“Myth” of Ferrari attractive to Vettel – Marko

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In the round-up: Helmut Marko gives a further indication Sebastian Vettel is heading to Ferrari.


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Helmut Marko Q&A (F1)

“Ferrari is still the name in F1. It’s a myth, so every driver yearns to go there in their racing career. Sure, much of it is about illusions.”

Alonso: McLaren now or Mercedes gamble? (BBC)

“Asked how much danger there was of ending up without a drive, Alonso said: ‘Probably not a big risk.'”

Massa: Brazil tyre choice dangerous (Autosport)

“I have no idea why they choose medium and hard, it’s completely unacceptable.”

Bianchi will keep fighting, says father (Reuters)

“The situation is desperate. Every time the phone rings we know it could be the hospital to say Jules is dead.”

Nico: I need to start winning (Sky)

“I just know I need to go out and win races now and see how it goes.”

McLaren to name drivers before finale (ESPN)

Eric Boullier: “I hope to sort out our decision on the driver line-up before the end of the season, yes. It’s true that it takes a bit more time than maybe we have to deal with, but it’s still on course to be before the end of the season, yes.”

Sochi continues the rise of the non-democratic host nations (The Guardian)

“Given the extent to which the global sporting calendar has tipped away from western democracies and towards a loose group of authoritarian regimes prepared to exchange huge sums of money for the “nation building” gold dust they provide, Ecclestone’s travelling circus – not for the first time – seemed like an outrider for the rest of sport.”


Comment of the day

Enough already with the street tracks, says @W-K:

What is the fascination with street circuits? Monaco’s race is usually boring, unless it rains. Valencia was horrible, Singapore relies on it being a night race, take that away and it is again boring. All the street races they tried in the past in the US were hopeless and dangerous.

And we have just had the most boring race for several years in Sochi, rate the race proves that.

Street circuits, no thanks.

From the forum

Happy birthday!

Happy birthday to Fer No. 65, Sebastiaan Huizinga and Carlos!

If you want a birthday shout-out tell us when yours is via the contact form or adding to the list here.

On this day in F1

Michael Schumacher demonstrated he intended to pick up where he left off by taking pole position for the 1994 European Grand Prix on his return to action at Jerez following his two-race ban.

Championship rival Damon Hill joined him on the front row. Pierluigi Martini put his Minardi 17th on the grid after this unusual incident involving a couple of marshals:

Image © Red Bull/Getty

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139 comments on ““Myth” of Ferrari attractive to Vettel – Marko”

  1. LOL at the marshalls in the video. Hahaha

    You can see them shouting to the crane driver: “HIGHER, I WANT HIGHER, COME ON, HIGHEEEEEER! WIIIIIIIIIIIIII! :D”

    1. But even back then the commentator (Ben Edwards?) is saying “It’s probably the safest place to be, John” (with a tractor in the gravel trap).

      1. @fastiesty THe driver remaining of the car that is? If so he’s probably right.

    2. Happy birthday @fer-no65 !

      1. thanks, iRacing mentor ! @george :P

    3. A bit strange we don’t see marshalls doing that anymore, I guess it has to do with the stricter weight distribution regulations.
      By the way happy birthday!!!

      1. @mantresx well, the guys at japan were trying their best to keep Sutil’s car level to the ground.

        And thanks ! :)

    4. OmarR-Pepper (@)
      15th October 2014, 4:26

      Feliz Cumpleañossss!!!!!!!!!!! @fer-no65

    5. Happy Birthday @fer-no65 !!!

  2. Come to the Red Bull Young Driver Program! We can get you through all the racing series, give you a shot for F1, maybe our championship winning team! You are forbidden from having a plan B.

    1. The Red Bull Young Driver scheme – now that’s a myth.

      1. So what is Seb (4 x WDC) and Dan??
        They are not ‘also rans’ are they?

        1. Liuzzi, Speed, Bourdais, Buemi, Alguersari, Vergne. I could go on with drivers who never reached F1, but Id rather not do the research. Red Bull have promoted exactly three drivers to their front team since 07, all the others were left without a plan B. Its a deal that works great for Red Bull, but its terrible for the drivers when they are dropped.

          1. Sure the yield is low, but so are the chances of getting into Oxford or Harvard. Until this year at least, RBR was the golden opportunity. In any case, drivers are free to quit RBR’s program and sign on with the program of McLaren, Ferrari, or seek a test seat with Sauber.

          2. This criticism on RBR’s scheme is borderline crazy. Seriously. Just think about it.
            Take McLaren. Tell me how many drivers they have promoted to F1 in the past, like, 15 years? I can name two.
            Take Ferrari. How many have they promoted to F1 these past 15 years? 2, 3? How many were promoted to the main team?

            Then take the RBR Junior Team. The main team has had one driver from the junior team in their ranks for years now, and since this year both the drivers come from the junior team. And the confidence is so big that next year again they will partner Ricciardo and the very young Kvyat instead of going for, for example, Alonso. Name me one team that, in the past 20 years, have ran a lineup existing solely of their own youth products. And now we’re only talking the main team – there’s lots of other drivers who have gotten a shot at F1 through the programme. More than the other young driver programmes COMBINED.

            That whole “dropping them without plan B” thing is nonsense. Sure, Buemi and Alguersuari were left caught out by poor timing. But they had about 3 years to prove themselves, any F1 team could have taken notice for the year after, but nobody did. The fact that Buemi still works for them and is happy in doing so speaks volumes.

