Alonso wants replacement for “obsolete” Formula 1 qualifying format

80 comments on “Alonso wants replacement for “obsolete” Formula 1 qualifying format”

1. 

   F1 frog (@f1frog)
   30th September 2023, 0:11

   Single lap qualifying is great in theory but simply doesn’t work in practice because it is impossible to guarantee equal track conditions to everyone and makes it a lottery. I think current qualifying is perfect.
   1. 

      slowmo (@slowmo)
      30th September 2023, 0:30

      I think I might be tempted if they did 2 runs then took the average or sum. So you run first run in championship order then reverse for the second run from slowest to fastest. Might mean if you bin a run you’re at the back but small mistakes could still salvage something on the other run. It would also potentially mitigate some issues like running on a drying or wet track at different times.

      Obviously we have tried messing with qualifying over the last 30 years so I think Alonso might be misremembering some stuff. I’d certainly scrap DRS for qualifying as a start. Maybe bring back a qualifying tyre as lets be honest once used to qualify, teams really do avoid using that tyre again as its best performance is gone. Provide a qualifying tyre and 2 race compounds.
      1. 

         Pedro Andrade
         30th September 2023, 10:14

         Aggregate qualifying was trialled in 2005, and it was still boring and a bit confusing because you had it in different days, it was more challenging to keep up.
      2. 

         SteveP
         30th September 2023, 14:16

         So you run first run in championship order then reverse for the second run

         Round the course the other direction? That could be interesting :)

         Oh, not what you meant. Could still be fun though.
         1. 

            baasbas
            2nd October 2023, 8:35

            I’d watch that :-)
   2. 

      Ajayrious (@ajayrious)
      30th September 2023, 10:38

      it is impossible to guarantee equal track conditions to everyone in any qualifying system. Especially one where there are other cars on the track at the same time because of dirty air/traffic/track rubber levels etc.
   3. 

      S
      30th September 2023, 10:53

      it is impossible to guarantee equal track conditions to everyone and makes it a lottery

      It’s not necessary to guarantee anything. But that certainly doesn’t make it a ‘lottery.’
      A lottery requires no skill at all – but qualifying with extreme jeopardy (as in a one-lap shootout) will always reward driving talent and the taking of calculated risks.
      This is a driver saying he wants more to lose from both circumstances beyond his control and from his own driving errors. How often do we ever hear that in F1?

      I feel sad every time I read of someone essentially saying they want the grid to be formed in the most predictable manner possible with the most predictable result possible. Giving them multiple goes at it is just giving them a free pass.
      1. 

         SadF1fan
         30th September 2023, 11:19

         It is a lottery.
         In general the last one in the session has the best conditions due to rubber being put down, also called track evolution.
         This can be ruined by weatherconditions.

         So unlike now where you can anticipate on weather conditions and track evolution, it would become a game of chance whether you do or do not get good track conditions, in other words a lottery.

         You might aswell draw names from a hat or use a bingo wheel to decide the starting grid…

         F1 is supposed to be a sport, showcasing excellence, and not a gameshow, entertainment at all cost.
         1. 

            S
            30th September 2023, 11:43

            In general the last one in the session has the best conditions due to rubber being put down, also called track evolution. This can be ruined by weatherconditions.

            Nobody in entitled to the best conditions. They all get whatever they get. Some days it works to their advantage, while other days it’s to their disadvantage.
            That’s not a lottery, that’s a variable.
            If it was that important, they’d run it indoors away from any influence from the weather and other variables.

            You might aswell draw names from a hat or use a bingo wheel to decide the starting grid…

            They would be great ways to decide the grid fairly – however, I’d rather see them do it in the cars on the track, personally – facing whatever conditions that are present at the time, and being as open to possible to suffer the consequences of such, including their own decisions and reactions to it.

            F1 is supposed to be a sport, showcasing excellence, and not a gameshow, entertainment at all cost.

            And what could be more sporting than sending the athletes out to do their best in whatever conditions the track happens to be in? Forget the advantages of gaining the most rubbered-in track and second-chances at doing laps.
            An ‘entertaining gameshow’ sounds much more like a description of chucking all the cars out there at the same time to trip each other up at crucial moments by blocking and dawdling around at 50kph.

            F1 stopped being a proper sport a long time ago. This is show business, and every team in F1 is there for the money first and foremost.
            Everyone who watches it does so because it is entertaining – not despite it being entertaining.
            1. 

               SadF1fan
               30th September 2023, 12:15

               It’s literally predetermined what your place in line is to go out in quali in the system you propose, it is therefore inherently unfair, and unsporting and therefore a lottery.
               Your suggestion of having indoor racetracks is so preposterous it’s borderline trolling.

               Furthermore you are stating you are proponent of a gamesshow rather than a sport.
            2. 

