. The track on the part he crashed has hardly improved and it is still raining. There is a possibility that something much worse could happen and the reason why it will have been red flagged will very likely to prevent this happening! If something terrible did happen, the drivers and many fans possibly will say they were mad to let them continue. I think there is far too much critisism towards these decisions.
The only reason the session is not restarted is the fact that those Pirelli wets are rubbish
Can we please enjoy our moment of rage without these clever and logical posts, ok? Thank you! /s
I don’t understand how you can enjoy being angry…. :D
FURTHER INFORMATION WILL BE ISSUED AT 15:15
Ha ha)) I’ll go make some coffee…
Prediction: The session will restart, drivers will quickly go onto intermediates, and everyone will assume this means the session was started too late, rather than being that the wet weather tyres aren’t up to the job.
This full wet thing is a little crusade of yours but it’s just not proven by anything. Under Pirelli they have worked plenty. Aquaplaning is virtually impossible to engineer into a tire.
I wouldn’t have brought it up if the complaints about the quality of the wet weather tyres didn’t come straight from the only people whose opinion about this matters – the drivers:
https://www.racefans.net/2016/11/17/two-years-after-bianchis-crash-drivers-are-still-unhappy-with-pirellis-wet-tyres/
It’s been a consistent source of complaint from them in the Pirelli era. And that’s despite F1 going to lengths to prevent them speaking publicly about the shortcomings of the tyres. Remember Spa 2015.
@keithcollantine, did you see the post by @gt-racer below, talking about how the oily residue from the new surface is the biggest issue, not the water?
In Keith’s defence the drivers in particular Vettel. Have voiced concerns about the wet tires for a few years now. However, Martin just said it best, throttle works both ways, drive to the conditions.
15 more minutes
Is this the result of
A. Pirelli
B. Charlie whiting
C. Fundamental errors in track chemical composition
B Charlie.
Send the cars out and redflag it again when someone crash. If they want more consistent action during wet then make better tyres and racetracks in the future.
The old banked track looks like it’s draining nicely…
Get them out there then !!!
Evil Horner, if they’re being cautious because of Jules they should just make sure no tractors are on the track. It’s sprinkling right now.
I agree Josh – I think they should be qualifying right now – but that’s not the case !
Just on the tyres, The full wets aren’t as good as they could be (Neither are the intermediates really) but today I don’t believe that is the biggest problem.
Yes its probably a factor but i’m not sure the best wet tyres would work all that well on the new tarmac thats causing the concerns.
And it depends who is driving on those tyres. A qualified, experienced F1 driver or a rich kid.
So what happens in the event that we can’t restart this thing ? Do they use this as the grid ?
They can still run qualifying tomorrow, when it’s supposed to be dry. Failing that they’d use Q1 times – as I recall USA 2015 was a precedent for that.
Thanks Keith. I didn’t know if they could still postpone it til tomorrow once they’d started the session.
I won’t moan about the decision to keep the cars off the track… but I’m definitely not happy about the decisions being made in 15 minute intervals. Why can’t they just have the safety car circulating the track until the track appears to be suitable?
I’d agree with that. They seem to miss good windows by waiting 15 mins.
I think Charlie is the biggest problem despite other possible factors related to oils from new track asphalt.
Charlie doesn’t make these decisions alone, He takes advice from not only others in race control but also with feedback from teams, drivers, Track workers & the safety car drivers.
But do you know why they have to do it in 15 min intervals only? It almost seems like asking for missed opportunities.
Why is Charlie the problem? He does need to keep all drivers safe.
Love to see Herbie- great man
Yes, I also don’t quite understand that. And then, if they decide ‘go’ will it be ‘go in 10mins’ to give it time to start raining again?
It has to be planned ahead a few minutes with all the people people watching and working with this. They cant just go by the minute with an operation like this.
So far this is a perfect birthdaygift for Ericsson.
It’s only 3:10 pm in Italy, at what point do they call this? I assume there are support races to be run?
I think they call the support races before they call the F1 qualification.
5pm (ish)- plenty of time
Hopefully my television doesn’t switch to tennis!
See, it’s incredibly difficult to clear the water when the cars aren’t out and the Safety Car’s just going out once every 15 mins…
At least Nascar would have dryers and street vehicles out on track driving around pushing the water off.
On the 15 minute windows, How long they wait is usually taken based on circumstances at the time.
If its a track that dries quickly with little standing water & no rain then they will look at things on a shorter interval. If there is a lot of standing water, A lot of continuous rain or something like with the new surface today they will look at things at longer intervals.
They also can’t make a call to restart a session immediately as F1 engines need to be prepared, brought upto temperature etc…. before they can be run so teams need prep time before sending cars out.