            As for Vergne, well, he was informed well in advance. He also had 3 full seasons to prove himself. And again, any team interested in him can sign him.

            How can you possible slate the one programme that actually allows their drivers to reach F1 on a regular basis? With Verstappen and Sainz or Lynn next year, that’s 7 drivers in 7 seasons. On average 1 per season! How on earth can you criticise that?

            Of course, there are drawbacks.
            1) You have to keep performing, or you’re dropped. Isn’t that logical? Those that don’t keep performing don’t reach F1 anyway, whether in or out of a junior programme. Unless they have oodles of money of course.
            2) When dropped, they tend not to have too much sponsors. But seriously, what’s the worst? Being dropped and finding yourself without sponsors, or never being in a junior programme and maybe never finding the budget to ever start car racing or get to a decent level in it? Just look at Frijns. Turned down RBR, and finds himself hopelessly without a seat, even in GP2. Had he signed for them, he had probably been in a Toro Rosso this past year. And in an RBR next year.

            Why do you think so much drivers are keen to sign with the programme? Because they know it offers them a real chance at F1, without having to worry about money. As long as they keep performing.

            Really, we should be happy that at least the RBR Junior Team is a good foundation for allowing young talented drivers into F1. Because when you replace STR by yet another team that has to fight to get a decent budget, that’s two more seats for decently talented rich kids instead of the next superstars.

  3. ColdFly F1 (@)
    15th October 2014, 0:14

    Maybe Massa can manage his problem by qualifying on hards and pit on lap 1 for mediums. I hope that is acceptable for him.

    1. The last time Williams (specifically) used hard tyres, they had a horrible time heating those up, didnt they?

      1. Well it’ll certainly make things difficult if they have to use them on a drying track (not uncommon at Interlagos).

        1. If it rains on the Sunday they wouldn’t have to use the hard tyre at all as the 2 compound rule doesn’t apply to wet races.

          1. Raining in São Paulo? We don’t see that for months here… I think this race will be dry and very hot one…

          2. I can’t help but wonder what the new surface will do for the rain (e.g. better drainage, make it more slippery, etc.)

    2. @coldfly Alonso also said the tyre choice is ‘odd’. If anything they should’ve learned from Sochi but apparently they didn’t.

      1. ColdFly F1 (@)
        15th October 2014, 10:12

        @xtwl, I agree. They drivers (incl. Massa) are probably the experts on this.

        My comment was a bit sarcastic. Massa seems becoming (even more) emotional these days using comments like “I was screaming to Charlie” and “completely unacceptable”. I’d rather see him using these energies to drive faster.

  4. For goodness sake Felipe, did the world end in Texas when they raced on the new surface useing (gasp) Hard and Medium tyres ? no it did not, the drivers drove their cars according to the grip they had, and very entertaining it was too. You would think that with the experience he has and the $millions he has been paid Felipe should be able to manage a little less grip than the qualifying tyres that have become the norm for race tyres .

    1. Felipe had a close call in 2009 and is understandably upset. Basically he should not be in motorsport any more IMO based on his results and behaviour since his comeback, sad as it is to say. Despite his early reputation as “flymo Felipe” he basically deserved the 2008 championship and would have gotten it for more than a few seconds if not for Crashgate and/or a silly refuelling error. Nice guy, but his best days as an F1 driver are really behind him as the thumping from Valtteri this year indicates. When Felipe has been ahead and had a good race, he has found a way to blow it near the end and blame it on other drivers or had spectacularly bad luck like in Silverstone.

      1. “and would have gotten it for more than a few seconds if not for Crashgate and/or a silly refuelling error.”

        Love this kind of nonsense :]

        What about his diabolical drives in Silverstone and Malaysia? Where they not contributing factors to him losing the title? What about him being given a race win when he was miles off the pace and no where near the front in Spa?

        Felipes position in 2008, as Nico’s this year, is being flattered by circumstance.

        1. couldnt have said it better…

        2. Perfectly said. This forever. Massa was never championship material.

  5. Re COTD, to be honest I think it’s too soon to properly judge Sochi. The main reason behind the race’s lack of excitement was Pirelli’s compound choice. It wasn’t necessarily because it’s a bad circuit. It actually looks like a more promising venue than Valencia and while it’s not the greatest track in the world by any means, I think it could potentially produce some good racing. Turn 4 in particular is quite unique.

    Singapore sometimes produces good races (like 2010) and some not so good (like this year). Monaco, as much as I love it for its history etc. I’m going to have to agree it rarely features great racing. Basically not every circuit can produce a spectacular race every year and Sochi can’t be judged based on one race. Melbourne is usually good, as was Adelaide before it. Montréal also consistently produces some phenomenal racing.

    There are great street circuits and mediocre street circuits just as there are great purpose-built circuits like Interlagos and poor ones like Abu Dhabi.

    1. the track is a good track, the problem was the Mercedes power advantage and the tyre choice for the race.

    2. Nailed it. A lot of people are so short sighted about this kind of thing. Brundell said it was a good track and I thought that too. Hate the fact it’s in Russia though

    3. Also, by next year, the cars might be slightly more fuel efficient, so the race could be less centered around that.

  6. That’s a very good point on the COTD, is similar to the current situation where circuits now want to have night races. I think is because on paper it looks good, I guess “street race” or “night race” sounds appealing to the masses.

    Thank God we also have new (revamped) proper tracks like Austria and Mexico otherwise it would seem like Formula E in two years time.