               S
               30th September 2023, 12:42

               It’s literally predetermined what your place in line is to go out in quali

               The order may be predetermined (or not, depending on the implementation) – but the conditions certainly aren’t.

               Your suggestion of having indoor racetracks is so preposterous it’s borderline trolling.

               Car racing is an outdoor sport, so weather is an ever-present factor. Deal with it.

               Furthermore you are stating you are proponent of a gamesshow rather than a sport.

               Proudly. I know what F1 is and feel no shame in wanting to be entertained by it.
            3. 

               SadF1fan
               30th September 2023, 17:31

               And because the conditions certainly aren’t it’s inherently unfair to have 1 lap quali and you are the one that wanted fair.
               Therefore It’s also questionable why you are suggesting indoor racetracks, but given your answer its clear it was a strawman argument.
            4. 

               S
               1st October 2023, 6:28

               And because the conditions certainly aren’t it’s inherently unfair to have 1 lap quali and you are the one that wanted fair.

               It’s not unfair, it’s circumstance.

               Therefore It’s also questionable why you are suggesting indoor racetracks, but given your answer its clear it was a strawman argument.

               I don’t think changing weather is ‘unfair.’ The comment about eliminating of variables (indoors) was to satisfy you and anyone else who thinks that all competitors need to operate under the exact same conditions at all times. It’s the only way to achieve it – and as you seem to have figured out, it’s so ridiculous that nobody would take it seriously.
               And yet, you did.
   4. 

      MichaelN
      30th September 2023, 14:39

      Sure, conditions are not entirely equal at all times. But as seen nearly 20 years ago, it’s usually close enough. And so what if they aren’t? They’re not equal now either, and teams just go for ‘good enough’. Nobody can control the wind, the shade of clouds affecting track temperature, etc.

      The current format is fun for some. Fair enough. Others find it boring, not only because it’s largely irrelevant who finished 16th, but also because it often devolves into bad coverage with a static shot of the last corner and all eyes being on the timing bars.

      Qualifying is the only time the cars are pushed to their limit. Why not show that in all its impressive glory?
      1. 

         ben (@dubaemon)
         2nd October 2023, 20:34

         I fully agree, the most exciting thing is the whole lap replay of the pole sitter.
         If it wasn’t for the commentators it d be really painful.
         I understand it is tricky to try and focus on the one exciting car on single lap but focusing on all of the ones cross the line is meaningless.
   5. 

      PMccarthy_is_a_legend (@pmccarthy_is_a_legend)
      30th September 2023, 15:51

      Nothing wrong with qualifying. It’s perfect as it is.
      1. 

         f1fish (@f1fish)
         1st October 2023, 14:19

         An alternative qualifying format for the elite sport of Formula 1, Q1 should be the bottom 10 from the previous race with the bottom six being eliminated after 15 minutes of qualifying. Q2 the remaining 14 with six being eliminated after 15 minutes of qualifying. Q3 the top eight for 15 minutes of qualifying.
   6. 

      bull mello (@bullmello)
      30th September 2023, 23:46

      Bingo!
      I disagree with Alonso on this.
      Other different qualifying methods have not worked out.
      Please leave this qualifying alone.
      1. 

         Sonny Crockett (@sonnycrockett)
         1st October 2023, 10:54

         You could have a single lap qualifying with a few tweaks:

         • Drivers go in the same order as the current championship standings (for the first race of the season, pre-season testing times are used to determine the order).

         • Drivers are released at 1 minute intervals and have one warm-up lap followed by an actual qualifying lap. They are given maximum and minimum speed parameters for the warm-up lap to prevent bunching.

         • If a driver makes a mess of their lap… tough.

         • Drivers that are lower down the championship order potentially get the benefit of track evolution.

         • If the driver in front of you crashes or causes a yellow flag incident, you get to retake you warm-up and qualifying lap once the track is clear.
         1. 

            bull mello (@bullmello)
            1st October 2023, 21:57

            What if it rains during qualifying? Maybe rain starts? Or, maybe it stops.
            This is one problem with single lap qualifying.

            At least when that happens during current qualifying, different drivers should have the same kind of chance with the rain.
   7. 

      BasCB (@bascb)
      2nd October 2023, 12:59

      I don’t even think single lap qualifying IS a great idea in theory really.

      I think it might make sense in a computer game, where it is exciting and you can always reload to try again. In any real race weekend it is not great at all.

      – you get only a single car on track every few minutes, and since most cars/drivers interest few fans it will tank any viewing figures (apart from replays where they only show the “interesting” bits)
      – Anything that can disrupt a lap, be it technical with the car, an issue with the track, the weather or some glitches or even protestors getting on track etc. will influence the result of qualifying. Finding good and fair solutions to that will take a LOT of time and will be hard to define clearly and fairly.
      – it takes away a huge amount of thinking and strategy with tyres, tyre warming, build up, old vs. new tyres and even tension of “who gets through to the next stage” that makes qualifying a really interesting part of the weekend currently. It takes away agency and tension.
      – you only get to see your favourite driver once.