FURTHER INFORMATION AT 15:30. 10 MINUTES WARNING WILL BE GIVEN BEFORE ANY RE-START
Great, just great)
The earliest the session could restart is in 26 minutes time. Put the kettle on. Hell, you could knock up a batch of scones.
Its 11pm here Keith- a glass of port and some beef jerky ok :)
It is not restarting today. The first corner seems to have a puddle now. Don’t think it is clearing unless the sun shines.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4DAzGqAPHZI&feature=youtu.be
F1 2017 Italian GP- Flavio “BIG BOSS” Briatore about Fernando’s future
What do f1 drivers eat?
Pre-quali best food always banana’s – same for every sport.
Food I believe😂😂
Sorry, couldn’t resist that one😂
The closest I can think of to something like this (Track surface causing issues) would be the Indycar race at Sao Paulo in 2010 where whatever was used on the surface down the main straight was causing lots of problems with cars sliding around in the dry let alone the wet.
Practice was stopped early, Qualifying canceled & a lot of work done overnight/early morning to make it drivable for race day.
Is there actually a problem with the tracksurface, i have heard nothing official about it?
Its not a problem as such, Just that the freshly laid tarmac on the straight isn’t draining so water is just sitting on it. Also some of the oils that are used in the mix are coming up & not helping things.
Yeh i understand that its draining poorly and its oily but i have heard nothing from FIA, teams or Charlie about it. Is it actually true that the new asphalt is worse than the old?
It’s 9:19 here Kieth, I’m gonna crack a bottle of white and shock the pool.
Keith could you do an article on f1 driver diet and f1 driver fitness?
test
I wonder if Red Bull and Ferrari would push for the restart. There’s little chance that they can outqualify the Mercs on a dry track, so if qualy gets moved to tomorrow, they (Ferrari) can kiss pole goodbye.
I never get the popular belief that Ferrari makes the rule in F1. Most recent rules and verdicts have been neutral or against them.
lol on Helmut Marko’s comment on Grosjean
“We all know that Grosjean often crashes in the wet” Something like that. A bit harsh!
Lol awesome
Helmut Marko firing shots at Grosjean lmao. He kinda has a point, Grosjean did crash on the way to the grid at Brazil last year…
That was hilarious lol
Grojean is gonna Grojean.
And Verstappen, Vettel & Somebody else (Alonso maybe?) aquaplaned & spun at around the same place in the race with Raikkonen aquaplaning/crashing a bit further along.
Have been using my time productively: I think I now know what order to apply all the grid penalties in. Now we just need a grid…
Helmut Marko speaking the truth. We stopped running because of Grosjean. Who does this more often.
One of Helmut’s own drivers (Verstappen) was also on the radio saying conditions were too dangerous just prior to Romain going off & I gather that all drivers on track at that point were coming back with the same comments.
And Grosjean was 3rd before he aquaplaned. I do think Marco has somewhat of a point about the missed opportunity of a period w/o rain before 15h, but he’s as self serving as Lauda saying it needs to go to tomorrow (bc. that’s when he has best chance of 1-2 on gird).
Lauda saying he’d prefer to do it in the dry tomorrow because Mercedes have less downforce. I do like Niki, he always says it how it is. Very refreshing compared to half-answers we often get.
They have the fastest lap however.
At this rate, the only qualifying session I may see will be Indycars at Watkins Glen
Cars have to start race on suspension and aero settings from qualifying even on wet weather sessions?
While its dry today there’s talk of very heavy rain at Watkins Glen tomorrow.
Storms from Hurricane Harvey?
Just the remnants. Half an inch of rain.
Last weekend, COTA canceled their F1 watch party for Spa because of the rain but opened its RV park for evacuees from Rockport.
First time I have ever laughed at one of Marko’s comments
Surprised that ‘Further information in 15 minutes’ isn’t trending on twitter. I guess some people are saying info, some saying mins, etc.
Bernadette Collins has an inspirational career path ! Makes me feel happy for her yet sad I can’t do even 1/10 as much.
Weird. The driver with the highest speed trap is also the driver who crashed.
Because he can’t drive in rain. Funny enough Robert Doornbos expected several drivers having problems and Haas were two of them.
He should have lifted on the straight but he kept his foot down.
I just emailed Charlie and said we should be ok to go- for some reason haven’t heard back yet
In 15 minutes….
Charlie is probably calling his mommy to see if she thinks it’s safe yet.
The rain delay I can tolerate, it’s all these crappy rain .gifs the teams are posting which get on my nerves. It’s like they’ve each hired the same moronic 10-year-old to run their Twitter accounts.