    1. @mantresx, I disagree about the night time improving Singapore, I don’t think it would be a good circuit in the daytime either but the surrounding darkness makes it hard to picture at which point of the track is the picture you are seeing related to the last picture shown, it is very easy to lose track of which car is ahead of which unless you see them in the same frame.

    2. @mantresx I agree. I want more proper race tracks, not street circuits. As I’ve said before, Tilke team (can’t understand why it’s a monopoly) did a good job in Istanbul and COTA but their street circuits usually fail to produce great racing.

      1. @jcost what does Sochi count as?

        1. @davidnotcoulthard it’s a street race isn’t it? At least it has been designed around existing buildings…

      2. I don’t think Tilke did COTA… He might have done consultation, but not the whole enchilada.

        1. @abbinator I understand “Tilke” not only as the name of the head deasigner of the company but also the company’s name. I don’t think he designs circuits on his own, that’s why I always treat it as a “team job”

          1. @jcost, how short our memories are, the actual COTA track design was laid out and publicised by Tavo Hellmund (apologies if misspelt) before he was outmanoeuvered and Tilke bought in.

  7. Not to sound too harsh on Nico as I quite like the guy since all the way back in his Williams days, but he never sounds like he’s that determined or driven in quotes or in front of the camera. I’ve come down hard on Hamilton acting like a brat many, many times in his career, but at the very least you can say it’s evident that the guy wants to win. Nico? It always seems like “oops, I completely destroyed my race and any chance of victory, oh well I’ll get him at some stage!” He always says he’s unhappy or disappointed, like after Monza or Sochi, but I just don’t see it. I don’t see the hunger or the anger. And that’s why I can’t see him being Champion.

    I wonder if he’s still getting used to regular podiums after going through his entire career merely scrapping for points, let alone being in a position to win. That can have an effect on some drivers I’m sure. If you look at Alonso, Hamilton or Vettel, they’re all serial winners, and whenever they’re asked about why they haven’t won in a while I could always see their body language shift as they answered the reporter. They always looked extremely uncomfortable with not winning. I don’t see that in Nico.

    1. +1, very good driver, not quite WDC material. He had it relatively easy through his career. In carting day he had an enormous team around him, all the way up to GP2 and F1. Yes he’s more talented than many (even ) F1 drivers, for instance a bit more talented than MWebber, but he is just not on Lewis’s level of driving and racing. Nico _is_ a fighter, just not quite as much as LH.

      1. OmarR-Pepper (@)
        15th October 2014, 4:35

        In carting day he had an enormous team around him

        So did Lewis and Sebastian, and now Max. Is that bad?
        Well, I do agree he is on a lower step in the “F1 legends” ladder, even if he clinches the WDC sooner or later.
        Most people (me included) agree the great trinity today are Vettel-Alonso-Hamilton (name them in the order you love them or hate them, but they are there). Raikkonen, Button, Bottas and Hulkenberg, alongside Rosberg, are the “second step”. Good but nood THE good ones. Or at least Bottas and Hulk still have time to prove they could become part of the great ones. Let’s give that chance to Nico too, he is still young, whereas I personally don’t think Button or Kimi can find a higher lever on themselves now.

        1. Agree with you but I think currently Bottas along with DanRic is on a level above kimi, Jenson and hulk. Those two guys are on a graph to become F1 greats in future. Kimi and Jenson are on the twilight of their careers and have achieved as much as they could, becoming world champions, winning races,. All I am worried about is Hulk. Everyone accepts him as a WDC material, future legend and a great racer but I can’t see that becoming true. I feel he becomes another Heidfeld/ Alesi. Has a lot of potential but no real opportunities to prove it. He is a very consistent performer but he is not consistent with his career selections. He hasn’t stayed at any team for 2 seasons in a row which might not be a good thing on his resume. He should build a Team around him and take that team to newer heights than expecting an already better team to give him the drive.

          1. @bharat141 I have the same fears of Hulkenbergs future as you have said above. Earlier this week I was thinking about how his career kind of mirrors Fisichella so far. They kinda burst into F1 and people talked them up as great talents of the future, and possible WDC’s but it never happened. Fisi had a solid career in mostly midfield cars, and so far that’s exactly what Hulkenberg is doing.

            I hope I’m wrong because he looked like a very special driver in Brazil 2012, China, Korea and Austin ’13 and had a great run of results at the start of this season. I’d love to see him in a top team, even if for just a season to see what he could do instead of being another F1 ‘what if?’.

          2. OmarR-Pepper (@)
            15th October 2014, 14:19

            @colossal-squid maybe Bianchi’s tragedy has opened Hulk’s last chance to make the big jump into a top team. Many sources linked Bianchi to Ferrari 2016, now that chance (even if Jules survives and recovers quite well we hope) is for another driver. Hulk needs to beat Perez these last 3 races, I know he has more points still, but lately Hulk has shown just pale performances. And Force India need him to shine now, I don’t think Perez could be able to beat Button now. Button is sparking now!!

        2. Button and Raikkonen are very specific as to the car they need. When it is just right for them, they both tend to be untouchable, even by “more talented” teammates. Hulk is showing his feet of clay recently IMO. Rosberg, Hulk, Bottas Ricciardo and Perez are top level drivers, as are a lot of the field — even drivers no longer in F1, but they are still unproven and do not deserve to be in the same category as WDC’s like Kimi or Jenson… The main things that determine a champion are consistency and “unflappability”, i.e. being able to focus and bring home the championship when it is in your grasp. Rare are the drivers that can go from a midfield team to a leading team and bring home the championship in their first year of being competitive for podiums (Vet). It often takes trying and failing once first to instill the resolve required (Ham, Alo, But, Rai) But I don;t rate Vet above the others I just mentioned — I think his style and strengths as a driver was better suited to the Newey/EBD dominant mini-era more than Web was. But I think Vet’s last WDC has already come (4 ain’t a bad haul, after all). Just liek being chased by a bear, you don’t ahve to be faster than the bear, just faster than the guy next to you — you don;t have to be a better driver than the rest of the field, just your team-mate. :)

        3. In his Mclaren years, Kimi certainy was on Alonsos and Schumachers level. in other words on level with a Vettel or LH in present day. Repeat that was in his Mclaren days, since 2006 he’s steadily stagnated somewhat, more or less.