      And most importantly, qualifying really does not need any “fixing”.
2. 

   Roger Ayles (@roger-ayles)
   30th September 2023, 0:29

   We tried single lap qualifying back in 2003-05 and it was awful in basically every way.

   Track evolution and changeable weather made it more of an unfair lottery than a true test of outright car/driver performance and pace and made several sessions utterly pointless as a result of mid session weather changes.

   But above all else it was an awful, dull and boring spectacle for fans both watching on TV and especially those at the track who were sitting there seeing only 1 car on a fast lap every 90-ish seconds with significantly less track action overall. Hence why apparently ratings and attendance for qualifying declined those 3 years. Hardly anybody liked it.

   With what we had before and after at least with multiple cars out there everyone gets an opportunity under more equal track conditions. Plus you have the tension and excitement at the end of each segment as times improve and positions change as each car crosses the line in the closing moments.

   That is far more of a spectacle and far more thrilling and exciting than 1 car every 90 seconds when you know well in advance that positions won’t change.

   It was always a bit of an anti climax which is why so few of those single lap sessions are remembered or got talked about after the fact.
3. 

   Esploratore (@esploratore1)
   30th September 2023, 0:44

   Alonso might be forgetting the qualifying that was happening until 2002, I think, but definitely back when hakkinen and schumacher were competing for the title in 2000, when you had 1 hour and all drivers would go out on track, depending on when they preferred doing so, so usually there were multiple attempts from each driver, and there were no eliminations like there are now.

   I’m surprised they haven’t gone back to it, as it seemed the better qualifying way.
   1. 

      AlanD
      30th September 2023, 2:42

      Esplatore, I think the big problem with pre-2002 qualifying was to do with TV coverage. We kept getting sessions where everyone just sat in the pits for 45 minutes waiting for everyone else to go out, set times, rubber up the track, and 45 minutes of an hour long session with nothing at all happening made for very bad TV. It didn’t happen every time, but in the final year of the format it was becoming all too common. From a TV point of view, single lap qualifying which replaced it was pretty good because you got to see every car, and it was continual action for the hour.
      1. 

         Keith Campbell (@keithedin)
         30th September 2023, 10:11

         Yeah this is what I remember too. 45-50 minutes of nothing happening apart from maybe some Minardis or Jordans going out to lay down some rubber, then the big teams doing nothing relevant until the last 10 minutes when track conditions were optimal. Then sure, maybe the last 30 seconds is exciting, but we still get that in Q3 in the current 3 session format.

         The difference is there are 3 exciting points in each qualifying, with the midfield teams being under threat in at the end of Q1 and Q2, and occasionally even some big names under pressure at those points if they are lacking performance or don’t get clean runs in for whatever reason.

         Another advantage of this format is if Q1 starts dry and then it starts raining, there are still relevant laps in Q2 and Q3. In a single one hour session, it could be over after the first lap with the rest just being waiting for the clock to run out.

         No format is perfect, but the three session format is the best overall in my opinion. It solves most of the problems (traffic being less of an issue in Q2 and Q3 after some cars are knocked out), and has cars on track posting relevant times for the longest amount of time.
         1. 

            Jonathan Parkin
            30th September 2023, 15:22

            It must be said therefore that no qualifying system is perfect. My criticism of the current one is sometimes a driver in the 11-15 bracket is slower than someone who qualified in the 16-20 bracket

            The reason why I will always support 12 laps, one hour qualifying is because it is simple to explain and understand in a single sentence. No other words needed. And at the end you have 20 drivers from fastest to slowest. Furthermore given that at maximum you could do six timed laps, deleting your fastest, 2nd fastest, 3rd fastest time if you had transgressed the regulations served as a suitable punishment and even better still we didn’t have to wait for the current penalty system to take effect which results in farce.

            I still remember at one Italian GP the penalties got so ridiculous only Lewis I think it was started where he qualified
            1. 

               Nikos (@exeviolthor)
               30th September 2023, 16:27

               It was a very good format which became boring only when Ferrari became very dominant (all formats can be boring when a car is dominant).
               I remember a few years ago there was a race (cannot remember which) where because they were expecting qualifying not to go ahead due to bad weather, teams were expecting that the times of practise 3 would be used to determing the grid (that’s what happened in the end).
               It was by far the most exciting “qualifying” session since the 90s.
            2. 

               Esploratore (@esploratore1)
               1st October 2023, 1:08

               I’m not sure if you remember wrong, but a quali session I checked out recently since I love wet weather in f1 was austin 2015, they did q1 with full wet tyres, as well as q2, conditions deteriorated slightly and they skipped q3 and q2 was used to set the grid, I know there were talks about using fp3 to set the grid, but it didn’t happen in that occasion.