Yeh those youngsters are always annoying
It’s often the older blokes, who haven’t yet been worn out in the novelty of .gifs etc.
At least you don’t have to watch NBCSN’s crappy coverage.
It’s in fashion at the moment though isn’t it? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/07/12/work-experience-boy-takes-southern-rails-twitter-account-things/
Stopped raining
rain isn’t the issue- its the pooling of water
Its rainwater in those pools
Should have had 25 cars out there the whole time under the delay
True- but we only have 20 cars- but they should be out there
Get the F2 cars out there, their race is cancelled any way ;)
Toto, Helmut. Two down for Grosjean. I am sure Gunther Steiner has had a few words as well. He is running out of TP’s to irritate.
I want some of those carrot cakes!!!
Well another 2 minutes and fate awaits
nah, another 15 minutes
And when they make a decision, they have to give a 10 minute notice to the teams.
The heli-cam is what is doing the SC justice. The normal cameras show them to be very slow whereas he is flying!
We need some cars on the track. Why don’t they send the two-seater around a couple of times to clear some of the standing water on the home straight?
Or at least keep the SC going around.
I doubt they ever run the twoseater in anything but dry conditions.
Move the damn thing to tomorrow already!
no tomorrow, please! I presonally have already wasted 2 hours of my life on waiting for them to get to the track. I’d prefer them do that today, so that I don’t feel that this time was wasted completely and for no reason.
+1 buddy
Some of the different paddock coverage is neat to see though, in Montreal I’ve only sat in grandstands, not the VIP treatment
Is nigel mansell racing in place of massa this weekend?
What’s the weather forecast for tomorrow race time?
Dry tomorrow and sunny for most of the day.
We all would like it to be reversed, wouldn’t we..
Should be dry.
almost time for our next 15 minute extension…
guessed it. Wasnt hard
FURTHER INFORMATION AT 16:15
I’m out. I’ll be back for the race tomorrow morning.
16:30 – Practice 3, IndyCar at Watkins Glen
One question. Is there any purpose on this wet tires?
Yes, they use them for one lap to ensure it’s OK to put on the intermediates or even slicks.
And they use them to roll the cars on Thursday too, I think.
They do about as much use as the guy stood on track trying to brush the water away with a wicker broom!
If bits of the track had not been resurfaced the wets would have been fine as conditions on the older bits of tarmac were by all accounts perfectly drivable, It was only the new tarmac that was causing problems.
Anyone think stoffel looks like Jean Claude van dam?
Arghhhh!!
FURTHER INFORMATION AT 16:30
Any further justification for charlie’s decisions?
Two minutes of Danny Cam. My head is spinning.
Ted Kravitz still wearing shorts. Oh Teddy, never change.
it’s not like it’s getting cold all of a sudden. If I were to choose what wet garment to wear, it would rather be shorts than lets say jeans)))
Imagine if you’d spent $1,800 for an “F1 Experience” at Monza
They have gone to cricket highlights in India. For heaven’s sake, please know what is happening on the track. Just don’t do the default programming.
Info from the track…… If conditions stay as they are the session may well be restarted in the next half hour.
Jay! People hard at work blow-drying and sweeping the worst puddles away.
It would take a single F1 car to go over it 200km/h and blow it away.
Is Charlie being too conservative ?
Update : in 15 mins there will be another update about the update in 15 mins which will be followed by an update in 15 mins
I’m torn between wanting to see some action and knowing that if they qualify in the dry tomorrow we might see a new all-time record…
I’m 100% in favour of wet qualifying. Could make the race exciting, something that track record won’t have any effect on.
I love Sunday qualifying but I’d rather see a battle in the wet as opposed to Mercedes Mercedes Ferrari Ferrari as we’ll see tomorrow. The spectators have been sat in the rain waiting for hours – it’s good for the sport to do it today.
Seriously contemplating going to bed now. How long till it’s dark in monza?
Four hours, seven minutes.
Saw a tweet saying rain is due to stop at 18:00 local time, and sunset is at 19:57… Sooo there would be time, but just for the F1.
Put the cars out there and let them blow off the track!!!
I just got an email back from Charlie (I am not joking, I do know him) and he says they are keen to get going pretty soon! lets go boys!
Lol and Lewis Hamilton is my Uncle.
Here we go – session restarts in ten minutes.
Finally!! Hurray!
Glad I didn’t give up and go to get a haircut now! :D
As I said, Within half hour.
Let’s hope there’s no red-flag-producing crash!!! Drivers, please FOCUS.
I wonder if Haas fixed Romain’s car…
What are the rules on that?
if they did fix it, there is nothing stopping him from going again and causing another red flag)
Maylander is surely having some fun out there.