          Good post from you anyway!

        4. OmarR-Pepper (@)
          15th October 2014, 14:10

          sorry @bharat141 how can I miss Dan? maybe because in the “ladder” analogy he has already started to climb to the top step, he has done his hw well, defeated Vettel and, let’s be honest, in Hungary he looked superior to both Mercedes boys. He couldn’t have done more this year to prove his seat is deserved, he has done what MarkW tried so hard, which was to beat Seb… and did it all with that big smile!
          Taking about Webber, Nico’s reactions on track lately remind me of him. Good, almost always falling from a good qualy spot, trying to look better than the star teammate and failing all he tries to do.

          1. @omarr-pepper I know Vettel has gotten a lot of criticism for being beaten by Ricciardo this year and people seem to have diminished opinions of his abilities.

            But what if Ricciardo is genuinely that good? He’s doing great things right now and like you said has at times looked better than the Mercedes pair. Maybe in 5 years we’ll be talking about Dan in the same way we talk about Alonso now. I think it takes an exceptional talent to beat Vettel.

          2. Nico is nothing like Webber he has outraced and out qualified the supposedly fastest man in f1 but when he’s in front he’s lucky and when he’s behind he’s not trying hard enough! I swear once you are pigeon holed in f1 don’t you dare try and prove people wrong.

          3. “I think it takes an exceptional talent to beat Vettel”.

            You share my opinion of the situation. As I’ve said before, this one difficult season for Vettel will not lower my opinion of him or diminish his achievements. Ricciardo has adapted to this car better and I think he is on his way to be in that Alonso-Hamilton-Vettel category.

        5. I haven’t thought about this ladder in a while. Right now mine goes (in no particular order):

    2. You might even say he lacks hunger.

      1. @dmw

        Nice one………:)

    3. A good analysis. 4 wins to 9 says it all. He’s only won one more than Riciardo who’s in the 3rd best car and should be scrapping for 5th & 6th.

      I think if Lewis wins this one he’ll be unstoppable next season and then there is only one thing left to do:


      1. Will Vettel shine in a sub standard Ferrari? I think Lewis could!

    4. @colossal-squid Can’t say I agree here. He doesn’t go and make a big deal about everything in interviews and things, but in all honesty I don’t think that makes any difference for him.

  8. Regarding CotD, how often do people forget that Albert Park is also a street circuit? ;-)

    1. Now that you mention it… I always forget.

    2. Albert Park is more of a park (street) circuit rather than a city (street) circuit which makes quite a big difference, a bit like circuit Gilles Villeneuve and even Spa which are both held on public streets but not what I’d really call street circuits.

      1. The difference then?? You mean that ALbert Park and/or Gilles Villeneuve-circuit have more space for overtaking, racing and better/wider runoff-areas?

        1. I think the biggest difference is the overall layout, Canada & Australia both have a variety of corners with some tight, some long and sweeping with a fair amount of run-off while Monaco & Singapore are mostly tight corners and short straights with very little run-off in most places.
          In many ways Canada, Australia & Spa are like proper circuits that just happen to use some public roads while Monaco, Singapore & Valencia are mainly public roads that have a race track squeezed into them. They may all be classed as street circuits but they’re very different and produce very different types of races.

          1. Canada has two types of corners – chicane and hairpin.

      2. Spa has not used public roads for many many years, it has been a designated race track since some time in the late ’70’s when it was shortened to just over 4miles and some of the more famous corners from the old track were transferred to the new 1.
        It’s hardly a street race tho is it.

        1. I appreciate that, I was just making the point that circuits can be made out of public roads (even if they’re not used as roads any more) without them feeling like a street circuit.

        2. Parts of Spa were on public roads until 2000.

          La Source, Eau Rouge, Raidillon and the Kemmel Straight were public road. The new (post 70s) circuit branched off at Les Combes/Malmedy, and then picked up the public road again at Stavelot. The section through Blanchimont, the Bus Stop and the pit straight again were public road.

          This is evident in the race footage – for example the famous 1998 race where you can see the road markings including STOP markings at La Source.

          I suppose the line is drawn between “street” and “road” circuits. Streets are generally within built up areas while roads go from one area to another. The difference in meaning has been diluted a bit over the years but that was historically the distinction (in general I mean, not just in racing).

        3. as far as I know it was a “street circuit” well into the 21st century, but by 2003/2004 they built bypass roads from stavelot to la source and from la source to les combes

      3. Valencia and Sochi aren’t street circuits then. There is no sign on the surface suggesting any public road…

    3. OmarR-Pepper (@)
      15th October 2014, 4:38

      @kingshark I guess people forget Albert Park is a “street circuit” for the great layout (not 90° corner every 100 meters) and the width. You see Baku’s rendering and at first sight it looks like Sochi’s pitlane, so tight it is.

    4. @kingshark I put Albert Park in the same bag as Montreal. It’s a bit different from Monanco or Singapore.