               Was it a different one, the one you’re thinking about? And what era was it?
            3. 

               Esploratore (@esploratore1)
               1st October 2023, 1:09

               My comment is related to nikos ofc, there’s no reply button.
4. 

   Antz (@antznz)
   30th September 2023, 1:31

   I bet Aston Martin would love the prize money from finishing second in the constructors, and could realistically have had it too…. I’m curious to see how things play out and if they’re happy with the status quo long term or there’s a limit to how many hundreds of millions one invests in their son.

   My understanding is that Larence has always been big on motorsport as well as a savvy businessman, so AM isn’t solely about giving his son a seat – it’s a passion business based project too. Surely there’s a point soon that reason wins over sentiment? Especially when a big chunk of their losses could be negated by a better constructors finishing position.
   1. 

      Esploratore (@esploratore1)
      1st October 2023, 1:14

      Not defending stroll, having a decent car really exposed him this year, especially with a strong team mate, but I think 2nd would’ve been unrealistic: first of all you can’t expect to have 2 drivers like alonso in the same team, you can maybe expect a perez in the 2nd seat, and as far as I see it they would now be fighting with ferrari and merc, all pretty close, for 2nd, but considering the evolution of the car and the fact there’s still several races, I have a hard time thinking they could even get 3rd with a decent 2nd driver by the time the season ends.

      Though I’m guessing stroll is eventually costing them 4th place, cause mclaren would be recovering now even with a better 2nd driver on aston with the car they have, but they would be around 130 points behind if not for stroll and that’s unrealistic to recover.
5. 

   Coventry Climax
   30th September 2023, 1:50

   “I think this qualifying format is obsolete. It’s the same for 20 or 25 years and the cars are not the same as 20 or 25 years. We have hybrid engines, we have to charge, discharge, we have to cool the tyres. So the only way to go forward is one lap.”

   So, not the only way forward at all: Solving the charge/discharge issues as well as tyre cooling are options as well.

   How much of Aston Martin’s loss is due to Stroll’s crashes?
   1. 

      S
      30th September 2023, 10:34

      How much of Aston Martin’s loss is due to Stroll’s crashes?

      None, because it all falls under the budget cap.
      Sorry – you can’t blame this one on Lance.
      1. 

         SadF1fan
         30th September 2023, 11:21

         Crashes mean lower results, which mean fewer points, which means less prize money.

         You can definitely blame this partially on Stroll’s performance.
         1. 

            S
            30th September 2023, 11:47

            How many times has Lance crashed while in a points-paying position?
            Any time he is outside the top 10 is inconsequential.

            He doesn’t even crash very often, anyway.
            1. 

               SadF1fan
               30th September 2023, 12:17

               His performance is in general lacking, therefore fewer points and less prize money and therefore partially to blame for the financial losses.
            2. 

               S
               30th September 2023, 12:59

               (shrugs)
               Never in F1’s history have crashes or poor results had so little impact on the financial sustainability or profitability of the teams. The current teams have been very successful in making on-track performance as irrelevant as possible to their operations financially – to the point that, under the budget cap they created, they are virtually ineffectual.

               The lengths some go to to blame a particular person they don’t like for any negative outcome is just incredible.
            3. 

               SadF1fan
               30th September 2023, 17:34

               It’s actually the complete opposite, because of the budget cap, teams know beforehand exactly how much they will be spending in a given year.
               The only variable left is ontrack performance, that determines prize money and sponsorship income.
            4. 

               S
               1st October 2023, 6:32

               It’s actually the complete opposite, because of the budget cap, teams know beforehand exactly how much they will be spending in a given year.

               Indeed they do – so they’d know exactly what their minimum net operating profit for the year will be in advance.
               You won’t hear them complaining about losses based on performance or results, because minimum prize money is already factored into their accounting.
         2. 

            MichaelN
            30th September 2023, 14:52

            The prize money is not a big deal, not only because scoring a lot points also comes with higher entry fees for the following season, but because the real money is in the commercial rirights payout, which has been rendered largely unrelated from performance thanks to AMs predecessor threatening to take FOM to court over it.

            F1 teams, especially the smaller ones, almost pay for themselves. Just note the lack of third party sponsorship on many cars.
6. 

   David BR (@david-br)
   30th September 2023, 2:10

   The qualifying format is fine. Sure not perfect for the drivers but so what? Disputes over track position add to the drama.
   If you want to spice the format up a bit, simply do something like remove 7 from Q1 and 7 from Q2: that way they become more competitive while Q3 is more selective with just the top 6 competing for pole.
7. 