Roman’s car didn’t seem to have damage that would be unfixable in the time available, Ivan B.
Are there rules though, that if you retire from a session you can’t continue? It’s not like the old days when you could hop in the spare car in this situation
there is, and he cannot join
Coffee cup refueled and ready to go!!!! :~)
The f1 telecast stopped in India when the cars are about to start
NBC commentators suppose Grosjean might to be allowed to participate in the session. This due to regulations after you retire on the track.
might not*
Because your car didn’t make it back to the pits under it’s own power.
1 crash will likely end this 3 hour deal
….and cause a gigantic, mass face-palm.
Palmer and Ericsson in the wet… Uh oh
Stroll……
Is it just me, or does it look close to inters?
If it has stopped raining its always close to inters.
All cars on track except for Grosjean.
Corking first lap by Hamilton.
Yay!!!! :)
How many sets of full wets? Enough for new ones in Q3, 2 and 1?
3.
Dont be silly. The FIA dont believe in wets.
Q3 will be slicks at this rat3
Stroll and Massa pretty handy so far in that williams.
Vettel to inters???
Inters already. Shambles.
Stroll P4?
Waited way too long to go out. This is the problem with F1 in the wet atm, Most of the time, as they get the session started, it’s basically time for inters.
Alonso on inters – no grip, no power…
VET purple S1
That shot of the Ferrari brake on fire whilst they had the tyre off was amazing.
FIA graphics in denial over everyone switching to inters…
Great reaction time by Kimi!
The radar is nasty looking
Another reason why Verstappen might be right to go out on wets in Q2.
Ya the weather looks close
I know Massa doesn’t like the rain but that’s very good from Stroll in difficult conditions.
Vettel needs to find something or he’ll end up at worse a P3 which will be tough tomorrow
It will dry a bit though
Stroll P5… Must be used to driving in the wet, being Canadian. Like how British drivers are generally quite handy in the wet.
I think Stroll is Billionairese, not Canadian
I think living in a rainy country only makes you more aware of the dangers and driving more cautiously, rather than helping to learn driving fast and at the limit.
Even more impressive is that Williams is usually really bad in the wet. Stolll is also too often concidered really poor. Williams has also been dreadful in recent races. That must have been quite some lap by him.
Stroll was the fastest by 2 secs in last year wet Spa race. He s always fast on wet condition
The good news for Red Bull is they should be able to get into Q3 on intermediate tyres, meaning they can still have a free tyre choice tomorrow after their penalties, when they would otherwise have had to use old slick rubber.
Really hoping they manage to squeeze F2 in! Should be a nutty race.
Interesting tyre choices
STR, Red Bull, Hulkenberg, and at least one FI on full wets.
Think both FI’s were. Will be an interesting session.
Drift-master Vandoorne.
Bahahahahahha!!!!
Inters
stroll really is looking good here
Just noticed Vettel has the italian flag on the helmet today. Any pics for any chance Keith?
RAI 2sec down. Now Kimi fans will come to defense with car issues
Ricci on wets at the end in 8th. Surely a mistake.
I take it back. 7th.
I was gonna ask about Alonso but he’s out
Why do Fernando stay in so long
Vandoorne did well just a Stroll again
Any reason for strolls performance ?
Well, Massa is also up there, so Williams seems to not have their usual wet troubles, and also I guess he’s genuinely doing a good job. Good to see!
2 thousands between the FI rivals. All the difference made.
Rip Hulkenberg then… has a 10-place grid penalty anyway so doesn’t matter.
Both Mercs used new inters. Why are Ferrari saving inters for dry race?
Saving the engine most likely than actually saving the tyre
No they kept circulating
Saving them for Q3 rahter, I’d say.
Gonna be interesting Q3!!!!
Got a cheeky £1 on a Stroll Pole Position. Here’s to fingers crossed ;)
who s out in Q2?
Perez, Hulkenberg, Kvyat, Sainz and Alonso
Was his last private test wet?
Sorry was about Stroll
Ocon in Q3, Pérez out in Q2: Mexico is on fire!
Stroll for pole !
Whom did you put as your sole non-Merc/Ferrari 5th guy in the PREDICTION championship guys?? I put Ocon and it look fine for me for now :D
Rain increases.
Not sure about doing inters… rain’s a-coming, they’ll need to get on with it.
Looks like full wets.
that was a blunder for both Vet and Ham with inters…. might cost them dearly
Ferrari look really bad, not great
Um… Ferrari?
something unexplainable is happening there
Maybe they have set up a beast for dry race
I’m pretty sure the Mercs did the same, frankly. So not so plausible
Yeah, my thoughts exactly.