    5. I know that Albert Park and the Gilles-Villeneuve circuit can be classed as street circuits, but I would prefer to call them circuits on park roads or Park Circuits, for want of a short name.

      But that would not include Monza as that is a circuit purposely built with a Royal Pak.

  9. All this hoo haa about F1 going racing in Sochi is really starting to annoy me. As if this has come as surprise, F1 has hardly been politically correct, Bernie is a businessman, he is driven by money and thats all that matters.

    Sure, Russia is the perenial boogieman to the West, more so now. What about the other chunk of races that are run in countries with very questionable policies?

    China’s does not have human rights, Bahrain isnt a democracy, India is corrupt, Singapore gives off a facade of democracy, Malaysia openly practices apartheid…so Russia is in good company then. F1 used to race in apartheid era South Africa, who were a global pariah at the time. F1 also went through the Iron Curtain in the 80’s to race in Hungary, when it was the perceived to be the “enemy”. So whats the big deal? Sure, I can accept that Russia’s current foreign policy is probably puts them in a worse off category, but this is F1, Bernie does not care what the world thinks.

    If all of those in the media felt so strongly about this, why did they go in droves, as they usually do, to cover the event? Furthermore to write “holier-than-thou” articles from Sochi itself?

    1. I can accept that Russia’s current foreign policy is probably puts them in a worse off category

      If we are talking about foreign policies, United States and Britain are absolutely the worst tyrants we have seen since Nazi Germany. In fact, I’m less concerned with other countries domestic policies, since those are their own thing. As a foreigner to both Russia and US and UK, I’m much more concerned with their foreign policies, since that’s only thing I would have a right to complain about as a foreigner.

      1. Are you criticising US-UK foreign policy?!..hush child..thats blasphemy!!

      2. Oh dear, a Nazi comparison. And directed at the two states that saved the world from Nazism no less. Well done. This is taking whataboutism to its natural conclusion.

        1. Pure whataboutism. Many people who dislike US, UK, EU and the rest of Western democracies show love to Russia and other shady states but can’t help but proudly love their iPhones, Mercedes, Playstations, Air Jordans, LV and so on.

          Very few would change a 3-bedroom apartment in Miami for a villa in Sochi…

          1. @jcost They can love American things (well, things designed there) and hate the government……..

            I guess comparison to the NSDAP is still wrong, though.

      3. While I agree in principle that the US and UK have been despicable in their history (both long ago and recently in Iraq) I thin it is a bit of a hyperbole to compare them to Nazi Germany or even current Russia or even the USSR. I am a dual-national US/UK citizen, so have potentially a biased opinion, but have been opposed to the “Neo-Con” policies of Bush/Blair. No country is blameless in world history — and no country in power is not guilty of at least a little hipocrisy — the main question is would you rather be in a world dominated by NATO or the CCCP? No question at all if you ask me (do your homework and read a bit of history first).

        1. @abbinator
          First thing is, this is not USSR, although for many westerners, it’s still the evil Stalin who is ruling over it to this day. Secondly, we need both sides in order to have some balance in the world. The thing is, NATO is much more aggressive in its expansion and you only need to look at what have they done in the last 30 years to see that based on the deeds, not words, NATO is the cancer of this world. Countless deaths of civilians are far beyond anything Russia has done since it become Russia. They are not the same country they were after the WW2.
          Do you know that for example NATO bombed Serbia without approval of UN? Basically, they said, you can’t stop us, and went with it. We need an opposing force, to keep them in check, because they’ve been showing time and time again that they can’t be relied upon keeping themselves honest and just.

          1. @Biggsy Well my friend, you may be right, but the example you took about bombing Serbia is your own counter argument. They took actions after Serbia moved hundred of thousand of people from their natural home in Kosovo, and killed thousand others. Pure genocide (at the end of the 20th century). Who was going to stop them at that time, Russia!? Give me a break.

    2. Juan Carlos Ciotto
      15th October 2014, 5:58

      I agreee with Biggsy.
      F1 must not run in colonialist countries, such as… ¡Great Bretain and EEUU!…
      F1 must not run in countries with monarchies, such as… ¡Great Bretain and Spain!
      F1 must not run in countries with dubious democracies, such as EEUU (where you can choose between only two candidates witch are pretty the same puppets handled by the true power)
      Don’t swallow the news as they give it to you and think for yourselves.

      1. What’s the problem with monarchies where they have practically zero ruling influence?

        1. OmarR-Pepper (@)
          15th October 2014, 14:34

          @matt90 the only problem I see is people paying taxes so their queens can appear with a new hat in the next photo hahaha.
          Just pure sarcasm, in my country the first lady does the same, and 90% of people just worry about showbiz, smoke and mirrors.

          1. petebaldwin (@)
            15th October 2014, 20:41

            Thing is, the royal family bring in more in tourism and for charity than any of us ever pay out in taxes!

    3. Hm, doesn’t your summary of other races in places where the government could be considered to have some serious flaws rather support what the article says – that Sochi CONTINUES the trend @jaymenon10

      1. @bascb
        I guess you are right. Once we accepted US into F1, we might as well let everyone else join in too. People are too concerned with Russia’s internal politics, and that’s none of their business unless they are Russians. On the other hand, what’s with all the people who’ve been bombed to oblivion by US and UK? I think the most important thing about the country, if you are looking at it as a foreigner, is its foreign policy. I’d always rather have a race in Russia than America (US).

        1. “People are too concerned with Russia’s internal politics, and that’s none of their business unless they are Russians.”