   Gerrit
   30th September 2023, 2:24

   Simple, split the field by marble draw into two. Each 10 have a separate qualifying session and the fastest 10 (or 12) from both groups go into next and final qualifying round. Means you have cars on track that are not bunched.

   Single car qualifying works well too if two cars are on the circuit. A car will do a warm up lap, followed by a fast lap. Whilst on the fast lap (halfway round) the next car starts it warm up lap. That way spectators see a car every 30 seconds or so depending upon lap times. Also depends upon the TV commentary team how well it sells. Large screens and good commentary keeps the fans informed even if no car is visible in their direct sight. Bathurst 1000 top ten shootout is usually a highlight of the qualifying session. Balls out and millimeter tight display of fast driving.

   Track changes are a fact of life as are yellow and red flags. You cannot guarantee track and weather perfection for every driver at all times. Adds to the drama.
   1. 

      Jere (@jerejj)
      30th September 2023, 7:24

      A split format with one driver from each team per segment 1 & 2, a la Super Formula, would be decent.
      While guaranteeing track & weather perfection at all times is effectively impossible, the current format at least allows drivers to go on track at any time within a segment time rather than at a given fixed time, like with the single-lap format, which minimizes the impact.
   2. 

      Biskit Boy (@sean-p-newmanlive-co-uk)
      30th September 2023, 8:27

      100% agreed. This is the most obvious thing to do. It’s not a complete fix, it should reduce the issue by 50%.
      Additionally they should do what Indycar does and move the timing line to before the pit entry. This means there will be much fewer cars on slowdown laps, so maybe another 50% reduction on the issue. So if my maths is right, that’s a total 75% reduction in the chances of encountering a slow car on your fast lap.

      Seems like a no brainer to me.
      1. 

         Bullfrog (@bullfrog)
         30th September 2023, 14:11

         Does this “discharge” mean they can’t do that, and have to trundle around for a while after finishing their lap? I guess we’ll find out with the hybrid Indycars next year.
         “We have to cool the tyres” is testicles though. Get some proper tyres.
         1. 

            S
            30th September 2023, 14:31

            Or build proper cars that don’t overheat the tyres. It’s a self-induced problem from the teams’ side.
      2. 

         Jere (@jerejj)
         30th September 2023, 17:00

         @sean-p-newmanlive-co-uk Temporarily moving the timing line would be easier said than done & doesn’t really have an impact anyway.
         1. 

            Biskit Boy (@sean-p-newmanlive-co-uk)
            30th September 2023, 21:34

            Moving the timing line is easy. The technical guys have said so.
            It would have a big impact. A car could do a fast lap and need only 2 laps to do it. Currently they need to do 3.
            As i said. Do the maths.
         2. 

            Alesici
            1st October 2023, 7:18

            Jere, sometimes when someone suggests a good proposal, you really can be a dumb troll. Moving timing equipment (or installing 2 sets) is dead easy, and obviously has a big impact.
            But I am curious about the effect on the cars. I wondered about Alonso saying ‘discharging’, but surely at the end of the fast lap, there will be no charge left to discharge, so I think perhaps that’s not an issue for removing the in lap.
            1. 

               SteveP
               1st October 2023, 13:13

               But I am curious about the effect on the cars. I wondered about Alonso saying ‘discharging’, but surely at the end of the fast lap, there will be no charge left to discharge,

               Agreed. If there was any charge to discharge, then what they would need is a set of discharge equipment and a pit crew…
               Oh, yeah, that’s where they’re headed.
   3. 

      S
      30th September 2023, 10:57

      Good call.
      It doesn’t have to be the same format at every event, either. Change is refreshing from week to week.
      Part of the monotony in F1 comes not just from having the same cars finishing in the same places all the time, but also from having the same format all the time.
8. 

   Jere (@jerejj)
   30th September 2023, 5:49

   While his words are already familiar to me from the Italian GP weekend, I couldn’t disagree more with him.
   The present format that has existed since 2006 is far from obsolete & as has been pointed out often, the single-lap format from 2003-05 had more cons than pros because of track evolution, changeable weather conditions when applicable, etc., so reintroducing that format would be unworthy.
   1. 

      Simon
      30th September 2023, 16:58

      #1, #5, #7
      1. 

         Jere (@jerejj)
         30th September 2023, 17:01

         I wonder what you imply by those three number references.
9. 

   Ω (@omega)
   30th September 2023, 8:06

   How about changing the time limit. So instead of having to cross the start line before time runs out, like we have now, it couldnbe that you have to leave te pits befote time runs out, then you can take as long as you want on your outlap/quali lap.

   It wouldn’t solve everything but it should reduce the last sector bunching a bit.

   Ofcourse you’d have to reduce the time for each part of qualifying by 4 or 5 minutes to keep about the same time frame as now.
10. 