I’m guessing Red Bull strategically chose to take penalties at this race because theoretically this is their weakest circuit…
Nice slides by Max.
Interesting that Mclaren is nowhere with their supposedly top chassis.
Stroll on the front row after penalties!!!
Hamilton sets pole record.
Immense qualifying from him.
Shout outs to Stroll and Ocon, and to the Red Bulls drivers despite the penalties.
Yeah mate, top job from everyone.
Poor job from Ferrari though.
It’s a great qualy… but I am in shock with Ferrari Q3 performance… what a let down
So HAM, STR 1st row, with OCO, BOT 2nd.
Dang!
I was joking about Stroll on Pole, but I wasn’t far off :D :D
Haha, excellent work!
First time Stroll impresses. Great and unexpected.
Bottas has a poor middle sector. Stroll 2nd, Ocon 3rd on the grid. Well.
Thumbs up for Stroll, Ocon!
Ferrari not working on wets
They were the only ones not changing them at the end. Typical weird ferrari decisions
What a lap from Hamilton !
Ok now……… I wasn’t suppose to watch this quali for 4 hours…
they say that conditions like that show the drivers with talent….. so are those that say lance stroll has no talent & isn’t very good going to shut up now?
They also show who uses a full wet setup and who not…
He showed good stuff today but 1 good performance in more than half a season aint gonna win over all the doubters.
Massive credit to Hamilton, Stroll, Ocon and Verstappen!
Great efforts in terrible positions :)
yeah, all of them really did well today. Great driving
And Daniel
*Conditions
is this the first time this season Ferrari start from 3rd row? At home race… pathetic
They are so lucky red bull have penalties !
Most exciting Q3 of the season!
I’d rather see the Force India in P2, but top job, Stroll!
Ferrari should be thankful that RB have the penalties. Not sure how much wing they have on their cars but they were slower than Williams pair in the mid sector.
Tomorrow should be interesting. Gotta take the FI and Williams away quickly if they are to have a chance.
Stroll to divebomb Hamilton into turn 1 just because
Top drawer performances from all in the top 5. Shame the Red Bull won’t get to reap the reward of that.
Really poor from Ferrari. They at least inherit some places from Red Bull, but in Ocon and Stroll they have two of the fastest cars in a straight line starting ahead. It’ll be hard to get past them…
Mind you, not sure if I’d want to be on pole with two audacious youngsters with everything to prove and nothing to lose immediately behind me. Should be an interesting start tomorrow!
Now let’s see if we can get Formula 2 going!
Well, I’d gather Ocon will want to show maturity, and match his teammate’s podium from Monza, so that might be okay …
This turn out to be worth a wait….
I don’t think anyone can match the highs and lows that Stroll seems to be having this year. Starting second after failing Q1 in 4 of 5 of the previous races!
How long will Stroll and Ocon be able to keep Bottas and the Ferrari-drivers behind, and will Both Mclaren’s and Verstappen’s car last the entire race distance?
It’s HAMMERTIME!
hello everybody from Malaysia..Go Hammer!
This looks like a good oppertunity for the Saubers. Ericsson starts in the top 10 and his team mate just behind. They both got moved forward 8 places! That is a bigger advantage than lots of the penalties actually peanalised lots of the other drivers. See how long they can last this high up on the grid.
Hello everyone and welcome to F1 Fanatic Live for today’s Italian Grand Prix.
The race will get going once the stewards are done giving everyone penalties.
You are awarded a 116 grid spot penalty for complaining about the stewards!
Oh, wow, I did see penalty for Grosjean yesterday, but Vandoorne and Perez too? Did Vandoorne have trouble or did McLaren think 10th wasn’t enough to get points? Man.
Very interested to see what goes on at Ferrari today is Vettel doesn’t get ahead of Raikkonen at the start.
Well, after the pitstop, he’s most likely past anyway, isn’t he?
I’m looking forward to what Bottas can do too.
Well while signing contract they must have informed RAI what he needs to do rest of this season
Pretty sure that if the first lap doesn’t get Seb ahead, the pitstops will defenitely do it.
Who of Bottas, Vettel, or Stroll will be first out of corner 2?
Bottas.
Lewis must be delighted to have Stroll and Ocon next to him of the start. Good thing noone ever gets overexcited and goes in too hot to the first chicane at Monza.
I think they’ll behave themselves. They’ve generally been pretty good this year (even Ocon despite all the hype around the Perez incidents).
Since Perez is nowhere near Ocon, I think he will be fine :-) And Stroll has really been doing his best to avoid being hit in the last races
I just discovered that F1 is no longer behind the paywall in my country. Glory!