          What a terrible view.

          1. Might be OK if Russias ‘” internal politics” did not include their ex-colonies whether they like it or not.

        2. petebaldwin (@)
          15th October 2014, 20:44

          Again this is missing the point though isn’t it…. There is nothing wrong with F1 being in Russia. There is a lot wrong with the race being used for political reasons (ie Putin trying to improve his international reputation by looking powerful and important by getting more air-time than Lewis Hamilton)

          If Obama was on the TV as much as Putin, I’d be saying exactly the same thing about that race.

    4. Every country has some problems in their domestic policies. But it’s the foreign policies that the people are opposed to. BTW corruption is not a government policy.

      1. Well..in some countries it is.

        1. @jaymemon10

          You are living in a small world aren’t you if yo think corruption is some country’s government policy. Your opinion about every country that F1 races or had raced is basically an impression of what a few selfish people in the government have done and not necessarily what or how the people in those countries are. Stop characterising a country as corrupt just because the government was.

  10. My first thought when reading that Seb Vettel was leaving Red Bull and (most likely) heading to Ferrari was that he already won a good handful of World Championships so now he’s free to fulfil the childhood dream of driving for the prancing horse. I wonder if any more championships are going to happen at that team??
    I was, at that stage, somewhat cynical but in light of recent events I think he should do whatever is going to mean the most to him. While it is comforting to live in the delusion that Formula 1 is relatively ‘safe’ I think it has been brought home to everyone that, for the drivers, it could all be over in an instant.
    Sorry to sound so maudlin.

    1. It can be his dream but I don’t think Seb is going there for a fantasy alone. Seb wants to win and if his experience at Ferrari becomes a 4/5 years without a WDC he will not be a happy man. Remember Alonso?

      1. He’ll certainly want to emulate his childhood hero Schumi, therefore, will be a lot more patient than Alonso is/was.

        1. Don’t you think Alonso has been more than patient?

      2. I straight up do not like Helmut Marko and he’s not helping the case. Seems to me he’s being very dismissive of Vettel, saying “Seb’s done enough winning …now he’s going to Ferrari to coast about for five seasons”.

        He seems to think Seb’s had his fill of glory, and if he’s not with Red Bull he won’t be winning anything. Perhaps Marko’s scared of Vettel now becoming the enemy.

    2. @arki19
      My first thought was that he’s running away from RIC.

      1. I think the very reason this season hasn’t been great for Vettel is lack of will. He doesn’t like the new engine formula, his car was terrible in pre-season and broke down every second race the first half of the season. It all didn’t help, and he lost motivation. If he can find it at Ferrari, good for him. I would love to see last years Vettel in a Ferrari up against Hamilton in his Merc for a good WDC fight. Like Martin Brundle said, Vettel going to Ferrari is probably good for Ferrari, Vettel and Redbull.

  11. I don’t agree entirely with the COTD- all of the street races in the US except Long Beach usually produced poor races. Long Beach was IMO how you do a street circuit right- there were a number of memorable F1 races there, such as 1979, 1982 and 1983. But street circuits have less of an appeal now because of the superb reliablity of the cars- before, the cars used to be much less reliable, and if a driver kept his car working during a punishing and gruelling race like LB- that’s how a driver usually won.

    1. Long Beach needs to return to the calendar. That’s a great track.

  12. Assuming Vettel is going to Ferrari (and it seems all but a certainty now) then I suppose the mystique of Ferrari is part of the lure. At the same time there’s a large practical incentive as well if the rumored reports about Seb becoming the highest paid F1 driver/highest paid sportsman on the planet are correct. “Show me the money!”

    1. I doubt that money played a part. The guy spends his free days drinking in his local town’s pub more than on yachts or expensive holidays. He doesn’t have a management team (or manager) to push up the numbers (for their benefit). Drives to the shops (in a VW bus) to buy his groceries and even does his lawn himself sometimes. He has always openly said he wants to drive for them from day one of his career, it was just a matter of when Ferrari felt that he deserved their seat.

      1. Nice insight. I believe you but how do you know this?

        1. There’s very little published about his private life but here’s one interview with him.


          There was another interview I think around the time of the world cup where he revealed that he likes his local pub because there he can behave like an idiot without anyone caring. Also a story about how journalists asked him to move away because they heard Bernie was close by and they wanted to get pictures of Bernie. Vettel was coming from lunch with Bernie at that restaurant.
          That he doesn’t have a manager was revealed by Christian Horner while explaining Vettel’s decision in some interview, i think on sky.

        2. Sorry, looks like I can’t post links, google “Vettel private life” and see if you can find the same interviews i read.

      2. As much as people complain about him on here and elsewhere, Vettel seems like one of the few legitimately nice guys in F1. I remember after he wrapped up the championships last year in India that photos started coming out from random reporters and other people with pit access of Vettel carrying equipment to the truck to help his mechanics. It wasn’t a photo-op, he just said later that the next race was in a week and that he wanted to make sure that the mechanics could come celebrate with the rest of the team since they were on such a tight schedule.

        1. A nice guy OFF the track.

    2. My suspicion of Vettel going to Ferrari, apart from the romanticness of driving for the prancing horse, is that he still doesn’t feel he has the full respect a four time world champion should have, from varying sources.

      If you look at his performance this season, he has shown in my opinion to be a driver that needs a car to handle within a certain comfort level for him, to extract the maximum. His inability to extract as much as his team mate consistently and his natural desire to set records must really urk, when combined with Alonso’s words at the end of last season about in a lesser car will he do so well , if then he shall be seen as a great. What also may urk him is seeing the likes of Lewis Hamilton fighting for a World Championship in a different team to what he won a previous WC with.