    Jeffrey Powell
    30th September 2023, 8:17

    What about the Indy method half the cars on one round which at the moment would be two segments of ten ,then the first five from each segment. The initial choice made on the previous race positions split between each group that way any poor performances from last race due to anomalies would be ironed out. Having watched the qualifying on Indy I found it more entertaining than F1 maybe due to the cars being more equal . I’ve been watching F1 since 1965 so have experienced all variations , I’m convinced perhaps with some tweaking this offers a good solution to the overcrowding problems Alonso and others are most concerned about.
11. 

    Moshambles (@moshambles)
    30th September 2023, 9:06

    No Fernando. The current format is the best system F1 has ever had and constantly delivers exciting and often exhilarating finales, just as much in the Hybrid era as before. You can count on qualy to be exiting in a way you can’t with the race. Single lap qualy was a novelty for a time but soon became a reliable snooze fest and was ultimately ditched. Please don’t mess with the one excellent part of the weekend. The current issue is a problem for the teams and driver, not for me or most fans I would guess.
12. 

    SteveP
    30th September 2023, 9:39

    Formula 1’s maximum lap time rule has been tweaked in recent races as the FIA tries to prevent drivers bunching up on-track in qualifying sessions and risking a collision.

    Why not close the pit lane exit 2 minutes before the chequered flag for qualy?
    Forget the maximum lap time. Add in an extreme penalty for impeding any driver on a hot lap – 10 places (with a proviso that if they can’t go back 10 places from the qualy position then there’s an additional penalty of some sort up to and including DQ)

    They then have 2 minutes out on track to sort themselves out without impeding drivers on a hot lap.

    I’m assuming that 2 minutes out there faffing about at slow speed will leave them with tyres that are too cold to do anything useful.
13. 

    Alistair
    30th September 2023, 9:48

    I think the current format is probably not fun for the drivers, but that’s why we shouldn’t listen to drivers about everything. The fact that it isn’t perfect and leads to track disputes is exciting. It’s the best format I can remember since the old hour long slogs of no-one going on track.
14. 

    Ahmad Albashrawi (@abashrawi)
    30th September 2023, 11:05

    I think they can still have the current format of 3Qs, with Q3 being a single lap for each driver in descending order of Q2 top 10.
15. 

    Chris Horton
    30th September 2023, 11:28

    Single lap quali was incredibly boring.
    1. 

       S
       30th September 2023, 11:51

       I find it hilarious that an audience that thought F1’s multiple 60-minute long qualifying sessions and multiple 90-minute long practice sessions were exciting also thought that being able to see each and every car do their entire (and only) qualifying lap was incredibly boring…
       1. 

          LyndaMarks
          30th September 2023, 13:29

          Because it was boring.

          But then you know that.

          It’s clear from your comments that your not really a fan of the sport and just want to turn it into a big artificial gimmick ridden show.

          Most here are actually fans of ghe sport and prefer F1 to remain what it’s always been which is a sport that happens to be entertaining because it’s a sport.

          If you just want a silly artificial gimmick ridden show then go watch nascar or something and leave F1 to those of us who actually understand it and have a genuine love, passion and respect for it!
          1. 

             S
             30th September 2023, 14:08

             It’s clear from your comments that your not really a fan of the sport and just want to turn it into a big artificial gimmick ridden show.

             I’m not your kind of fan, that’s for sure. But F1 viewers aren’t all the same, and don’t all want the same things. F1 can be anything that the decision-makers want and decree it to be.

             Most here are actually fans of ghe sport and prefer F1 to remain what it’s always been which is a sport that happens to be entertaining because it’s a sport.

             F1 was a kind of partially (at best) a sport, but it’s now even less of one. The engineering aspect invariably makes it less of one, as do many other factors on and off the track.
             Anyway – F1 is (loosely) a sporting activity that explicitly intends to be entertaining. It requires it, in fact.
             It is entertainment by design via the medium (or with the facade) of sport, as every aspect of it has been deliberately created and/or modified to be entertaining to an audience.
             When it is not entertaining, it is not profitable – and when it is not profitable, it is not sustainable.

             If you just want a silly artificial gimmick ridden show then go watch nascar or something and leave F1 to those of us who actually understand it and have a genuine love, passion and respect for it!

             NASCAR has exactly the same sporting content that F1 does. The competitors do the sporty bits, regardless of what the technical and sporting rules or presentation aspects involve.

             You make it sound as though I personally have some control over F1’s direction as a product.
             It sounds a lot like I understand it more than you do… I acknowledge what it has become and where it is headed, without being stuck on what it used to be. A reminder that no racing series has changed as much as F1 has, nor is based around the concept of change as much as F1 is.
             If you have as much love, passion and respect for it as you suggest, perhaps you should be embracing the changes rather than opposing them.
          2. 

             MichaelN
             30th September 2023, 14:45

             Different fans prefer different things.