:-) great news!
Thank you, I could sing!
That’s something to celebrate indeed. Enjoy the race!
Result! Which country?
what feed are they giving?
F1 Live Timing doesn’t have South Africa as an option, so for today I’m Botswanan.
When the tweenagers running the teams’ Twitter feeds realise the front row of the grid is HAM STR we’re going to get a lot of .gifs of hamsters.
LOL, ugh. yeah.
It wont be as good as BUT GRO PER
kakakakaka i’d love to see that
Magnussen out of Q1 but start 9th..Wow
Good morning all.
Good day :)
For Sainz, Verstappen, at least Kvyat is well ahead of them so won’t come and torpedo them :-p
Verstappen’s engine will give up anyway as soon as he gets close to the top 5-6.
Enjoy the race everyone! This is going to be an intense start…
So, a glum or happy Ferrari garage today?
Lance’s sister is hot.
Ooh that’s not what Vettel wanted.
He is still running. That’s better.
Hehe the Finns at it again.
Omg Kimi…..
Valtteri has Kimi.
…and Lance!!!
Max not being able to bully people. Karma.
Typical Massa, can never bring himself to leave room for another car. That was completely avoidable.
A shame
VER makes a mess himself this time
Great Verstappen is out. Massa is slamming into everything he sees in that chicane. First Perez and then verstappen.
“I can’t stand F1 anymore, it won’t let us fans see Verstappen’s true potential”
Seems Massa caused quite a bit of mayhem already in that 1st chicane.
Vettel having a wobble there into the last corner.
Who said Vettel needed a pitstop or teamorder to pass Kimi?
Vettel’s cruised into third easily, shows the huge gulf between the big three teams and the rest.
Will be interesting to see how long Ocon can stay near him now.
I dont see Riccardo or Kimi cruising easily into third.
Ocon can’t stay with Vettel, but looks like both Stroll and Ocon can maintain position ahead of RAI, MAS, so Ricciardo will have trouble getting higher than 5th I think.
Ricciardo’s overtaken seven cars since lap one. Raikkonen has a handling problem.
But Massa might be more difficult, he’s a strong defender with good straightline pace.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8JiWdhAYRM&feature=youtu.be
+1
Really nice work from Vettel so far, now for the big test
Stroll well able to keep Ocon’s DRS isn’t he?
Kimi has to finish 4th. Would be a shame otherwise.
I’d rather see Ocon or Stroll in 4th!
He’s getting them in the pits one way or the other.
Raikkonen was told to get close to Ocon and Stroll before pitting, he;s pretty much done that, so let’s see if we get an early stop from him.
There we go.
Palmer cut the chicken…
Good for Palmer, I’d say.
Stroll needs to get Ocon
Important for Vettel to be close to Bottas. In case the softs given an advantage to the Red Team.
Surely Ocon pits now to cover Raikkonen if possible and undercut Stroll?
And that’s two out of two :-)
Vettel falling behind Bottas.
Ricciardo on the brink of Perez’ DRS
Nice moves, well done again Ricciardo
That move from Ricciardo was incredible. Pulled a 2014 once again.
Ricciardo, once again keeping his nose clean and on for a good result.
Post-race interviewer bracing himself for a shoey.
Williams fail their record pitstop under real pressure. >4sec for Stroll.
ah, man, the one pitstop where it counts and Williams have a slow pitstop.
When are we going to get rid of this DRS. I’m waiting years and years for something to happen to watch cars go side by side at Monza again without one of them having a huge overspeed advantage.
I sit and watch this race and this is all I can think about. The tradegy of DRS. That and Kvyat being on fire.
I think considering, those 5s for Palmer are a bit harsh. I do understand Alonso being disappointed, but still.
My goodness Vandoorne can’t compete
I dislike the 5s penalty so much.
Think it’s only a matter of time until Raikkonen gets Ocon. The Force India’s not so great on its tyres, later in the stint he’l be vulnerable. May be wise to avoid fighting Raikkonen and use his DRS to keep Stroll behind.
Ocon has grown on me since Canada, love that kid
Why can’t Vettel keep up with the Mercs? Engine? Aero? Tyres?
Ocon has no DRS. Kimi has. He has to get him now. Come on Kimi!
I don’t think I’ve ever mentioned this before but I’m not that fond of DRS.
I am in favor of DRS now :-)
So Hamilton is now about a pitstops worth ahead of Vettel, right? And no issues on tyres, not quite the excitement I’d have hoped for!
Ricciardo on softs faster than Vettel on Supersofts. What the heck went on with Ferrari this weekend?
RIC 1/2 sec faster. 30 laps to go. Could catch up 15 secs. is 16 secs behind. In with a chance of 3rd.