      If you look up and down the paddock, I am willing to bet that most if not all drivers believe that given the right equipment they will be World Champion and in most cases that could also be true that if given right equipment they could be, which is how many see Vettel, with the right equipment he wins.

      Then there are those drivers that given poorer cars (but still capable cars) that win, I think because of the glory he has had with Red Bull, it would be hard for others and himself to ask that of himself until he tries a new challenge with another potentially frontish running team.

      Basically boils down to ego in my opinion for reasons for his move, no different from any other driver basically.

      1. “Alonso’s words at the end of last season about in a lesser car will he do so well”

        So, how’s the great Alonso doing in a lesser car? He’s currently on thirty races without a win.

        “a driver that needs a car to handle within a certain comfort level for him, to extract the maximum”

        That would describe ALL drivers, wouldn’t it?

        “there are those drivers that given poorer cars (but still capable cars) that win”

        Cars like the STR3?

        Fans (and the F1 press are basically a subset of fans, unfortunately) seem absolutely determined to downplay Vettel’s record. At the same time all the top teams in F1 seem extremely eager to pay him boatloads of money to drive for them. This suggests that either the teams are very ignorant of drivers capabilities or that the fans are. I know which way I’d bet.

  13. I still ask myself, why should Mercedes let Lewis go for Alonso? Will it improve their performance? Will Alonso bring more sponsors?

    1. Exactly, I don’t think it’s a case of them letting Lewis go, I still think he could walk from Merc if Nico wins WDC this year, which is probably what Alonso is hoping for?

    2. Alonso brought Santander with him to Ferrari, so if they feel like sponsoring a third team, I guess that there’s that…

  14. Michael Brown (@)
    15th October 2014, 11:52

    Let’s say Vettel starts winning with Ferrari next year. How many people will dismiss that and say he’s only winning because of what Alonso did for the past 5 years?

    1. I know one person will!

    2. People will say “That F15T is a dominant car, one of the greatest cars ever to compete in F1”.

      Compare that to what people would say if Alonso stays at Ferrari and wins next year. “Alonso is an incredible driver, he can win even in a milk-truck like the F15T!”

      Given way identical results will be treated differently depending on who drives the car it’s a no-brainer for Ferrari to unload Alonso and hire Vettel. They can’t win (in the minds of much of the public) as long as Alonso drives for them and they must be getting very tired of having their cars belittled to puff up a drivers reputation.

      Vettel is the anti-Alonso. All the success the former has (past and future) is subtracted from the driver and assigned to the team, while all the success the latter has (past and future) is assigned to the driver and subtracted from the team.

      1. Michael Brown (@)
        15th October 2014, 21:12

        F15T = The Fist

  15. Ron Dennis is being held hostage by Alonso, AGAIN??

    1. Let’s start that conspiracy. It makes perfect sense too because if McLaren are working off a Ferrari technical dossier it would well explain the performance of both teams.

  16. “Myth” of Vettel attractive to Ferrari – there, fixed the headline for you ;)

    Just kidding, I’m not really one of the Vettel bashers, just couldn’t resist.

    1. If Ferrari bought into the “Myth of Vettel” as held by most fans and members of the press, they’d never hire Vettel at all even if he offered to drive for free, let alone make him the highest paid driver in F1.

      The discrepancy between the way the teams view Vettel and the way many fans and members of the press view him is really jarring.

  17. Unrelated to items in today’s roundup, but I was thinking about the ‘start from pitlane penalty’ for replacing an entire power unit. Is this another rule that hasn’t been fully thought through? I say this because surely for some teams starting from the pitlane could be better than a 10 place grid penalty that carries over to the next round. Take a team like Sauber or Lotus for example, they decide to replace the ICE constituting a 10 place grid penalty, then qualify 16th for the race – this puts them back to 22nd on the grid with a 4 place penalty carried over. Depending on the circumstances, maybe this is worse than the pitlane start for replacing the entire power unit? Particularly if the penalty being carried over affects the team in the Double Points Bonanza final race.

    At the risk of making some already convoluted rules even more convoluted, maybe there should be an addition to the pitlane start penalty – replacing the entire PU results in a pit lane start for the current grand prix and a grid penalty of up to 10 places which carries over to the next grand prix. This would solve (to some extent) Vettel’s complaints that he has to sit out of Austin qualifying (I’m sure he’d be thrilled!) as he would have to qualify at least 12th to ensure he doesn’t carry a penalty over to the next race. The downside of course is that this makes an already harsh penalty even harsher, but at least it counteracts the two problems I pointed out.

    (apologies if I’ve missed something in the regulations and I’m talking rubbish, please correct me if that’s the case)

    1. Must admit I was also wondering why the option to change complete PU and start from pitlane option has not been used.
      There must be some mileage in doing that, and it might also be worth while considering it with a stop at the end of first lap, change tyres, and run all of the race on the best tyres.

  18. Regarding COTD, I disagree I think there should be street circuits in F1.

    OK overtaking tends to be harder on street circuits but overtaking opportunities should not be the main thing looked at when deciding on what circuits to race at. In fact to be honest I think most people nowadays putting overtaking as the only thing that matters in a race is completely wrong, A race is & should be about more than just overtaking.