             I don’t watch qualifying because the format doesn’t interest me, and the coverage does a very poor job showing the laps.

             I would watch single lap qualifying. It’s great to see each car push it’s limit and see all of it. It’s great to see the differences between the drivers and the cars.

             There are pros and cons to every system, and different ones from different perspectives too.
       2. 

          BasCB (@bascb)
          2nd October 2023, 13:08

          It WAS boring S. Because most fans have as little interest in sitting there “watching” brundle and crofty blabbering on for 45 minutes while the lone Haas, Williams or maybe Alfa Romeo does a few laps until the action starts with 10-15 minutes to theend of the session as is it to sit around watching the first 10-12 cars do their warmup lap, fast lap and inlap with nice pauses in between until the drivers of interest start setting some laps.

          Those long sessions with little happening made sense for cars that constantly break down, and for TV that is largely highlights for most viewers (since you can just cut out the 75% nobody is interested in). The same goes for something like single lap qualifying – you can just cut in those few laps of interest. Watching it live is not going to pull any decent viewing figures nor does it get people dragging themselves out of the tents and onto the grandstands long before the race.
16. 

    DB-C90 (@dbradock)
    30th September 2023, 12:48

    Here’s a thought.

    Instead of everyone waiting until the last possible second and being out on the track queuing up at the same time, why not jump out when the track is clear.

    I’ve been saying for several seasons now that teams/drivers are their own worst enemies because they all do the same thing. And they continue to even though they end up with their drivers severely compromised.

    I noticed that Williams and Albon has been one who have broken that and often do their run on a clear track to optimise absolutely everything for his lap.

    If teams and drivers are finding it difficult all they need to do is try something a bit more sensible so their drivers get a better and cleaner outlap instead of just doing the same thing over and over again.
17. 

    StefMeister (@stefmeister)
    30th September 2023, 13:38

    Of all the various qualifying format’s ive seen used in F1 and various other categories over the years i honestly believe that the format we have in F1 currently is the best I’ve seen.

    I was actually really excited about the prospect of the single lap format back in 2003 as i did think seeing every lap and drivers only having that one shot would be fun.

    However it was clear to me after a few weekends that the format had more negatives than positives and it was overall something i ended up finding pretty dull. And there multiple attempts to tweak it to find something that worked better didn’t fix the issues. That aggregate time variation with Sunday morning qualifying they used for about 5 races in 2005 been by far the worst.
    1. 

       BasCB (@bascb)
       2nd October 2023, 13:08

       Exactly @stefmeister.
18. 

    PeterG
    30th September 2023, 13:48

    I don’t get the need to alter the one part of F1 that a vast majority of fans agree isn’t broken and doesn’t need fixing.

    I think in every poll, survey or fan forum thats been conducted i think it’s been around 85-90%+ of fans say they love the current qualifying format.

    The format consistently throws up some drama, surprises, excitement and mega qualifying laps. Where is the need for any change?

    We had the one lap qualifying, We saw what it was and know it doesn’t work all that well and is devoid of the same drama and excitement we have now. I mean all you need to do is go back and watch those sessions in 2003/04/05 and it’s plainly obvious how bad that format it. Just go watch them if you never have and tell me where the excitement was because most fans at the time certainly didn’t see any which is why everyone started turning it off.
    1. 

       S
       30th September 2023, 14:29

       I think in every poll, survey or fan forum thats been conducted i think it’s been around 85-90%+ of fans say they love the current qualifying format.

       It’s a good format – but that doesn’t mean they don’t like any other formats too. The specific question is as important as the answer.

       The format consistently throws up some drama, surprises, excitement and mega qualifying laps. Where is the need for any change?

       Do you eat the same meal every day? Or do you like to change it up occasionally and have something different every now and then? Even if it’s ‘perfect’ for you, you must desire something different sometimes, right? Perhaps change could even bring about even further improvements to your perfect food… You don’t know if you don’t try anything.
       F1 has changed a bit since last time other qualifying formats were used – but the same arguments against any change in F1 remain.
       1. 

          PeterG
          1st October 2023, 1:41

          Maybe there are better formats, I just don’t feel that single lap qualifying is one of them and i also don’t feel that formats I’ve seen used elsewhere that I’ve seen suggested here (One’s used in Indycar or Formula E for example) are either.

          I’m not closed on trying a different format, I’m not necessarily against change in this area. I just don’t see a need to given how none of the alternatives I’ve seen suggested are as good. If someone comes up with something that sounds as good or better then let’s try it, It’s just that nobody has.

          Of all the formats i have seen either in use or suggested i just think what we have now in F1 is vastly superior in virtually every way.

          F1 has changed a lot since the last time single lap qualifying was used. However the same problems that made that format so dull last time remain.