We can only hope!!!!
Fernando is so miserable this year, sad to see
He was happy in May
Ya i hope he does it again next year
He should take a year out, drive a couple of Indy races, and position himself as best he can for 2019 for one last go at the elusive 3 titles.
I love how fast this race is. 39 minutes in and it’s half-distance!
Good, I’m yawning right now…
Finally! This will give Ferrari some data.
That’s such an F1 fan thing to say :-)
Ferrari in an island now. Merc too far, rest too far behind as well. Searching for optimism.
Interesting stint coming up with Ricciardo going to the SS and Vettel on to the Softs.
1.3 faster and he was behind for 10 laps or so? SMH!
And there is a ripple of applause as Kimi presses a button and drives around Ocon. Ok, I’ll shut up now!
What tyres is Perez on actually?
Vet faster than Ricciardo. Relieved sigh!
Just as I post this, Ric does a PB.
Want to see Ric and Vet slug it out for the last couple of laps!!!
No TV coverage of Mercs. I’m sure they don’t mind too much.
Why is F1 so dull?
Not everyone is finding it dull. Maybe you could tell us why you think it’s dull and then there might be some discussion?
Minimal excitement and average racing. I just watched an incredible GP3 race and F1 hasn’t even touched that excitement.
If Stroll would only have some bal*s to brake slightly later….
Ham pits
Stroll is a bit too cautious I feel.
BOT going purple
Ric and Kimi post identical times.
Nice gap for Vettel, no, they had to bc. of Perez I’d say.
OMG honda..
So that’s what an actual ‘no power’ looks right. Okies!
here comes alonso: emberassing gp2 engine comments :)
Max clumsy today.
impatient i d say as usual
ah VAN came first with no power comment
Ricciardo going very long, but his pace is still good. Must be aiming to have a massive final sprint to chase Vettel.
Who can complain the most this race. Grosjean or Alonso?
Alonso wins the moaning race… just, but Grosjean wins the the championship by a country mile.
BOT lead a lap during pit stops, right?
Lap chart shows Bottas leading a lap.
Mclaren Renault with full orange livery…
they should change the tone of that car to more brownish :) hue
Hahahahhahahaha Alonso
karma..haha
Genuinely laughed out loud at that Alonso Palmer radio message.
What did alonso say?
See the Tweets on the right
Where is Alonso now?
P15
Karma :D
FOM have shown more shots of the tv camera helicopter than the Mercs! :)
Only the helicopter is faster than Mercedes.
Ricciardo might just run out of laps to get a shot at Vettel.
what are the chances of mercs lapping one ferrari?
Not happening. Gap too big.
Vettel had an off? 1.27 last time.
probably a backmarker at a bad moment
yeah. Had a 1:25 next time.
Alonso is P15
Karma!
I suspect no podium for RIC. But RIC performance in race versus his more highly rated teammate VER must cause some to rethink. I’d want VER in my sprint car, not sure about F1
Why would anyone rethink. This is exactly like all the previous races. The only difference is that Verstappens car is actually running so Ric can finally get some laps ahead of his teammate.
I’m a Ricciardo fan, but with Verstappen dropping right to the rear, and the damage he suffered early, I wouldn’t regard this race as too significant.
It might well be a good learning experience for Verstappen on dealing with adversity mentally, absolutely.
Wow! Daniel on Kimi!!!1
go Ric!
man, that was quick! Ricciardo definitely candidate for DotD,DotW
of the day maybe. But he did get beaten by Max on saturday earlier in the weekend
okay, I’ll give you that :)
This feels like one of those races where a last-lap engine blow-up changes everything…
Lewis is down on power
Was it here or hockenheim where Kima ended up crying in the woods?
mika*
Lol
Stroll will have a good fight, Perez is on the way too
Don’t jinx it!
But seriously, Merc apparently haven’t been using full power for much of the race.
wow! RB car catching a ferrari in a power circuit with a lemon engine!
This is such a messy race for Ferrari.
If McLaren Renault isn’t competitive with RBR sparks are going to fly. Alonso will turn his radio wrath on McLaren chassis: “this McLaren pig, it’s like driving a truck!”
Renault ain’t supplying McLaren in the first place.
You think not, eh. Wait until this week and you’ll learn.
They have told they can’t do a 4th team now.
Torro Rosso out (honda), McLaren in…. 3 teams
So boring
Some good drives though, a boring F1 race is better than anything else on tv
hear hear
The Red Bull really is very good on the breaks, isn’t it (or both drivers good on them?)
both of those
The SS tires.
That too, I guess!