    People moan about Monaco every year but I love Monaco, Its F1 as F1 used to be, Tight circuits with no real runoff where mistakes are actually punished & where driver skill & concentration counts above everything else. Its true there is usually little overtaking at Monaco but I don’t watch just to see overtaking, I watch to see the drivers tested, I watch to watch the cars & when there is overtaking at Monaco (Which despite complaints there actually often is a bit of) you know its been as the result of driver skill & thats its actually exciting to see it happen (Like it used to be everywhere).

    Singapore is the same, Its a real challenge for the drivers not just physically but also mentally because of how long the race tends to be. And the racing there is usually fairly good in my view, Its becomes one of the newer venues which I look forward to.

    The race at Sochi wasn’t brilliant but I didn’t think it was really that bad as there was some close racing & there was a decent amount of overtaking, If that race had happened 10 years ago it would be getting scores of 8-9.
    I’d also argue that its a good circuit where racing/overtaking is more than possible, As I said already there was some in the F1 race but the support races (GP3/GP2) features a lot of overtaking & a lot of good racing so quite clearly it is a circuit that can produce both.

    Someone above mentioned Indycar & how there races on street circuits are rubbish, Again I’d disagree & also point out that there street races tend to be some of the most popular events on there schedule. Long Beach is considered there 2nd most important event (Behind the Indy 500) & is always well attended. There season Opening St.Petersburg race in Florida has become a very popular event, Toronto is a classic & there’s been a lot of disappointment from Indycar fans about it not been on the calender next year, The old Surfers Paradise street race in Australia was massively popular as was the old Vancouver street circuit. Belle-Isle & Houston produced some very good races this year as well & again are popular amongst Indycar fans.
    Its also worth pointing out that every Indycar street race is always very well attended & some of the higher rated races on TV over there.

    1. Racing isn’t racing if there is no overtaking.

      With your outlook you could get rid of racing and make it a long weekend of qualifying. Because the results of qualifying would be the race result.

      1. ColdFly F1 (@)
        15th October 2014, 14:43

        PeterG I agree with @w-k.
        Who wants the Tour de France to be just time trials?
        Who wants football to be just penalty kicks?
        Who wants tennis to be only about the fastest serve?
        Who wants cricket to be just the tea break? ;-)

      2. I didn’t say there should be no overtaking, I just feel that far too much emphasis is put on overtaking, Or more specifically the quantity of position changes nowadays & people just ignore everything else.

        For my its nice when a REAL & exciting overtaking move happens, But as long as there is some good, close racing going on or if there’s something else of interest going on to keep me entertained during a race I don’t need to see 30 passes, I don’t care about the numbers as my primary enjoyment of the races doesn’t come from overtaking alone, It comes from everything from the challenge to the spectacle of watching the cars flying around the various circuits etc..

        One of the things I’ve hated about F1 the past few years is that far too much emphasis is put on the number of passes each race & it now seems that more often than not thats all people care about, If there’s less than 20 passes, Less than 3 pit stops, No action for more than 2 corners etc.. people just whine about how boring it is while ignoring the other things which USED to be the primary ‘hook’ for people & that was the racing/spectacle/challenge overall.

        Maybe its just because I started watching in an era when you didn’t see a lot of overtaking as in the 70s you were lucky if the TV coverage caught it & if you were at a circuit with no TV’s around the tracks, No mobile/tablets to watch on if something didn’t happen in-front of you, You never saw it.
        The thing that got me into the sport, What kept me hooked for as long as I have been was the racing, The cars been driven at high speeds, The challenge of the circuits, The skill of the drivers & the excitement of watching all of those factors. If a race featured little overtaking I didn’t/don’t care because for me overtaking is just a small part of what I’ve always enjoyed about this sport, Its great when it happens but I don’t need a ton of it.

        One of my biggest criticisms of F1 the past few years is that the focus has been solely on overtaking & with things like DRS now we do see an awful lot more overtaking, But most of it is of such low quality & is so ridiculously easy that its just not that exciting & doesn’t really mean anything… Its basically just been devalued in my view & has also taken away much of what I did actually enjoy about the racing, That been close, hard fought battles where the skill of the drivers racecraft & where the art of defensive driving, attacking & overtaking were the most important factors.

        If you only want to go to tracks that can produce 50 passes during a race then your going to lose tracks like Monaco, Suzuka, Hungary & Nurburgring, Circuits that while not easy to overtake on are actually a challenge for the drivers & tracks that actually push & reward them… Basically your going to kill what racing was traditionally always about because for the most part its certainly not been about overtaking alone.

        1. I agree with your statement that there is too much emphasis on overtaking. But there must exist the chance of overtaking. Too often at street circuits if the leading driver makes a mistake, which on a lot of circuits would lead to an overtaking attempt. At street circuits an attempt to overtake is almost always impossible.

      3. If u want passing watch a kart race @W-K

  19. Another myth is McLaren Honda I believe….

    1. My Italian is a bit rusty but Luca says Alonso will be leaving because of the changes in the team and because he has not won and wants to win. Well this is nothing new really. We all knew this but at least we can now safely assume that staying with Ferrari is not an option when it is coming from Luca.

  20. Funny video. Joking aside the cars need to have 2 lifting points, far enough apart that even if corners have been knocked off the CoG will be between them. That way the marshals will be able to get safely away from the trackside and the tractor ASAP.

  21. Surely Alonso’s prime target is merc for 2016 bt he also likes Rosberg as his future team mate more than Hamilton. Coz if he is battling with Ham there will be always a 50 :50 for title.

  22. I’d like someone to make a Chrome plug-in that blocks me from ever having to read a quote from Helmut Marko.

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