          I know this because i have seen that format used in other categories and i find it just as bad there now as i did in F1 in 03-05. It’s just not a very exciting format or an especially fun spectacle to watch on TV and i can say from experience that such a firmat is even worse when your in the stands.
          1. 

             S
             1st October 2023, 3:32

             Well there you go.
             Not only do I think hotlaps are more interesting and informative to watch (from any viewing location or method), I also think that no matter how good the current qualifying system is, that doesn’t necessitate it being the only one in use at all times forever.
             And yes, I’ve seen all of F1’s qualifying formats over the last 40 years, and also those used in many other series over the same period of time.
19. 

    Jimmy Cliff
    30th September 2023, 14:41

    The current qualifying system is perfect – it is entertaining to watch and provides equal opportunities with option to wait last minute with traffic or go earlier with no traffic.

    Also the 3 separate sessions make it more exciting than just 1 hour long free for all.

    So PLEASE PLEASE do not change anything – also not continue with the mandatory hard-medium-soft usage of tires.

    3x 1 hour practice, qualifying and then main race. Get rid of sprint and point for FLAP.
20. 

    Dusty
    30th September 2023, 15:08

    Q1 has too many cars on track trying to start a lap in the last minute of the session, could be fixed by splitting into 2 groups. Put 1 driver of each team into each group based on championship standings. 10 minutes should be enough. Top 6 of each group goes to Q2.

    Q2 is another 10 minutes, 12 cars trying to get into Q3, top 6 move forward.

    Q3 is a 1 lap format, slowest to fastest based on Q2. Track evolution from start to end is minimal and the advantage is earned from Q2 performance. Drivers will take risks as at least a row 3 start is secured anyway.

    Call this the 666 format. External factors can affect Q1 and Q3, eg rain, but there’s damage limitation in place, bad luck can at worst cost 5 positions in Q3, and 4 or 5 positions while merging Q1a and Q1b knocked out results, depending on the number of teams on the grid.

    One lap shootouts can be very exciting, it’s just not worth doing it for the whole grid, first 3 rows is just right.
    It’s also a great opportunity to display technology on screen with real time lap comparison on Q3, ghost cars, head to head time delta, apex speeds, top speeds, braking point distance, ERS deployment, opportunity to display as much real time info as their tech sponsor can process, but hopefully not all of the above at the same time.

    Either we get an exciting Quali session and the fastest car earns pole, or drama takes over (with damage limitation) and we’re set up for an exciting race on Sunday.
    1. 

       Alesici
       1st October 2023, 7:31

       I like this proposed format. It’s very well balanced and think it would work well.
       I hate the way currently we don’t get to see the full laps and just watch the cars cross the timing line, so having at least an element of single lap qualifying would fix that whilst keeping it pretty fair. Personally I’d like a full grid session of single lap qual, but it seems that it’s only me and ‘S’ who want it that extreme.
       It’d be curious to see how the teams strategically deal with a situation of rain being forecast for the end of Q3. They would aim to ‘just’ lose but not get eliminated in order to finish 6th and be the first Q3 runner.
21. 

    Ajaxn
    30th September 2023, 16:12

    The worst aspect of qualifying is where slow cars impead the cars on a faster run. If they could find a way to prevent that, then i would be a way forwards. For example, a timed release of the cars, initially to warm up, and then released at specific intervals to do their qualifying runs. This would be done for Q1 and Q2 when the most cars are usually on the circuit, with the cars put into pools chosen at random. You could have Q1 with 4 four pools, with only one pool on track at any one time.
22. 

    Apophis (@apophisjj)
    30th September 2023, 17:56

    Q1 and Q2 stays exactly the same, but Q3 is 1 lap shoot-out going from slowest to fastest time set in Q2. IMO that would be the ideal quali format.
    1. 

       PeterG
       1st October 2023, 1:51

       @apophisjj Q3 been a top 10 one lap would be just as boring as the whole session been one lap as it would still feature all of the same negatives.

       And it would take away the most exciting part of the existing format which is those last laps where the final moments of qualifying always tend to be the best as each car crosses the line and times/positions change multiple times in those last seconds.

       With a one lap format you get less action and nearly always lose what we have now where the tension and excitement builds to a crescendo at the end.

       You also still then have the issue of track evolution and changeable weather which can also make any type of one lap format a lottery and even more dull.

       You send the fastest car last he’s getting the best conditions. You send him first then the end of qualifying been slower cars that even with better track conditions aren’t a threat for pole and you’ve taken away the excitement of qualifying.

       It’s a format that simply never works and is only still used elsewhere for tradition or necessity in the case of ovals. It’s never a format thats introduced because anyone thinks it’s better.
23. 

    Electroball76
    30th September 2023, 19:06

    We need a new system. We all line up on the grid with the oldest at the front to the youngest at the back.
    No?
    How about alphabetically by last name?

Comments are closed.