I’m confused, I thought Ferrari was a better car than Mercedes. That’s what Toto and Lewis said.
Ever since Canada, Mercedes have enjoyed a 2011 Red Bull advantage over the field.
Back to 2016 again for Mercedes…They untouchable right now….
Watch Mercedes destroy Ferrari in Singapore
If not for grid penalties Ferrari wouldn’t even have a possible podium today I think!
Indeed. Both Red Bulls would be far ahead fighting for P2 with Bottas or something
Why haven’t Williams tried a switch with Massa and Stroll.
Same thing as with Perez not listening to requests to look into let Ocon by – look who pays the bills
FI and Williams trying to be worse than each other :-)
At least the Williams aren’t banging wheels with eachother over those spots. I guess Massa with all his experience is more apt to play wingman though than a driver like Ocon with all still to prove
$45 million
Engine failure for Ricciardo please! …and I’ve got a maximum race score in the prediction champ’ship.
It would be nice to see LeClerc in a Haas next season, wonder how his moaning is?
He wasnt that happy today.
Damn is Winter coming to Italy?
I’d say Williams award Stroll for the qualifying, evered7.
True. But if they can get more points than FI, it helps the overall picture doesn’t it?
Nice to see Kevin and Verstappen batteling. Some action.
I think Williams had better keep Massa behind Stroll, to defend them both.
exactly, makes sense.
And also rewards Stroll for that great qualifying too.
A race with good atmosphere, but a boring race…
Ferrari 22 seconds behind Mercedes after 36 laps. Nice.
there goes alonso..double honda failures….again
Isn’t it funny how they always have a problem on the penultimate lap?
They are just saving the engine a bit, calling off an effort that wouldn’t bring them anything anyway. That engine can probably go another race or even two (although it is never going to be a great powerfull engine!)
Might be, in 14th, there is very little to gain I guess.
huh finaly, alonso retired :)
So, that’s both 3.7 spec engines retired then?
Alonso aint running 3.7?
hm, no you are right, they kept that to have it retire from Singapore. Well that’s something to look to then!
Double McHonda retirement. Doh. Wonder if there’s a contractual number they’re trying to reach!
Williams in a FI sandwich. Would be pretty fun if Perez gets both Williams.
That a quick Ok, sound he really want to get out of that car….
Morning all, just joining. What’s the order?
Vet just turned up engine I guess
Oh, Massa having a go! Nice one Felipe
nice battle of W and FI
Ferrari nowhere this weekend, expect them to bounce back at Singapore.
indeed. They must be really happy that Red Bull took the engine penalties. Oh, and Vettel DID go off that one lap he was really slow!
That was Kimi
Nope @nin13, Vettel mentioned that he probably damaged the car a bit and turned down the engine after he had a small off. Said that on the radio to the team after finishing.
Over 30 sec behind the Mercedes…Ouch
Verstappan will never win title with that kind of driving. Collided with 3 cars. Ricciardo on other hand consistent and makes decisive moves. I think top teams will look at RIC before VER.
Driver of the day: Fernando Alonso.
For sure, his best race ever.
Karma…
Good race, but the F2 race was so much better.
What’s the big ‘si’ banner that some people have opened up? A referendum or something?
There is a referendum in Lombardia region to convert it in Autonomous Region like Aosta
Very good race from Bottas too. Quickly got into 2nd and then kept a solid distance to Hamilton to the end. Shame about Strolls slow pitstop, I think that had he kept ahead we could have had a bit more action between Ocon and him.
great session as always, thanks keith and mods..see you guys in 2 weeks
Ferrari need to calm down and get to maximize the advantage in Singapore. If they can give some extra ice creams to Kimi to get him make some moves in the race, that will help as well.
I don’t think we can expect anything fancy from Kimi the Vettel understudy @evered7. Maybe if he can really race he might give it all his energy.
I get it that he doesn’t fight Vettel much. But he never took Ocon and Stroll today. Which was in the end a disaster as he was easily caught by Ric and passed for 4th.
The real driver of the day: Daniel Ricciardo.
Thanks as always for joining in guys, more coming up on F1 Fanatic soon, give your verdict in Rate the Race here:
https://www.racefans.net/2017/09/03/rate-race-2017-italian-grand-prix/
See you guys for the IndyCar race at Watkins Glen :)
Mercedes power better than ferrari power.
Ouch!
He try to shot fire to Ferrari fan that boo at him…
Seb just did an Alonso, LOL.
Didn’t Alonzo win the time he did it?
No, It was 2013 when he did it.
Was there contact between stroll and massa on the last lap?
I don’t think so. At least it didn’t look like there was contact.
Anyway, see you all in Singapore! Good rest of the day.